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Messages - freeworm

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1
Nxt General Discussion / Re: SuperNET TOKEN from BTER
« on: October 03, 2014, 07:54:34 am »
NXTInspect has been distributed to BTER.com's SuperNET holders based on the UNITY balances.

You can withdrawal your NXTInspect from

https://bter.com/myaccount/withdraw/INSPCT

BTER.com

2
Nxt General Discussion / Re: SuperNET TOKEN from BTER
« on: October 01, 2014, 04:26:40 pm »
First superNET dividend has been paid out. For every hundred superNET, assetholders received 6.127 neoDICE.

BTER has got the neoDICE and distributed to all users based on their UNITY balances.
Please check your DICE balance at
https://bter.com/myaccount

DICE markets are enabled at
https://bter.com/trade/dice_btc
and
https://bter.com/trade/dice_nxt

3
FreeMarket (NXT asset 134138275353332190) is added to BTER's BTC market at 

https://bter.com/trade/mrkt_btc

Deposit

https://bter.com/myaccount/deposit/MRKT .

4
I) I'll loan 6m nxt to bter
II) Bter is free to pay the loan whenever they want. They may keep the NXT for years if they want
III) Bter will pay 0 interest on the loan. They will pay 6m nxt regardless of how much time they take to pay
IV) I'll have no power to demand NXT back from bter. They will return whenever they want, as long as they do return it someday and don't keep it forever. It's a loan and not a donation!

V) Bter will permanently reduce NXT's withdrawal fee to 0% + 1 nxt forever, even after loan is repaid
VI) Bter will permanently reduce Qora's withdrawal fee to 0% + 1 qora forever, even after loan is repaid
VII) Bter will permanently reduce Crypti's withdrawal fee to 0% + 1 crypti forever, even after loan is repaid
VIII) Bter will not raise trading fees on those coins to compensante for loss of revenue due to decreased withdrawal fee

IX) Bter will permanently give me free trading status (0% trading fees, I'll still pay withdrawal fees) forever, even after loan is repaid. Don't worry, I'm not a high frequency trader. I'm just an investor, bter can check my account

X) Bter will permanentely give me forging leasing power of my borrowed nxt, their hot wallet, their cold wallet and any other nxt they have access to forever, even after loan is repaid

Bter will earn many customers from doing this as well since they will be more competitive. Bter will gain their client's confidence again by being 100%+ solvent once more.

Thanks for your offer but we won't take it. We are paying NXT back very fast. We have already finished 2.8m and only 5.5m left now.

5
Nxt Community News and Announcements / Re: BTer hack: the hunt has begun
« on: August 28, 2014, 01:43:43 pm »
A bounty of 20% of the funds got back from the hacker is guaranteed by BTER.

Lin @ BTER

6
@freeworm,

please add a BTSX/NXT trading pair. It will benefit both communities. Thank you.

Added at
https://bter.com/trade/btsx_nxt

7
might be this one: http://www.coinssource.com/bter-exclusive-interview-and-patented-security/
Quote
However, when we tried to get help from forgers to reorg the blockchain, we failed to get 51% power in 720 blocks.
Well, that's at least partly because you changed your mind, and publicly said it wasn't necessary because you had enough on the hacker to go after him.
We monitored  (with the help of one NXT dev) the hashing power from the new clients. It was far from enough to  reorg the blockchain in such a short time. Therefore we changed to a bluffing strategy which didn't work.
Ok... that's understandable. However, you did make that post quite early. I'm in the UK; as I recall, by the time I'd found out that the re-org was a possibility you'd already posted that you didn't want it. That post then undermined the later choices. If you were bluffing; well, you know that, but the Nxt community didn't. I personally was against the re-org, and that's partly because I thought there were other options, including your tracking down the thief. I doubt the re-org would have happened regardless, mainly because of inertia, but there's no way of knowing what would have happened without that post.

There were only few nodes upgraded to the new clients and we were 99% sure the re-org wouldn't happen and we started bluffing.
It was really hard to make the best decision at that time. If I could do it again, I would keep working on the re-org.

8
@freeworm,

please add a BTSX/NXT trading pair. It will benefit both communities. Thank you.

OK, I am going to add it.

9
might be this one: http://www.coinssource.com/bter-exclusive-interview-and-patented-security/
Quote
However, when we tried to get help from forgers to reorg the blockchain, we failed to get 51% power in 720 blocks.
Well, that's at least partly because you changed your mind, and publicly said it wasn't necessary because you had enough on the hacker to go after him.
We monitored  (with the help of one NXT dev) the hashing power from the new clients. It was far from enough to  reorg the blockchain in such a short time. Therefore we changed to a bluffing strategy which didn't work.   

10
For on the deposit page it says now:
"Account Public Key: (shows a long number)
You need the public key for the first deposit."

What does that mean? There is no description of where to put that in.
In the message?

When you send NXT in your NXT client, put your deposit address in the Recipient field first. If a public key is required, "Recipient Public Key" filed will show up.

11
Unfortunately no matter what has happened already happened.
In this case it would be 100% fault of the exchange Bter.
Quote
SSL safe connection
Cold wallet technologies
Google Authenticator
This is whats advertised but you failed with Google Authenticator on nxt server.

You may say that people should be happy they got most back and not 0% but this is completely different situation we are in now.
Right now your reputation is at stake no longer your customer's funds at stake.
Customers should not be forced to pay for the fault of the exchange. I believe bter said somewhere that its all their fault and they will pay for all losses too.


I have idea to solve the situation with bter.

1.Bter should get in contact with big whales and negotiate for a bulk discount with 8mil nxt.

  Pros
This will give good image for bter to customers.
Cons
May not able to find a whale.


2.Bter should reimburse 15% of every account holdings with BTC at a reasonable price. eg @5000-6000 satoshi.

Pros
This should be the best outcome for bter for now. Nxt will not get much cheaper than this and its only going to go up, just slower than normal.
Just take in another 300k loss instead of 500k or 1mil after price surges. Get this off your chest while you can, and concentrate on getting the hacker which you may get 8 million back.

Btc has the liquidity.

This avoids having the trouble to buy up 8mil and cause a price rise on the way which may be expensive for bter.

Watch the nxt economy grow when users choose to buy up with the reimbursed btc, instead of having a constant sell pressure caused by free trading and bter's best interest to have a lower priced nxt, which undervalues nxt in a non healthy growth.

Gain the trust of your customers again. Shows that you are a responsible exchange, where lost money can be paid back.

Cons
Users have to accept btc as reimbursement of lost nxt.

3.Keep going with the current plan BUT don't just make your customers pay for it, give some back for staying loyal on your exchange. Provide incentives like discounted withdrawal/tradings on Nxt for life time like i have already said before. OR somehow pay back the fees your customer is paying at the moment to help you get through the tough times after you have gained back 8mil nxt. Don't just force everyone to pay 3% and forget about them, they are the ones that accepted such fees to help you get through.

I'm in no way saying any of this to harm Bter, i truly am trying to help with my concerns. I really liked the modesty shown by the exchange and i really liked Bter.

What im trying to say is Bter should MAN up and take the big losses, show some responsibility and get your customers back, you are running a multi million dollar business, you have risks of theft just like any other business, lucky for you that its only about 300k left and not the full 2mil or worse like the Gox. Crypto is still very early, and you should keep building your reputation.

Thanks for your advises. We are getting more loans from whales.

12
Bter is officially running a fractional reserve.

U may be wrong. Part of the stolen NXT belonged to BTER (earned thru trading/withdrawal fees). Also, the fact that Pouncer wasn't contacted regarding his loan may mean that BTER already got a loan from another whale.

Yes, we haven't got a chance to reply Pouncer that his way of the loan is a little bit complicated to us. We are considering how to take it.
However, we do get 2m from people who want to help us. We are going to lower the withdrawal fee to 1% soon.

13
Bter is now linking to this topic for news about the fee and stuff. They should have made a news-section in there own website, much more professional and people won't see all the FUD here.

Thanks, we can do that.

14
You talk about security, but why is it that my account is open most of the times? Is het because of cookies or cache? The most exchanges let me login everytime and use the 2FA too.

Just log out when you are done trading. But, that doesn't affect their security, only yours.

That does not affect even user's security. There is still "fund" password that is required for withdrawal.

I understand, but it can be better. I don't want to change my IP, how is that userfriendly? All other exchanges I need to login again after a while, much safer and not a big change for the website.

OK, we are going to add an option to let people choose if they want their browsers to keep their sessions for a while or not.
 

15
NXT withdrawal works now for me.

How about Bter issue assets for the lost 8.3mil of nxt. Bter gets the 8.3 mil. Bter pays dividends + certain % to asset holders (sort of payback). Reduce the withdrawal fees. Might solve the problem? Also gives publicity to nxt ae and a real intro to real business world?

Uhh, great idea. That would also work with the other proposal by Pouncer - he can just buy 4 million worth of that asset.

Great Idea!  :D Just amend it, 4.3M by Pouncer! ;)

We discussed a lot of the virtual asset solution privately. However, it's illegal to issue virtual asset to collect funds from public in China.

Bter,

Please complete your proposal with the time that you return the loan. One year? 6 month? 3 Months? And how? All together? Each month 1m? How?

Considering we offer a 1 month free trading for NXT, how about 6 month? We pay from the end of the 2nd month, 1m per month (1.3m last month).

16
NXT withdrawal works now for me.

How about Bter issue assets for the lost 8.3mil of nxt. Bter gets the 8.3 mil. Bter pays dividends + certain % to asset holders (sort of payback). Reduce the withdrawal fees. Might solve the problem? Also gives publicity to nxt ae and a real intro to real business world?

Uhh, great idea. That would also work with the other proposal by Pouncer - he can just buy 4 million worth of that asset.

Great Idea!  :D Just amend it, 4.3M by Pouncer! ;)

We discussed a lot of the virtual asset solution privately. However, it's illegal to issue virtual asset to collect funds from public in China.

17
Temporary Loan to Bter


I propose that 2 or 3 larger stakeholders collectively put together 8.3M NXT and loan it to Bter on the following conditions:-
  • Bter immediately reduces NXT withdrawal fee to zero
  • Maintain zero NXT trading fees until loan is repaid
  • Offer some sort of collectoral/security to the creditors
I am prepared to contribute 4.3M NXT to the loan package.


What do you folks think? Any other takers?
If we can do this asap, things can return to normality straight away.

Thanks for your offer. If you can loan us 4.3m NXT, we can lower the withdraw fee to 0.5%(gradually reduced to 0.0%) and offer you a 1 year free-trading account.


18
You people complaining are funny. Don't you realize that bter runs on fractional NXT reserve right now? There is also no way to accumulate the missing NXT on any market. So stfu or propose a solution.

We collect fees from all markets, not only the NXT market, and buy NXT back by using the fees.

19
Thanks a lot for your comment CfB I really appreciate it and feel honored that you have quoted me in this thread.

What I suggest is that you pay Lin 8m Nxt so that Bter can recover more quickly without charging a 3% withdrawal fee on their users. What do you think about that? I can ask Lin for his Nxt address :)

No, we refuse it. It's not his fault, instead, CFB  helped us a lot in technical supports from the beginning for launching NXT on Bter and in this event.

20
So, let me get this straight: NXT gets stolen from you exchange (by your own "carelessness"). You pay a lot to get most of it back and now you want the NXT users to reimburse you for your loss of the missing 8.3 million NXT? What's not right in this picture?

It is a loss of your exchange (as a whole) and should be paid (if at all) by every user of your exchange.

Btw: do you have enough NXT in your accounts for everyone to withdraw?

Sorry for what have happened to all our users during this event, we are going to provider better service and lower fee in the future for compensation.

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