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Author Topic: NRS v1.6.2  (Read 90447 times)

Bitinvestor

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Re: NRS v1.6.2
« Reply #200 on: November 08, 2015, 08:00:20 am »

I've read through the transcript and the takeaway message for me is that Jean-Luc doesn't think it's practical for jl777 to abandon NXT and thus he says it's my way or the highway. Sorry, but that's no way to run a project.
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Seccour

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Re: NRS v1.6.2
« Reply #201 on: November 08, 2015, 08:02:03 am »

but show some respect, after everything J-L has done for NXT.

No respect at all. They started DECENTRALIZED project and now they are trying to change rules, to change the future of NXT blockchain.

What the hell this things have to do with decentralization ? Nothing block you from forking the blockchain or start your own client or both.
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pianist

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Re: NRS v1.6.2
« Reply #202 on: November 08, 2015, 08:10:12 am »

Nxt is at the current state not a hardcoded protocol like bitcoin and nothing is really set in stone.

You are 100% right, that's why NXT capitalization will be $70K soon. Not $700K, not $7M as today.

No protocol, no rfc, no reliability => $70K at coinmarketcap.com
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pianist

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Re: NRS v1.6.2
« Reply #203 on: November 08, 2015, 08:19:27 am »

Nothing block you from forking the blockchain or start your own client or both.

Are you serious?

NXT capitalization = code price (1%) + blockchain reliability * value stored there (99%).

Before changing something in NXT protocol, you should talk with top-20 NXT assets:
http://nxtreporting.com/

If jl777 moves his assets to other platform, NXT capitalization will be less than $1M.
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crimi

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Re: NRS v1.6.2
« Reply #204 on: November 08, 2015, 08:21:35 am »

Nxt is at the current state not a hardcoded protocol like bitcoin and nothing is really set in stone.

You are 100% right, that's why NXT capitalization will be $70K soon. Not $700K, not $7M as today.

No protocol, no rfc, no reliability => $70K at coinmarketcap.com

It is really hard to implement new standards(protocols) in the real world. At the current overall state of Nxt we will fail to get new developers, users and investment thats the truth.
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coinomat

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Re: NRS v1.6.2
« Reply #205 on: November 08, 2015, 08:28:59 am »

You guys basically nullify efforts of very many people
I can't divulge here everything, but we were really close to major investment in NXT platform by a huge payment provider trading at NYSE.
Current FUD is killing it. You kill it.
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lopalcar

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Re: NRS v1.6.2
« Reply #206 on: November 08, 2015, 08:30:26 am »

Many people here is disappointing me really hard this morning  :(

It's really so difficult update the api code? Does anyone understand that is a need for boost performance?
Anyways, why the fuck is people complaining when 1.6.2 isn't a mandatory release? Why projects don't stay in 1.5.15 till they update everything needed? They are running multimillion dollar business and expect a fucking plug and play system without previous testing? Come on... NXT is intended to be change and evolution...

Do you really prefer bitcoin method? Don't change anything and start becoming unusable with 1MB full blocks?

In addition, nxt is a protocol, if someone really need some api for any reason, I doubt that keeping that api will modify the protocol, he can always run nodes with that api and use the same blockchain "although I suppose is much easy update the project code".
Once again, stop this nonsense and continue improving. If this changes are necessary for future releases, it's fine to make them.

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lopalcar

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Re: NRS v1.6.2
« Reply #207 on: November 08, 2015, 08:31:40 am »

You guys basically nullify efforts of very many people
I can't divulge here everything, but we were really close to major investment in NXT platform by a huge payment provider trading at NYSE.
Current FUD is killing it. You kill it.

Very, very sad what is going on...
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coinomat

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Re: NRS v1.6.2
« Reply #208 on: November 08, 2015, 08:51:10 am »

very simple question:
WHY DON'T PUT UP A POLL FOR  CLIENT CHANGES LIKE THIS ONE?
Why is there voting system at all ??

MAKE A GODDAMN VOTING!!!
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XIII

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Re: NRS v1.6.2
« Reply #209 on: November 08, 2015, 08:57:03 am »

+1 Voting!
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Jean-Luc

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Re: NRS v1.6.2
« Reply #210 on: November 08, 2015, 09:00:17 am »

@Jean-Luc
is there a need to change the db backend soon or do you think you can handle the growing
query complexity (which are expensive ofc) still with H2 for a while?
We are staying with H2 for now, we don't have the development resources to work on migration to PostgreSQL for example, and also any non-java database that requires a separate installation will make it more complicated for desktop users. We have been testing the beta version of H2, 1.4, and it has better performance, but I prefer to wait until it is declared stable before upgrading to it.
Quote
what about an efficient pruning strategy or perhaps fine granulated api call restrictions,
granted via config file on open nodes?
The real pruning is planned for 2.0 on the roadmap, but we haven't even started working on that yet. For pruning only of data which the blockchain itself doesn't need, i.e. messages, we want to encourage users to switch from permanent to prunable messages, and this is why after improving the support for prunable data a lot in the 1.6 release, in 1.7 we want to adjust message fees and size limits accordingly to motivate such switch.
Configurable API call restrictions, yes, this is a feature I have also thought of, but first need to see demand for it, and also will take some development time.
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Jean-Luc

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Re: NRS v1.6.2
« Reply #211 on: November 08, 2015, 09:11:15 am »

.. this issue has not been raised on 1.6.0e and following experimental releases because the API has not been depricated. It was still functional as before ..
- if this is true then it is VERY strange and unacceptable.

Jean-Luc, is this true?
The APIs in question have never been deprecated. The change is about the default values only. When the include parameters are supplied, both 1.5 and 1.6 behave the same, and a client of the API updated to be compatible with 1.6 continues to be compatible with 1.5.

The work on changing the default values of include parameters, or adding them where missing, was started in 1.6.1e and there was an "incompatible changes" section in the 1.6.1e changelog. My mistake is that when continuing this work in 1.6.2, there was no "incompatible" warning. Also, the APIs affected by the changes were identified as "all APIs that accept optional "include" parameters to retrieve additional data, e.g. includeCounts, includeAssetInfo, includeCurrencyInfo, and so on", instead of listing all of them specifically, which I agree makes the consequences less obvious.
 
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coinomat

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Re: NRS v1.6.2
« Reply #212 on: November 08, 2015, 09:14:37 am »

.. this issue has not been raised on 1.6.0e and following experimental releases because the API has not been depricated. It was still functional as before ..
- if this is true then it is VERY strange and unacceptable.

Jean-Luc, is this true?
The APIs in question have never been deprecated. The change is about the default values only. When the include parameters are supplied, both 1.5 and 1.6 behave the same, and a client of the API updated to be compatible with 1.6 continues to be compatible with 1.5.

The work on changing the default values of include parameters, or adding them where missing, was started in 1.6.1e and there was an "incompatible changes" section in the 1.6.1e changelog. My mistake is that when continuing this work in 1.6.2, there was no "incompatible" warning. Also, the APIs affected by the changes were identified as "all APIs that accept optional "include" parameters to retrieve additional data, e.g. includeCounts, includeAssetInfo, includeCurrencyInfo, and so on", instead of listing all of them specifically, which I agree makes the consequences less obvious.
I propose to vote on significant new features and API changes
That would eliminate FUD for good.
Are you against this? Please clarify.

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allwelder

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Re: NRS v1.6.2
« Reply #213 on: November 08, 2015, 09:16:39 am »

We need a current centralized DEV Team to fast the development of NXT(make changes as many as needed),like BITCOIN and ETH did.
This will make progress of NXT much more efficient.

But at the same time,Devs should make clear pre-announce about these detailed changes to all related projects based on NXT.
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coinomat

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Re: NRS v1.6.2
« Reply #214 on: November 08, 2015, 09:19:22 am »

We need a current centralized DEV Team to fast the development of NXT(make changes as many as needed),like BITCOIN and ETH did.
This will make progress of NXT much more efficient.

But at the same time,Devs should make clear pre-announce about these detailed changes to all related projects based on NXT.
Just to be clear about the general opinion here
are you against voting on new features?
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Jean-Luc

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Re: NRS v1.6.2
« Reply #215 on: November 08, 2015, 09:23:33 am »

I propose to vote on significant new features
Yes, but how the votes should be weighted to accurately reflect the need for, and the benefits/cost ratio for the new feature is the tricky question.
Quote
and API changes
No. Design by voting doesn't work.
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XIII

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Re: NRS v1.6.2
« Reply #216 on: November 08, 2015, 09:26:47 am »

The vote ID is: 16515047395218679516

So, please, the first and very simple vote. Let democracy will win. Take 1 NXT and show prudence.
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coinomat

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Re: NRS v1.6.2
« Reply #217 on: November 08, 2015, 09:27:50 am »

I propose to vote on significant new features
Yes, but how the votes should be weighted to accurately reflect the need for, and the benefits/cost ratio for the new feature is the tricky question.
Quote
and API changes
No. Design by voting doesn't work.
You propose changes, as the lead dev
and community votes. Very normal process in my opinion.
For example:
as I understand you want to implement coin shuffling in future
I think that could kill NXT. That should definitely be decided on by the whole community.
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crimi

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Re: NRS v1.6.2
« Reply #218 on: November 08, 2015, 09:34:25 am »

You propose changes, as the lead dev
and community votes. Very normal process in my opinion.
For example:
as I understand you want to implement coin shuffling in future
I think that could kill NXT. That should definitely be decided on by the whole community.


https://nxtportal.org/polls/2751730409036026521 ?

https://nxtforum.org/general-discussion/coin-shuffling-design-decision/
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allwelder

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Re: NRS v1.6.2
« Reply #219 on: November 08, 2015, 09:35:54 am »

We need a current centralized DEV Team to fast the development of NXT(make changes as many as needed),like BITCOIN and ETH did.
This will make progress of NXT much more efficient.

But at the same time,Devs should make clear pre-announce about these detailed changes to all related projects based on NXT.
Just to be clear about the general opinion here
are you against voting on new features?
No,I just mean a general solution.

And if with vote can solve,this will be best and satisfied for both party.
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