+1 to non-rakeback gaming. I'm voting for as low rake as possible. Interested in FL.
And see a mistype at sceenshot: "foled" in "Dealer Chat" window.
rakeback IS low rake.
That's not true. Rakeback is rake already paid. It's better to not charge it froM the beginning because recreational people who won't have rakeback (and don't tell me about flat rakeback because that's the worst thing ever) is charged, diminishing their balances for no reason at all (at least for nothing that benefits them). Your statement is actually pretty nonsense, no offense :/ But it's an absurd comparation.
A rakeback system such as is implemented by PokerStars (although it is not called rakeback, players do indeed get a portion of their rake-back through various means; and I do view it as rakeback when I calculate my overall ROI) I feel is the best avenue to go.. Promotes healthy games and keeps money within the system.
That is true, +1
It's better to not charge it from the beginning because recreational people who won't have rakeback is charged, diminishing their balances for no reason at all (at least for nothing that benefits them)
I'm operating from the standpoint where all players get some form of rake back either in points, freerolls, etc etc... And if a truly traditional rakeback system was implemented, and the recreational player did indeed miss out, what's wrong with him paying rake and investors profiting??? "Games will dry up faster and it's bad for the ecosystem" perhaps, but do you have any research to support this?.. Not from my experience. From my experience the recreational degenerate isn't even conscious of how much they lose to rake and are more than happy to go into debt to refill their balances due to their gambling addiction.
I do believe at the beginning however, rake should be extremely low or non-existent to provide a competitive edge within the market.
Do not offer flat rakeback like 30%. People know they will always have the same so no incentives for playing more or less, people will play the same as 0% rakeback (almost). Rakeback is based on achievements and gaps between levels (like at PokerStars, from 2x% to 3x% to 4x% depending on your vip level).
You should have freerolls, t-shirts (as rakeback) or other stuff like that. This can be from the beginning even if you want (though I would suggest to add only very basic stuff like NXT T-shirts and freerolls specially, but not much more). What I'm saying is do not create a full system based on rakeback like Supernova on PokerStars. This system is created in order to mantain people playing for one year. At the beginning, what is needed is people playing (therefore, lots of freerolls as they play for free, NXT T-shirts to show how cool you are, key rings, etc).
Recreational player don't know how much they lose. That's true. But that doesn't matter at all. I assume someone raking like crazy (imagine a regular who plays 3hours per day) will have higher rakeback than someone playing once per week (otherwise we are back to flat rakeback and therefore, no incentives, bad). So, let's say you have a full ecosystem working here. Recreational players won't realise they pay Xbb/100 of rake and won't care at all. However, sum up 1000 recreational players. Assuming your rake is Xbbs/100, maybe they lose about (I make this up because it depends on number of hands/stakes they play) 100$ rake per month each one. That's 100.000$. If your rake is 0.7xbb/100, they are only losing 70.000$. Ok, individually they will never know they have got 30k$ back. But from an ecology point of view, they have 30k$ more to play, split into 1000 people. That's a shit loads of money. Don't underestime that because they are the only ones who will keep the games running. Without recreational players, no games. Regulars will rarely play without them. So by lowering rake only 30%, you won lots of money and much better ecology system.
Of course, the problem is that poker room will receive less money as they are charging less. Well, here is where you need to find an equilibrium, ofc. It's not easy. However, pay more rake in order to offer more rakeback is a mistake because this only goes to regulars (as newbies won't really have/shouldn't have proper rakeback) and recreationals (overall) lose money faster and therefore, quit the game sooner = regs can't play. And all of this behind recreationals back.
Summing up:
Do not increase rake to offer more rakeback (I'm not saying you shouldn't offer it at all, but that it should be minimum)
Your poker room will work depending on how many DEPOSITS you have -nothing else than that- therefore, most of your efforts need (specially initially) to be focused on this
Small rakeback focused on recreationals is ++++. Offer lots of freerolls even for cents, just for fun. NXT T-shirts, poker-room t-shirts, key rings, cups, whatever you can think of which is cheap but people would like to have/show off. People like to brag about their skills, offer them this possibility. Forget about difficult vip systems for regulars. What you need is people depositing, regulars come along afterwards
If you have recreational players, you will have regulars. You will scarcely need to call them
At that moment, you can add rakeback vip system or w/e in order to encourage them to keep playing so they achieve the next status/higher rakeback/blabla
Low rakeback (as long as it's enough to keep the company running) is better because allows recreational players to last longer playing, as a group
I attach a picture that may clarify all of this (forget about the tax point, I did it for the spanish market):
Hints: Italian/French/Spanish market are going down and down because of high rakeback (due to tax imposition) and are losing more and more market for 2-3 years in a row (and has never been positive).
You can read a bit more about poker ecology here (use google translate, ask questions if you have):
http://theultimatemind.com/2012/05/29/como-las-salas-de-poquer-online-ganan-dinero-ecologia-del-poquer-y-mas-parte-i/ and here
http://theultimatemind.com/2012/05/30/como-las-salas-de-poquer-online-ganan-dinero-en-espana-ecologia-del-poquer-y-mas-parte-ii/An option could be to try to gain mass adoption (like zynga poker, people playing for fun and free maybe) and then switch to "real money games". What you need, again, is people enjoying yor poker game and planning to deposit sooner or later. If you have an audience of a few thousand players playing for fun shouldn't be that difficult and the process will be more natural. Otherwise, with no affiliates bringing you people, it will be harder.
I'm a bit busy this month because I'm getting married by the end of June. However, I offer my help here with whatever you need that can be related to this (vip systems, poker rooms, ecology, blabla). I haven't code for a while so can't do that, but may be able to help in those other areas. Just ask whatever you need and I will try to answer as soon as I can.
PS: Always re-check and think yourself what I say, of course
I've been heavily involved with poker (It's my only income, I play online poker for a living and have been heavily involved with poker schools , magazines, sometimes poker rooms etc), but I may be mistaken, you can proof me wrong
It will be good, it will mean things have been properly thought out (not sure this is the right english expression lol)
Hope it was helpful
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Topic: General info / Development update (Read 13734 times)