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Author Topic: [ANN] NeoDICE - asset 18184274154437352348 issuer NXT-XRK4-5HYK-5965-9FH4Z  (Read 32112 times)

a7594li

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It's my pleasure,I like it very much,My interest is to help more people.Thanks for jl777's generous tip.

@allwelder OK,I will do my best.
LOWER FEES TO 0.1NXT PLS (:

skywave

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Quote
NeoDICE ASSET:

100% of revenues will be distributed to assetholders.

I apologize but I'm a bit confused?
How do I get hold of the NeoDICE asset? I don't see an ID in the OP?

edit: oohhhh my bad - it's in the thread header :)
NXT-M888-3RBA-HVWZ-CV4YY

skywave

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hmmm - is it not possible to buy any of these assets yet (NXT AE)?
I see a few buy orders - but no sell orders - or even an asset price?
NXT-M888-3RBA-HVWZ-CV4YY

jl777

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hmmm - is it not possible to buy any of these assets yet (NXT AE)?
I see a few buy orders - but no sell orders - or even an asset price?
you will have to wait until the dividend goes out, but it cant go out until a lot more TOKEN is redeemed for SuperNET
There are over 1000 people in SuperNET slack! http://slackinvite.supernet.org/ automatically sends you an invite

I am just a simple C programmer

whatnxt

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Away till late Monday.

There are 98'894 unredeemed TOKEN assets so that is 6000+ NeoDICE assets that will be donated to valarmg as the dividend account will receive the NeoDICE dividend

I am sure valarmg wont mind if you delay your redemption of TOKEN <-> SuperNET

If you have TOKEN on NXT AE, send it to: NXT-7Y5B-J8LQ-SL5P-3ULFL (alias: RedeemTOKEN)
It will be converted to SuperNET and sent back to your account within 24 hours. It is done via a manual process run by valarmg

The dividend can happen at any time, no complaints if you miss your dividend due to delay converting TOKEN


James
NXT-UAPC-3T43-FFT6-HW5BZ

skywave

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hmmm - is it not possible to buy any of these assets yet (NXT AE)?
I see a few buy orders - but no sell orders - or even an asset price?
you will have to wait until the dividend goes out, but it cant go out until a lot more TOKEN is redeemed for SuperNET

thx jl777.

but still - maybe I'm a bit thick-skulled so I don't quite understand this with NeoDICE. Is it like this:

For now a NeoDICE asset has no price/value.
I own UNITY assets (converted from TOKENs).
Once the remaining TOKENs are converted the dividend for the UNITY assets will run for the first time.
The dividend is the NeoDICE function.
Once the NeoDICE function has been used first time it will be available to buy as a NeoDICE asset on the NXT AE at a pre-determined base price.

Maybe I clutter up with this?
I belong in the very old end of the human age-group - yet I am very much into everything crypto and digital currency - but can sometimes find it daunting to get an overview.


« Last Edit: September 28, 2014, 08:46:17 am by skywave »
NXT-M888-3RBA-HVWZ-CV4YY

jl777

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hmmm - is it not possible to buy any of these assets yet (NXT AE)?
I see a few buy orders - but no sell orders - or even an asset price?
you will have to wait until the dividend goes out, but it cant go out until a lot more TOKEN is redeemed for SuperNET

thx jl777.

but still - maybe I'm a bit thick-skulled so I don't quite understand this with NeoDICE. Is it like this:

For now a NeoDICE asset has no price/value.
I own UNITY assets (converted from TOKENs).
Once the remaining TOKENs are converted the dividend for the UNITY assets will run for the first time.
The dividend is the NeoDICE function.
Once the NeoDICE function has been used first time it will be available to buy as a NeoDICE asset on the NXT AE at a pre-determined base price.

Maybe I clutter up with this?
I belong in the very old end of the human age-group - yet I am very much into everything crypto and digital currency - but can sometimes find it daunting to get an overview.
close, but what will happen is that when enough people have redeemed the TOKEN for SuperNET, I can do a NeoDICE dividend without too much screaming or being called names. Clearly if I did it now, many will be angry at me as TOKEN wont get any dividend, but SuperNET/UNITY will

so, this is strong motivation for people to redeem.

The NeoDICE will be like the Atomic and Freemarket where the NXTventure dividend was the first time it starts trading. So the market will set the price. This way, I dont have to worry about making any mistakes on setting the price. The market will pay what it will pay.

So, if you have UNITY, you will get some NeoDICE without doing anything. Once you have it, you can sell it or HODL

James
There are over 1000 people in SuperNET slack! http://slackinvite.supernet.org/ automatically sends you an invite

I am just a simple C programmer

skywave

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hmmm - is it not possible to buy any of these assets yet (NXT AE)?
I see a few buy orders - but no sell orders - or even an asset price?
you will have to wait until the dividend goes out, but it cant go out until a lot more TOKEN is redeemed for SuperNET

thx jl777.

but still - maybe I'm a bit thick-skulled so I don't quite understand this with NeoDICE. Is it like this:

For now a NeoDICE asset has no price/value.
I own UNITY assets (converted from TOKENs).
Once the remaining TOKENs are converted the dividend for the UNITY assets will run for the first time.
The dividend is the NeoDICE function.
Once the NeoDICE function has been used first time it will be available to buy as a NeoDICE asset on the NXT AE at a pre-determined base price.

Maybe I clutter up with this?
I belong in the very old end of the human age-group - yet I am very much into everything crypto and digital currency - but can sometimes find it daunting to get an overview.
close, but what will happen is that when enough people have redeemed the TOKEN for SuperNET, I can do a NeoDICE dividend without too much screaming or being called names. Clearly if I did it now, many will be angry at me as TOKEN wont get any dividend, but SuperNET/UNITY will

so, this is strong motivation for people to redeem.

The NeoDICE will be like the Atomic and Freemarket where the NXTventure dividend was the first time it starts trading. So the market will set the price. This way, I dont have to worry about making any mistakes on setting the price. The market will pay what it will pay.

So, if you have UNITY, you will get some NeoDICE without doing anything. Once you have it, you can sell it or HODL

James

aha thx - much clearer to me now :)

regarding all the bashing I see you are getting I feel sry for you - hope you are strong enough to cope?
It amazes me that people cannot see the visions you have  - and all the other developers/inventors within the industry for that matter.
Why can't people understand that we are on the threshold of changing how finance and economy will be working in the future, taking us away from the current corrupt systems all over the planet?
And that investing in this is a long term investment which will pay of eventually!

Just keep up the good work - it's a winner!
NXT-M888-3RBA-HVWZ-CV4YY

joseginxt

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I have UNITY in Bter but withdrawall is disabled: are we going to receive the dividend in Bter? what is it necessary to do?

jl777

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I have UNITY in Bter but withdrawall is disabled: are we going to receive the dividend in Bter? what is it necessary to do?
just wait, dividend will appear automatically, at least that is what I want to verify
There are over 1000 people in SuperNET slack! http://slackinvite.supernet.org/ automatically sends you an invite

I am just a simple C programmer

joseginxt

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I have UNITY in Bter but withdrawall is disabled: are we going to receive the dividend in Bter? what is it necessary to do?
just wait, dividend will appear automatically, at least that is what I want to verify

I thought that only dividends are received at the Asset Exchange.

Luck in the project and thank you very much for the quick response.

jl777

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I have UNITY in Bter but withdrawall is disabled: are we going to receive the dividend in Bter? what is it necessary to do?
just wait, dividend will appear automatically, at least that is what I want to verify

I thought that only dividends are received at the Asset Exchange.

Luck in the project and thank you very much for the quick response.
yes, but bter has the asset on its internal account, so they will get a single dividend for all their customers. then they can allocate it by their customer's balances. this is why I want to test this now, so in the future it is reliable

there could very well be some issues and if it happens now, I dont think it is so bad, if it happened three months from now I can just hear all the screaming

James
There are over 1000 people in SuperNET slack! http://slackinvite.supernet.org/ automatically sends you an invite

I am just a simple C programmer

whatnxt

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However, I can promise to not dividend out before Tuesday. If anybody else needs more time, we can certainly make arrangements, but manually processing 100+ dividends is a lot of work and my goal is to get all the TOKEN redeemed as soon as possible

James

Thanks for this  :)
NXT-UAPC-3T43-FFT6-HW5BZ

rdanneskjoldr

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I think the % taken for the house should be studied further, as it will be key in NeoDice acceptance by users. I find the 2% too high. If for example just-dice has a 1% fee, maybe people will still gamble there even if Neodice service is better.

In gambling it seems you get more money the higher the rake is, but i dont see it that way, as the result is often the same after a big sample of plays from the user perspective: 100% of the money  lost. People use to think they just got unlucky on the last play, but it is just their EV ( equity value) materializing.

The only difference is that the longer the user plays, the experience will be more grateful, and the feeling of almost succeeding to win is bigger. More minutes of fun too, so they will be tempted to gamble more in the future. If you take all their money in 5 minutes, there isnt any satisfaction for the user.


This is a simulation of 100 plays with the EV of betting your whole stake starting with 1000 units.



It may seem you win more money the higher the rake is, but with a big enough sample, this is what i meant with the final result is always the same. Graph of 500 plays :



You are taking all the money anyway, but you give the user a bigger number of plays = more time of fun = closer feeling of almost winning
In a business where you have operational costs for that, you have to balance it, but here i dont think having a user making 100 more plays has any cost for NeoDice.

That is why i think it is a good idea to lower the rake to at least 1%. I would do it even lower, but then you also have to calculate the possibility of starting with a bad streak as the house and having to pay too much money for users. As the lower the edge for NeoDice is , the bigger chance of this happening. But in the long term with very big volume, this is no problem.


Is there a chance asset holders could vote on this? If the accounts with a huge % find what asset holders voted reasonable they can follow it. If it isnt so close they can always decide as developers still weight for 45%+ of the asset.
« Last Edit: September 28, 2014, 02:37:41 pm by rdanneskjoldr »

TwinWinNerD

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How is the bankroll of neoDICE composed?

What kelly-criterion is used for Bankrollmanagement?

Are the users able to invest?

javi618

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hat is why i think it is a good idea to lower the rake to at least 1%. I would do it even lower, but then you also have to calculate the possibility of starting with a bad streak as the house and having to pay too much money for users. As the lower the edge for NeoDice is , the bigger chance of this happening. But in the long term with very big volume, this is no problem.


Is there a chance asset holders could vote on this? If the accounts with a huge % find what asset holders voted reasonable they can follow it. If it isnt so close they can always decide as developers still weight for 45%+ of the asset.

+1 to 1% fee or lower. 2% is just too high.

damon

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Jimmy2011

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It seems that JL777 sent tips to the translators from the shares owned by PrivateBet. The translation should be the developers & maintainers' work, so personally I think it should be covered by the shares owned by the developers & maintainers (45%).


Initial distribution of shares:
5% NXTventure dividend, 5% SuperNET dividend, 45% Developers & maintainers, 40% Privatebet, 5% JLH


P.S. I just updated the translation for the phrase "know-how": https://nxtforum.org/index.php?topic=5624.msg108736#msg108736

NXT-LX5G-L63N-ST8S-9LVZY

TwinWinNerD

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It seems that JL777 sent tips to the translators from the shares owned by PrivateBet. The translation should be the developers & maintainers' work, so personally I think it should be covered by the shares owned by the developers & maintainers (45%).


Initial distribution of shares:
5% NXTventure dividend, 5% SuperNET dividend, 45% Developers & maintainers, 40% Privatebet, 5% JLH


P.S. I just updated the translation for the phrase "know-how": https://nxtforum.org/index.php?topic=5624.msg108736#msg108736



How much was paid as dividend?

If it is small, it doesn't really matter.

hash

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[...]That is why i think it is a good idea to lower the rake to at least 1%. I would do it even lower, but then you also have to calculate the possibility of starting with a bad streak as the house and having to pay too much money for users. As the lower the edge for NeoDice is , the bigger chance of this happening. But in the long term with very big volume, this is no problem.


Thanks rdanneskjoldr, very interesting observation.

Our expertise lies in coding and design, not in gaming theory, so we're learning on the way and appreciate any input.
The 2% was picked just because it was the house edge of (highly successful) SatoshiDice. We'll consider the reduction of it to 1%. A few simulations must be run first. Thanks again for the pointer.

On a slightly different topic, what do you (or others here) think would be a good range and gradation of the odds?
SatoshiDice for example has 15 steps of odds : payout, going from 97.6% : x1.004 down to 3% : x32, having two thirds of the steps in the lower than 50% range.
Do you think 10 steps could be enough? Do you think payout (multiplication) lower than x2 and higher than x100 is needed?

Thanks -)
« Last Edit: September 28, 2014, 08:21:33 pm by hash »
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