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Nxt Discussion => Nxt Community News and Announcements => Topic started by: freeworm on August 16, 2014, 06:49:14 pm

Title: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: freeworm on August 16, 2014, 06:49:14 pm
Update: Aug. 17 2014: As you can see in our wallet, We have got most NXT back except the last 8m. The hacker disappeared again before we finish the new deal with him. We are still working on it for the left 8m. Will keep you updated. 

-------------------------------------

Hello everyone,

I won't repeat all the regrets we have and I just let you know the thee solution we can do:


1) Another 200 BTC offer to the hacker from Bter to get back the left 46m NXT
2) 310 BTC bounty    (including the 110 BTC we sent to the hacker already) from Bter for hunting him
3) Fork using Jean-Luc 's v1.2.5f  at

https://nxtforum.org/nrs-releases/nrs-v1-2-5f/ (https://nxtforum.org/nrs-releases/nrs-v1-2-5f/)

we cover users loss and promise to invest 200 BTC on NXT if this fork win

In new fork the hacked account is blocked so he won't dump any NXT to anywhere.

We have to win the 1.2.5 network before  block 213000. Now 1.2.5 is at 211035, 1.2.5f is at 210440 .

If we win,  Jean-Luc will integrate it into the main release.

Please check Jean-Luc's explanation on this fork at:

https://nxtforum.org/index.php?topic=4444.msg84391#msg84391 (https://nxtforum.org/index.php?topic=4444.msg84391#msg84391)



You don't have to choose one of them.
In the first place, if the hacker agree we can do the first solution and give him 200 BTC for the left NXT.
If not, people who catches him get the 310 BTC bounty if we stay on 1.2.5 network

Fork is an option. We can call off it if one of the first two works, but we have to do it now if we want to win.
I encourage everyone to run the 1.2.5f now to make sure we still have a choice if the first 2 solutions wouldn't work.


Hacker, if you want to take the 200BTC deal, please send us NXT messages. We can do it 20 by 20 this time but you go first. Or we can do is with escrow by Come-from-Beyond or someone we can all trust.
Come-from-Beyond, would you please post a escrow NXT address you hold for receiving the hacker's NXT? We will send him 200 BTC when you get the 46M NXT. You can return all the NXT back to him if we failed to do it.

If you 1.2.5f doesn't sync, use this trick:

edit this file:
nxt/conf/nxt-default.properties
find
maxNumberOfConnectedPublicPeers
set it to 1000 or more so that you can see all the nodes


We need NXT coders for the next release. Please contact us if you are and willing to help.


Best,
Lin @ Bter
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: S3MKi on August 16, 2014, 06:52:52 pm
i'm in. let's do it 1.2.5f

edit: but i think 200btc to hacker better if you and he will make deal fast and we will not wait till 213000.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Come-from-Beyond on August 16, 2014, 06:52:59 pm
I propose free escrow service to do option 1.

This is how it should be done:

1. I publish my BTC and NXT accounts
2. BTER sends 200 BTC to my BTC account (after that it doesn't control these coins)
3. We are waiting for a reply from the hacker (24 hours), the reply must be a public message with his BTC account from NXT-8WJ7-8A2H-MBYN-3W9K4 to my NXT account
4. The hacker sends 46'662'000 NXT to my account
5. I send 200 BTC to his BTC account
6. I send 46+ M NXT to BTER cold wallet that already got 5 M NXT

So, if the hacker trusts me we could do it this way (the 200 BTC are not mine anyway if he worries that I could break the deal).
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: wesley on August 16, 2014, 06:53:51 pm
Option nr 1 is the only viable option.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: domsch on August 16, 2014, 06:56:55 pm
Option nr 1 is the only viable option.

That or option Nr. 2. Maybe there is still hope to track him down.

But I'm voting for option 1. This is the only way for bter to stay alive in this situation. This time let someone else handle the negotiations though.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Cassius on August 16, 2014, 06:59:03 pm
1.

Edit: Are you in contact with the hacker? If not, then 2 makes more sense.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Fatih87SK on August 16, 2014, 07:01:08 pm
I choose 1.

Because that's the only way to win credibility and a little bit trust from the customers of Bter.

Bter will lose some money, but it will be a win - win situation after a while.

Other choices are risky and can hurt NXT as a whole. And NXT isn't guilty at all.

But. This time we need something like an escrow!
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: bidji29 on August 16, 2014, 07:02:33 pm
i will forge on 1.2.5f to put pressure on the hacker to accept the deal
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: LiQio on August 16, 2014, 07:03:52 pm
1.

Edit: Are you in contact with the hacker? If not, then 2 makes more sense.

That's a question that needs to be answered.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: cobaltskky on August 16, 2014, 07:04:06 pm
Option nr 1 is the only viable option.

Agreed.  Sticking with 1.2.5 vanilla.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: coolfish on August 16, 2014, 07:05:36 pm
I choose 3.
but keep do Option nr 1 and 2
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Coradan on August 16, 2014, 07:06:16 pm
Vote for option 1, but I am going to start forging in 1.2.5f
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: sava0123 on August 16, 2014, 07:07:34 pm
I remember times when there were only two devs working on NXT - BCNext himself and CfB. I also remember times when releasing 3 clients per 24 hours becuase of bugs were absolutely normal. I remeber times when there were less then 10 nodes to support whole network and people were checking with each other what #block they have in their clients to not get on fork. I remember times when it was just enough to hear words from CfB "Guys, we need to go on new fork with 0.X.X NRS client" because of some bug to do it. And noone were yelling about centralization and other shit. And now you refuse to go on fork for save your own money just because of what exacctly? What changed since that times? Concider this theft as a crritical bug in core. And what about BTER offering to invest 200BTC in NXT? Still not enough? You would rather give that away to the hacker? What is fucking wrong with you people?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: blackyblack1 on August 16, 2014, 07:08:21 pm
Quote
310 BTC bounty
If you want to hunt down the atacker start giving information about him to the community. IP address from bter logs, timezone, messages from him not shown in blockchain.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: freeworm on August 16, 2014, 07:08:40 pm
reserved
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: S3MKi on August 16, 2014, 07:09:08 pm
freeworm are you in contact with hacker? what does he think about deal(200btc)?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: cobaltskky on August 16, 2014, 07:09:35 pm
Quote
310 BTC bounty
If you want to hunt down the atacker start giving information about him to the community. IP address from bter logs, timezone, messages from him not shown in blockchain.

We need to get this information out to push pressure on TheSir.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: RGBT on August 16, 2014, 07:09:40 pm
I am in! let's us use 1.2.5f.
We must support bter, as they supported our community in case of problems with Klee.
No chance for thief.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: joefox on August 16, 2014, 07:09:52 pm
Option nr 1 is the only viable option.

+1 for option one.

Sorry, Lin.  Use better security when handling other people's money. 
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: nextcafe on August 16, 2014, 07:10:14 pm
I lost nearly all my NXT on bter, a little more than 18,000.

I know that's chump change to many of you, but that was the beginning of an investment I wanted to dollar cost average into.

Being in crypto since 2012, I'm aware that exchanges are not the safest place, but I saw no reason to transfer relatively small amounts of NXT after every purchase especially given those transaction fees.

So, the amount I had was based on holding it on bter for around 2 weeks while collecting daily interest. Once I figured out the MGW and had the client running on my main PC, I planned to transfer around 30 to 50k once the prices stopped it's down trend, and keep only a few thousand on bter in the next few weeks or so. So what I thought was good timing is looking like bad timing.

I want my money, but I don't want the Nxt ecosystem to be messed with because an exchange screwed up. It's only going to further devalue Nxt if we do so.

The first time I payed attention to Nxt was after Gravitons mistake and that was only because I enjoy the fuckery over at Bitcointalk. When I really looked at this and saw what it was, that not only wasn't it a scam, but it was quite frankly better than everything else out there, I was floored and truly excited.

Nxt is amazing and that makes it a threat to the POW hardliners, but more so to the other 2.0 options tied to corporate entities.

So let's move on with development and apply kindly or forceful pressure to the hacker to send back the funds.

Option 1 or Option 2
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: wesley on August 16, 2014, 07:10:25 pm
I remember times when there were only two devs working on NXT - BCNext himself and CfB. I also remember times when releasing 3 clients per 24 hours becuase of bugs were absolutely normal. I remeber times when there were less then 10 nodes to support whole network and people were checking with each other what #block they have in their clients to not get on fork. I remember times when it was just enough to hear words from CfB "Guys, we need to go on new fork with 0.X.X NRS client" because of some bug to do it. And noone were yelling about centralization and other shit. And now you refuse to go on fork for save your own money just because of what exacctly? What changed since that times? Concider this theft as a crritical bug in core. And what about BTER offering to invest 200BTC in NXT? Still not enough? You would rather give that away to the hacker? What is fucking wrong with you people?

Ah but it's NOT a bug in the core. And that's reason enough not to do this.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: freeworm on August 16, 2014, 07:10:32 pm
reserved
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: eimon on August 16, 2014, 07:11:47 pm
As much as I enjoy the image of crypto bounty-hunters crashing through this guy's bedroom window while he sleeps, I agree that 1 is the only realistic option.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: cobaltskky on August 16, 2014, 07:12:05 pm
PS Put your buy walls in people.  I'm placing my(small bump of a wall) at ~.000051  Maybe we can cushion the drop.  There's a few big walls down to .00004
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: crimi on August 16, 2014, 07:15:05 pm
Option nr 1 is the only viable option.

Option 1!

Never bailout a exchange. Never bailout a bank!
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: WolfofCrypto on August 16, 2014, 07:16:36 pm
Hard as it is for me to say but I need to say Wesley is right NUMBER 1

Number 3 is out of the qeustion this has not caused my damaged to NXT so far its better to search the guy or bounty hunt him but number 3 is not an option unless you really want to have nothing of NXT in the end


Option nr 1 is the only viable option.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Jacinto on August 16, 2014, 07:17:48 pm
If Bter is contact with hacker Opt 1 or 2 look viable.

Anyway, I will forge with version 1.2.5f just for put presure on the hacker and on all of you.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Damelon on August 16, 2014, 07:18:06 pm
I lost nearly all my NXT on bter, a little more than 18,000.

I know that's chump change to many of you, but that was the beginning of an investment I wanted to dollar cost average into.

It doesn't matter if it's chump change to some of us. A loss is a loss and it's always painful.
Too many people in the crypto scene just say "get over it", but I do think that we could at least could have some empathy here.

I sincerely hope we will be able to recoup all or at least a big chunk of your losses.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: bgcaffe on August 16, 2014, 07:19:24 pm
Option nr 1 is the only viable option.

Option 1!

Never bailout a exchange. Never bailout a bank!

Wrong this is not a bailout, a bailout requires someone to refund a bank after the funds were lost. Nobody is refunding BTER, its just returning the funds to their rightful owner.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: rtrtcrypto on August 16, 2014, 07:20:03 pm
Option 1

if not,

Options 2
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: coolfish on August 16, 2014, 07:20:17 pm
If one nxt wallet bank , be stolen by hackers 10M nxt , Do we Rollback? If not, ok !
If one nxt wallet bank , be stolen by hackers 100M nxt , Do we Rollback? If not, ok !
If one nxt wallet bank , be stolen by hackers 900M nxt , Do we Rollback? If not, then we give up nxt?


EDIT:

This event is a major accident, crime
The funds be stolen is all the NXT investor money, no bter.


If we are unable to recover the stolen funds, What platform or banks are willing to take risks to use nxt?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Eadeqa on August 16, 2014, 07:21:22 pm
Concider this theft as a crritical bug in core. And what about BTER offering to invest 200BTC in NXT? Still not enough? You would rather give that away to the hacker? What is fucking wrong with you people?

But it was not critical bug in the core, so hard to "consider it such" when it was not. Where do we stop with rollbacks? I remember when Klee was hacked and Bter froze hacker's account, the first thing CfB posted was "he doesn't support freeeze, as he is anarchist". Remember?
 
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: crimi on August 16, 2014, 07:22:53 pm
If one nxt wallet bank , be stolen by hackers 10M nxt , Do we Rollback? If not, ok !
If one nxt wallet bank , be stolen by hackers 100M nxt , Do we Rollback? If not, ok !
If one nxt wallet bank , be stolen by hackers 900M nxt , Do we Rollback? If not, then we give up nxt?
10M Nxt = no
100M Nxt = no
900M Nxt = If 900M Nxt parked at a exchange who is forging anyway? The exchange owns the coin.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Eadeqa on August 16, 2014, 07:23:45 pm
If one nxt wallet bank , be stolen by hackers 10M nxt , Do we Rollback? If not, ok !
If one nxt wallet bank , be stolen by hackers 100M nxt , Do we Rollback? If not, ok !
If one nxt wallet bank , be stolen by hackers 900M nxt , Do we Rollback? If not, then we give up nxt?

If the theft was due to flaw in Nxt software, we would have more agreement on the  fork. If not, why would we do it for bter but not for Klee?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: eimon on August 16, 2014, 07:24:15 pm
If one nxt wallet bank , be stolen by hackers 10M nxt , Do we Rollback? If not, ok !
If one nxt wallet bank , be stolen by hackers 100M nxt , Do we Rollback? If not, ok !
If one nxt wallet bank , be stolen by hackers 900M nxt , Do we Rollback? If not, then we give up nxt?

C'mon. If it ever gets to the point where 1 wallet has 90% of NXT, it's already over at that point.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: sava0123 on August 16, 2014, 07:25:25 pm

Ah but it's NOT a bug in the core. And that's reason enough not to do this.



So, returning stolen money to people is not enough reason? Preventing possible dump of 46m is not enough reason as well? Would you presonaly buy NXT if you encountered it only now, this day, knowing that there are stole 46mils flying around. I wouldn't.. Because I am total newbie. I wouldn't go to NXT wiki or forum threads. I would just check out our lagging website and then find out about theft from this forum or bitcointalk. And something telling me that other newbies like me will do the same. Luckly I am in NXT since times when it was trading only on dgex with no fees. So I can see how much been done since then. Absolutely astonishing progress. We just can't give someone 46mil for free... IMHO
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: coolfish on August 16, 2014, 07:25:55 pm
If one nxt wallet bank , be stolen by hackers 10M nxt , Do we Rollback? If not, ok !
If one nxt wallet bank , be stolen by hackers 100M nxt , Do we Rollback? If not, ok !
If one nxt wallet bank , be stolen by hackers 900M nxt , Do we Rollback? If not, then we give up nxt?

If the theft was due to flaw in Nxt software, we would have more agreement on the  fork. If not, why would we do it for bter but not for Klee?

You encourage others to criminal acts
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: freeworm on August 16, 2014, 07:26:29 pm
Great work! I see more and more 1.2.5f in peers now.  We need more power. Thank you very much for your support.
I am going to get more people in tomorrow from China.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: robertogl on August 16, 2014, 07:27:33 pm
Option 1.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: kLee on August 16, 2014, 07:27:37 pm
Concider this theft as a crritical bug in core. And what about BTER offering to invest 200BTC in NXT? Still not enough? You would rather give that away to the hacker? What is fucking wrong with you people?

But it was not critical bug in the core, so hard to "consider it such" when it was not. Where do we stop with rollbacks? I remember when Klee was hacked and Bter froze hacker's account, the first thing CfB posted was "he doesn't support freeeze, as he is anarchist". Remember?
 
I do...

On another note - Negotiate, always negotiate!
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Coradan on August 16, 2014, 07:30:44 pm
Match Results:
1.2.5: 111 - 9 :1.2.5f

Go, Go!!!
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Wakasaki808 on August 16, 2014, 07:30:47 pm
I vote Option 1 or 2 if you can negotiate with the hacker and actually get him to do stuff on his side. In the meantime, I am going to be running 1.2.5f if it doesn't work then meh.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Eadeqa on August 16, 2014, 07:31:17 pm
Would you presonaly buy NXT if you encountered it only now, this day, knowing that there are stole 46mils flying around. I wouldn't..

This argument goes both ways. Who would trust Nxt blockchain when the transactions can be reversed if most people don't like it? What's next? What if in the future the govt demands to reverse transactions from silkroad  for example? 
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: crimi on August 16, 2014, 07:31:30 pm
Great work! I see more and more 1.2.5f in peers now.  We need more power. Thank you very much for your support.
I am going to get more people in tomorrow from China.

Bter you are the ghash of nxt and not in a good way. If a exchange gets involved in mining/forging its dangerous.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Eadeqa on August 16, 2014, 07:34:40 pm
Great work! I see more and more 1.2.5f in peers now.  We need more power. Thank you very much for your support.
I am going to get more people in tomorrow from China.

Bter you are the ghash of nxt and not in a good way. If a exchange gets involved in mining/forging its dangerous.

Why? Dgex has been forging from beginning, I think. 
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: robertogl on August 16, 2014, 07:34:53 pm
Would you presonaly buy NXT if you encountered it only now, this day, knowing that there are stole 46mils flying around. I wouldn't..

This argument goes both ways. Who would trust Nxt blockchain when the transactions can be reversed if most people don't like it? What's next? What if in the future the govt demands to reverse transactions from silkroad  for example?

+1440
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: eimon on August 16, 2014, 07:35:44 pm
Great work! I see more and more 1.2.5f in peers now.  We need more power. Thank you very much for your support.
I am going to get more people in tomorrow from China.

Bter you are the ghash of nxt and not in a good way. If a exchange gets involved in mining/forging its dangerous.

Well, they are offering to pay 200 BTC to get back stolen funds for affected NXT holders..
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Graviton on August 16, 2014, 07:36:05 pm
Why? Dgex has been forging from beginning, I think.
No, just occasionally unintended.

We are considering forging for 1.2.5f though with 29M.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: gck on August 16, 2014, 07:37:09 pm
Option 1.

Option 3 is a BAD idea.  Rolling back the blockchain because of an exchange's mistake???  THEY screwed up plain and simple.  I am sorry it happened, but the damage that will be done to NXT cannot be overstated if you rollback because it sets a future precedent.  Suppose Cryptsy or BTC38 is hacked for the same amount?  Are we going to do roll back again?  As CfB stated...this option will go away down the road.

The MGW should be THE place to go to trade NXT for anything else.  Period.  That was the entire reason it was created...to AVOID situations like this!
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Coradan on August 16, 2014, 07:37:21 pm
Would you presonaly buy NXT if you encountered it only now, this day, knowing that there are stole 46mils flying around. I wouldn't..

This argument goes both ways. Who would trust Nxt blockchain when the transactions can be reversed if most people don't like it? What's next? What if in the future the govt demands to reverse transactions from silkroad  for example?

Only it is possible to do in this case, because hacker has not made transactions.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: semibaron on August 16, 2014, 07:38:21 pm
This isn't about forging and who wins the majority.

1.2.5f will be a hard fork => ALL users have to switch.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: sava0123 on August 16, 2014, 07:40:07 pm
Would you presonaly buy NXT if you encountered it only now, this day, knowing that there are stole 46mils flying around. I wouldn't..

This argument goes both ways. Who would trust Nxt blockchain when the transactions can be reversed if most people don't like it? What's next? What if in the future the govt demands to reverse transactions from silkroad  for example?

But it is not about "like" or "don't like". It is about justice. If govs had 51% mining power they would do it anyway.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Coradan on August 16, 2014, 07:42:26 pm
The state is downloading blockchain and only one of 20 peers is in 1.2.5f...
Need more forgers in 1.2.5f
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: crimi on August 16, 2014, 07:42:30 pm
Why? Dgex has been forging from beginning, I think.
No, just occasionally unintended.

We are considering forging for 1.2.5f though with 29M.

If this goes trough i personal contact any crypto news i can find. Headlines: Exchanges rewrite nxt blockchain. I have no words to describe... Ask cryptsy you could start a syndicate.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: galeki on August 16, 2014, 07:44:17 pm
Option1 || Option2

With Option3, what if after everything is settle down, bter says 'haha, the whole thing is just a experiment, now we know we can alter at least one transaction and probably a fork with 5% stake'.

Just a hypothesis of course, I like bter and trade a lot there.  ::)
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: wesley on August 16, 2014, 07:44:34 pm
Btw those that support option 1 should also open their clients ( 1.2.5 ) and increase nodes for it.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: dzarmush on August 16, 2014, 07:45:42 pm
It's unlikely that any new people would invest in Nxt if someone has almost 50M to dump. What wrong with leaving the hacker on fork? Rollback by Jean-Luc is a bad idea with no questions, but forgers cooperating against the hacker is a community work. Sounds stupid that someone could be against it. Maybe the hacker paid to those people to vote against it.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: eimon on August 16, 2014, 07:45:54 pm
Why? Dgex has been forging from beginning, I think.
No, just occasionally unintended.

We are considering forging for 1.2.5f though with 29M.

lol, you deny that your exchange forges intentionally and then state that you are considering forging. Whatever  ::)
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: valarmg on August 16, 2014, 07:46:40 pm
This hardfork option is a horrible idea for Nxt. Please negotiate with the hacker and take the option off the table.

Everyone should forge on 1.2.5
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: RGBT on August 16, 2014, 07:47:08 pm
Would you presonaly buy NXT if you encountered it only now, this day, knowing that there are stole 46mils flying around. I wouldn't..

This argument goes both ways. Who would trust Nxt blockchain when the transactions can be reversed if most people don't like it? What's next? What if in the future the govt demands to reverse transactions from silkroad  for example?

But it is not about "like" or "don't like". It is about justice. If govs had 51% mining power they would do it anyway.
In the future it will be not possible, only with 90% forging power.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Peter2516 on August 16, 2014, 07:47:12 pm

We are considering forging for 1.2.5f though with 29M.

Do it and you will lose customers for sure! :o
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: pt7 on August 16, 2014, 07:47:28 pm
Option 1. But the hacker needs to send the first chunk, since he owes from the previous round.

If no agreement, then option 2, and this option is starting to look better and better.  I wonder if BTER can implement some type of voluntary commited pledge of NXT from anyone that has NXT in their account.  This commited amount can be used to sweeten the pot.
   
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: gperez2000 on August 16, 2014, 07:48:04 pm
New fork has to be the way to go, the hacker is stealing what doesn't belong to him and luckily there is a way to get it back but why only BTER and not the 100's of people that had money stolen from their wallets too, nobody has done anything for them. If we allow the hacker to keep this it will a green light for others. But it has to be a way to legitimize real transactions and reverse stolen goods for anyone in the crypto coin community., otherwise very soon cryptos will fail.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: wesley on August 16, 2014, 07:48:08 pm
DGEX, what safety procedures do you have for these coins? You are forging with them means you are not putting them in a cold wallet, or are they leased?

Are you keeping all these coins in 1 (point of failure) account and access it from a single computer?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: gck on August 16, 2014, 07:48:41 pm
Btw those that support option 1 should also open their clients ( 1.2.5 ) and increase nodes for it.

Open and running...

Also...how do we know this isn't an inside job?  Amazing that this happens with several new NRS releases out and the DGS very close... ::)
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: rtrtcrypto on August 16, 2014, 07:51:35 pm
I think option two needs to be bumped up with funds from the 45 million.

Say, everyone takes a 20-25% loss (much better than 100%!!!).

Deal would then be:

300BTC bounty + 9.5 million NXT (or so) Maybe some big players would join in on the hunt? All of the sudden, 300 BTC CLEAN looks very very good for the hacker. 





Option 1. But the hacker needs to send the first chunk, since he owes from the previous round.

If no agreement, then option 2, and this option is starting to look better and better.  I wonder if BTER can implement some type of voluntary commited pledge of NXT from anyone that has NXT in their account.  This commited amount can be used to sweeten the pot.
 
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: coinomat on August 16, 2014, 07:56:06 pm
If you want something from NXT community you should stop NXT trading at your exchange RIGHT NOW.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: joefox on August 16, 2014, 08:01:09 pm
All of my stake is forging on 1.2.5 and it will stay there. I fired up my client and set all my accounts to forge in order to reinforce the current state of the blockchain.

I feel awful for people's losses, but reorganizing a blockchain to correct someone's mistake is a terrible, terrible idea.

1.2.5 FTW, and go with option one. If there is no cost to BTER's lack of strong security procedures, there is no incentive for them to smarten up.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: rckrck123 on August 16, 2014, 08:02:05 pm
rewriting btc blockchain for mtgox was not practical.

but here it is practical. also its just the theft transaction that will be modified in blockchain

'Blockchain integrity' argument is correct but you also need to consider that new users and some of the existing NXTers will go away as they would feel let down by the community.

Apply the 'Too big too fail' theory' and implement JL's patch.

What BTER would pay for this can be discussed later but they should pay a fine
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: eimon on August 16, 2014, 08:02:45 pm

The MGW should be THE place to go to trade NXT for anything else.  Period.  That was the entire reason it was created...to AVOID situations like this!

+1.

Negotiating with the hacker is the short-term solution to this problem, but MGW is the long-term solution and the way to make sure it doesn't happen again (both for NXT and for all other cryptos).

Please devs, make sure MGW stays online.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: S3MKi on August 16, 2014, 08:02:49 pm
no answer from hacker? i launch 1.2.5f but you bter will kill nxt.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: freeworm on August 16, 2014, 08:05:18 pm
If you want something from NXT community you should stop NXT trading at your exchange RIGHT NOW.

stopped already days ago. it's from the old.bter.com but we have shut it down
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Eadeqa on August 16, 2014, 08:05:40 pm
Maybe the hacker paid to those people to vote against it.

This clown shows up and posts a brilliant theory. Yeah, the hacker "paid" all forgers" to use old version. Makes perfect sense. Why didn't we think of that brilliant insight before?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: LocoMB on August 16, 2014, 08:06:44 pm
does splitting NXT seem like a good idea to anyone? because an exchange used a shoddy lock on their customer deposits?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: rickyjames on August 16, 2014, 08:09:22 pm
I think option two needs to be bumped up with funds from the 45 million.

Say, everyone takes a 20-25% loss (much better than 100%!!!).

Deal would then be:

300BTC bounty + 9.5 million NXT (or so) Maybe some big players would join in on the hunt? All of the sudden, 300 BTC CLEAN looks very very good for the hacker. 


I would rather permanently lose all 450K NXT I have in this mess rather than pay the guy that started it 1 NXT more.

He has run off with 45M+ NXT AND 100+ BTC he was ALREADY paid to GIVE IT ALL BACK. 

You trust him to do what we want by giving him 300 BTC more?  Why?

Negotiation is not possible without trust and this guy has none of mine.  He should have none of yours.

Throwing losses onto NXT owners that trusted Bter to use braindead levels of account security is not an option.  Once the NXT community decided to keep the blockchain intact, it became 100% Bter's problem.  Time for them to sink or swim.

The real answer is to chase this guy across cyberspace and dox him and then reaccess where we are as a community once we know his real name and where he sleeps at night.

You want to still do a payoff, then it's live via a webcam with a briefcase of cash and lots of heavies behind it and he has to type in the transfer code for all 45M NXT before he touches the briefcase.

Come to think of it, the price of NXT would probably go up that day.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: RGBT on August 16, 2014, 08:10:04 pm
Consider also this: many small investors had your NXT on BTER, if they do not have all your Nxt available, there is here, in Nxt community, only big whales.
At least, the community will lose very many disappointed Nxter.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Cyclone on August 16, 2014, 08:10:34 pm
Option 3 can, and should, be ruled out at this stage. My own particular preference would be option 2, in order to see the hacker not profit from his crimes. That being said, option 1 may offer Bter users a better chance of being reimburst for their loses. Perhaps it might be advisable to pursue both options 1 and 2 at the same time, in order to put more pressure on him.

Perhaps all available data on the hacker could be published here, on bitcointalk, and on reddit to see what information can be turned up on him in the meantime. If  there is any decent chance to get him, pursue option 2 to hopefully make an example of him, and deter the next hacker.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: eimon on August 16, 2014, 08:14:44 pm


I would rather permanently lose all 450K NXT I have in this mess rather than pay the guy that started it 1 NXT more.

He has run off with 45M+ NXT AND 100+ BTC he was ALREADY paid to GIVE IT ALL BACK. 

You trust him to do what we want by giving him 300 BTC more?  Why?

Negotiation is not possible without trust and this guy has none of mine.  He should have none of yours.

Throwing losses onto NXT owners that trusted Bter to use braindead levels of account security is not an option.  Once the NXT community decided to keep the blockchain intact, it became 100% Bter's problem.  Time for them to sink or swim.

The real answer is to chase this guy across cyberspace and dox him and then reaccess where we are as a community once we know his real name and where he sleeps at night.

We don't have to trust the thief to buy back the NXT. We just have to be careful about how the trade is done. Bter should have used an escrow or insisted that the thief send first.

The trade could be done with a reputable escrow, or insisting the hacker send first. It should also be broken down into multiple trades. Definitely don't send all 200 BTC at once, before hacker sends the NXT.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: RGBT on August 16, 2014, 08:14:55 pm
Why? Dgex has been forging from beginning, I think.
No, just occasionally unintended.

We are considering forging for 1.2.5f though with 29M.
Bravo graviton. Thank You!
I will still stay invested in your assets and buy/sell on dgex.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: rickyjames on August 16, 2014, 08:16:24 pm
We don't have to trust the thief to buy back the NXT. We just have to be careful about how the trade is done. Bter should have used an escrow or insisted that the thief send first.

The trade could be done with a reputable escrow, or insisting the hacker send first. It should also be broken down into multiple trades. Definitely don't send all 200 BTC at once, before hacker sends the NXT.

I want to know who this guy is in real life before he is "rewarded" with another satoshi.  Now that the blockchain is frozen, there is no rush.  Take a few days to ID him before you start shoving cash at him as fast as you can anonymously.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Jacinto on August 16, 2014, 08:17:45 pm
Consider also this: many small investors had your NXT on BTER, if they do not have all your Nxt available, there is here, in Nxt community, only big whales.
At least, the community will lose very many disappointed Nxter.

This is true.

A lot of small fishes, totally innocent and well-intentioned will lose all the hope in cryptos and specially in NXT. Nice portion of "cryptomarket" down the toilet just before launching the DGS. Sad.  :(
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Picsou on August 16, 2014, 08:18:07 pm
option 3 should be used for now to put pressure on the hacker, while options 1 and 2 remain valid.

let's hope 1 or 2 will solve this before DGS block, that way, it's still possible to get back on 1.2.5.

PUT PRESSURE ON THE HACKER !!
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Coradan on August 16, 2014, 08:18:47 pm
Something wrong with 1.2.5f?

(http://www.nxt.cool/125f.png)

There isnt the block number that Jean-Luc said!  Where is block 210440? :o
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: TheCryptoWoman on August 16, 2014, 08:20:52 pm
So now we have exchanges with large holdings deciding to lead a hard fork against community consensus of yesterday?

Whether I agree personally with the outcome of yesterdays decision by Nxt forgers or not, this turn of events troubles me very much.

Seems more like a coup.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Eadeqa on August 16, 2014, 08:21:43 pm
You trust him to do what we want by giving him 300 BTC more?  Why?

If option 1 is accepted by the hacker, the hacker needs to send first. The guy is not only a thief, but also a trustless liar.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Jacinto on August 16, 2014, 08:22:45 pm
So now we have exchanges with large holdings deciding to lead a hard fork against community consensus of yesterday?

Whether I agree personally with the outcome of yesterdays decision by Nxt forgers or not, this turn of events troubles me very much.

Can you pls provide the link where this "consensus" was reach?  ::)

Quote
Seems more like a coup.

LOL, a coup? by who? the community against the community?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Graviton on August 16, 2014, 08:23:53 pm
DGEX, what safety procedures do you have for these coins? You are forging with them means you are not putting them in a cold wallet, or are they leased?
The stash is not deployed for forging currently while we contemplate the repercussions of the personal commitment decision to business.

Not leased. I reckon leasing to our own account could offer more protection, would it not.

My thirst for the hard fork is not motivated by a will to bail out BTER or save their customers. It is motivated by the will to keep NXT coherent and alive by avoiding 50 Million dump to the open market.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: S3MKi on August 16, 2014, 08:25:53 pm
Something wrong with 1.2.5f?

http://www.nxt.cool/125f.png

There isnt the block number that Jean-Luc said!  Where is block 210440? :o
i'm in 209886 only ???
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: freeworm on August 16, 2014, 08:26:17 pm
Something wrong with 1.2.5f?

(http://www.nxt.cool/125f.png)

There isnt the block number that Jean-Luc said!  Where is block 210440? :o

You need to wait until it connected to other nodes
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: crimi on August 16, 2014, 08:26:51 pm
A lot of small fishes, totally innocent and well-intentioned will lose all the hope in cryptos and specially in NXT. Nice portion of "cryptomarket" down the toilet just before launching the DGS. Sad.  :(

With a exchange that has uncertain legal restriction? Its always risky! Cryptsy would have enforce the law they are registerd with FinCEN.

British virgin islands maybe they should call good old england for help?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: valarmg on August 16, 2014, 08:27:13 pm
So now we have exchanges with large holdings deciding to lead a hard fork against community consensus of yesterday?

Whether I agree personally with the outcome of yesterdays decision by Nxt forgers or not, this turn of events troubles me very much.

Can you pls provide the link where this "consensus" was reach?  ::)

Quote
Seems more like a coup.

LOL, a coup? by who? the community against the community?

It was reached by the fact that most of the Nxt continued to forge on the old chain, not the new 'hardfork' chain. And it seems that continues to happen. But the exchanges control many peoples Nxt, so they can add a large weighting toward the new 'hardfork' chain without caring whether the people whose Nxt they own want that.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: mikesbmw on August 16, 2014, 08:28:16 pm
DGEX, what safety procedures do you have for these coins? You are forging with them means you are not putting them in a cold wallet, or are they leased?
The stash is not deployed for forging currently while we contemplate the repercussions of the personal commitment decision to business.

Not leased. I reckon leasing to our own account could offer more protection, would it not.

My thirst for the hard fork is not motivated by a will to bail out BTER or save their customers. It is motivated by the will to keep NXT coherent and alive by avoiding 50 Million dump to the open market.
You should not decide with peoples coins at your exchange to do a fork.

Do what you want with your PRIVATE NXT what you want, but keep the customers NXT out of this!
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: wesley on August 16, 2014, 08:28:44 pm
DGEX, what safety procedures do you have for these coins? You are forging with them means you are not putting them in a cold wallet, or are they leased?
The stash is not deployed for forging currently while we contemplate the repercussions of the personal commitment decision to business.

Not leased. I reckon leasing to our own account could offer more protection, would it not.

My thirst for the hard fork is not motivated by a will to bail out BTER or save their customers. It is motivated by the will to keep NXT coherent and alive by avoiding 50 Million dump to the open market.

What about the other part of my question:

Are you keeping all these coins in 1 (point of failure) account and access it from a single computer?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: freeworm on August 16, 2014, 08:29:39 pm
Something wrong with 1.2.5f?

(http://www.nxt.cool/125f.png)

There isnt the block number that Jean-Luc said!  Where is block 210440? :o

I got this trick from Come-from-Beyond

edit this file:

nxt/conf/nxt-default.properties

maxNumberOfConnectedPublicPeers
set it to 1000 or more so that you can see all the nodes
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: TheCryptoWoman on August 16, 2014, 08:32:50 pm
So now we have exchanges with large holdings deciding to lead a hard fork against community consensus of yesterday?

Whether I agree personally with the outcome of yesterdays decision by Nxt forgers or not, this turn of events troubles me very much.

Can you pls provide the link where this "consensus" was reach?  ::)

Quote
Seems more like a coup.

LOL, a coup? by who? the community against the community?

When I woke up this morning and checked, "we" the community of forgers had decided not to participate in the reorganization plan.

This is not community against community. This is an outside force stepping in to agitate an outcome (coup).

This is a horrible situation and I feel terrible for all affected. My concerns have to do with the question of exchanges having this much power to influence the future of Nxt or any other coin.

Does anybody else have this concern?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Picsou on August 16, 2014, 08:33:32 pm
I've been told that the hacker himself have chosen to forge ont 1.2.5f  ;D

=======>(ok I take the door)
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: crimi on August 16, 2014, 08:34:54 pm
So now we have exchanges with large holdings deciding to lead a hard fork against community consensus of yesterday?

Whether I agree personally with the outcome of yesterdays decision by Nxt forgers or not, this turn of events troubles me very much.

Can you pls provide the link where this "consensus" was reach?  ::)

Quote
Seems more like a coup.

LOL, a coup? by who? the community against the community?

When I woke up this morning and checked, "we" the community of forgers had decided not to participate in the reorganization plan.

This is not community against community. This is an outside force stepping in to agitate an outcome (coup).

This is a horrible situation and I feel terrible for all affected. My concerns have to do with the question of exchanges having this much power to influence the future of Nxt or any other coin.

Does anybody else have this concern?

Im 100% on your side on that.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Coradan on August 16, 2014, 08:35:00 pm
Something wrong with 1.2.5f?

(http://www.nxt.cool/125f.png)

There isnt the block number that Jean-Luc said!  Where is block 210440? :o

I got this trick from Come-from-Beyond

edit this file:

nxt/conf/nxt-default.properties

maxNumberOfConnectedPublicPeers
set it to 1000 or more so that you can see all the nodes

Thx. I hope my networks does not say bump!
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: S3MKi on August 16, 2014, 08:38:55 pm
any news from hacker?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Coradan on August 16, 2014, 08:39:09 pm
Whats about option 1?  Has Hacker been contated? 
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: zingzong on August 16, 2014, 08:41:04 pm
1-2-5f NOW
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: hash on August 16, 2014, 08:42:45 pm
[...] But the exchanges control many peoples Nxt, so they can add a large weighting toward the new 'hardfork' chain without caring whether the people whose Nxt they own want that.

According to Jean-Luc the forging power is irrelevant for the hardfork adoption:


If enough users decide to switch to the 1.2.5f fork, it is still possible - however now the 1.2.5 nodes are not going to switch automatically to the other fork, no matter how better in terms of cumulative difficulty it becomes. In a way, it is no longer forgers that determine which fork will win, but what clients all individual users will decide to run - 1.2.5 or 1.2.5f.
[...]
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Graviton on August 16, 2014, 08:43:43 pm
Are you keeping all these coins in 1 (point of failure) account and access it from a single computer?
Yes. Account actually needs to be accessed from a computer. We have proprietary security mechanisms on how to access the reserve accounts.

The amount is currently not forging.

What about my question about leasing increasing security. Does leasing increase forging account security?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: zingzong on August 16, 2014, 08:43:50 pm
I remember times when there were only two devs working on NXT - BCNext himself and CfB. I also remember times when releasing 3 clients per 24 hours becuase of bugs were absolutely normal. I remeber times when there were less then 10 nodes to support whole network and people were checking with each other what #block they have in their clients to not get on fork. I remember times when it was just enough to hear words from CfB "Guys, we need to go on new fork with 0.X.X NRS client" because of some bug to do it. And noone were yelling about centralization and other shit. And now you refuse to go on fork for save your own money just because of what exacctly? What changed since that times? Concider this theft as a crritical bug in core. And what about BTER offering to invest 200BTC in NXT? Still not enough? You would rather give that away to the hacker? What is fucking wrong with you people?

Exactly what im thinking!! WTF people its only a fork,
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: starfishi on August 16, 2014, 08:43:59 pm
Option 1 for me, because, really, bter you messed up roally, so try to clean it up, it will cost you, but you got the benefit of getting shown you your security leaks, which is worth a lot, as we see now.
Then option 2 if 1 fails: but beef up the bounty, there are already so many affected people, who would contribute to the bounty, in addition to bter, making it huge, causeing the thief to consider option 1 again. . .
Option 3: Out of the question, because the long term damage would make us all loose money: Realy big investors will think twice about investing their millions in NXT, if they can´t be shure there won´t be a "rollback" tomorrow, for whatever reason . . . At least not, untill we have a trustless system of 90%, for now, its still just over 50%, right?

just my 2 NXT´s
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Damelon on August 16, 2014, 08:47:31 pm
I remember times when there were only two devs working on NXT - BCNext himself and CfB. I also remember times when releasing 3 clients per 24 hours becuase of bugs were absolutely normal. I remeber times when there were less then 10 nodes to support whole network and people were checking with each other what #block they have in their clients to not get on fork. I remember times when it was just enough to hear words from CfB "Guys, we need to go on new fork with 0.X.X NRS client" because of some bug to do it. And noone were yelling about centralization and other shit. And now you refuse to go on fork for save your own money just because of what exacctly? What changed since that times? Concider this theft as a crritical bug in core. And what about BTER offering to invest 200BTC in NXT? Still not enough? You would rather give that away to the hacker? What is fucking wrong with you people?

I remember these days, too.

I also bolded the important difference between those times, and this one.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Coradan on August 16, 2014, 08:47:52 pm
Are you keeping all these coins in 1 (point of failure) account and access it from a single computer?
Yes. Account actually needs to be accessed from a computer. We have proprietary security mechanisms on how to access the reserve accounts.

The amount is currently not forging.

What about my question about leasing increasing security. Does leasing increase forging account security?

Yep, you can lease the amount to another account with less funds...  But the problem is that lease is effective after 1440 blocks... So you must forge with main account directly until those number of blocks are forged.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: zingzong on August 16, 2014, 08:48:08 pm
It may as well be a critical bug, the damage that can be done to the coin with the 50 million let alone the damage to the community
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: domsch on August 16, 2014, 08:49:22 pm
DGEX, what safety procedures do you have for these coins? You are forging with them means you are not putting them in a cold wallet, or are they leased?
The stash is not deployed for forging currently while we contemplate the repercussions of the personal commitment decision to business.

Not leased. I reckon leasing to our own account could offer more protection, would it not.

My thirst for the hard fork is not motivated by a will to bail out BTER or save their customers. It is motivated by the will to keep NXT coherent and alive by avoiding 50 Million dump to the open market.

A hardfork of Nxt would make it seem like just another, failed crypto-currency that could not withhold a hack on a centralized entity. What you are proposing is killing Nxt's future and it won't get us anywhere near the place you want it to be.

50m Nxt flooding the markets are very unlikely. The hacker wants an easy way out and I'm sure that we will see another outcome than him simply dumping all his Nxt and keep the price down. Nxt is already well respected now for not choosing the easy way out of this event but instead we chose to fight.

Taking the easy way out is not an option for us. The third-party that lead to this event will have to pay for it but not the entire Nxt community. We will continue to fight and push Nxt to where we intend it to be.

I personally lost 350k Nxt in the hack but I am very confident that we will be stronger after this event. The community will unite and fight together - we can push Nxt to the NeXT level.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: rickyjames on August 16, 2014, 08:51:50 pm
@ freeworm:

Thank you for proposing options.  Give us more information so we can evaluate them.

Before offering another ransom, are you now in communication with thesircom?  Why would you trust him in Round Two?

Before posting a bounty, what progress have you made so far in tracing him?  Where are the IP logs of his hack?

@ thesircom:

Dude, you gotta be reading all this.  Where do YOU want to go from here?  If you think thousands of motivated people are gonna let you escape with way over a million bucks  that you can use in the future, guess again.  What is YOUR desired end game?  If you don't trust or want to deal with Bter, go with the deal by buybitcoinscanada.  PLEASE OPEN COMMUNICATIONS.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: jl777 on August 16, 2014, 08:52:13 pm
It may as well be a critical bug, the damage that can be done to the coin with the 50 million let alone the damage to the community
dont overestimate the damage 50 million dump will cause. At worst it will temporarily allow people like me to buy NXT at halfprice. This is not "damage"

Anyway, I am having an idea to help bter with solving this issue and to help the NXT'ers who had their NXT in bter recoup some or all of what they lost (over time). It is based on Lee's idea and I think there is a way to make it work.

Basically bter will need to do a bit of what poloniex did, just on a larger scale. I will post my proposal soon, I hope freeworm will be able to accept this

James
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: zingzong on August 16, 2014, 08:53:00 pm
Why? Dgex has been forging from beginning, I think.
No, just occasionally unintended.

We are considering forging for 1.2.5f though with 29M.

Good Man!!!!
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: cromaclear on August 16, 2014, 08:53:41 pm
Bter, shut The fuck up In order not to give details to the hacker and just talk about this issues with developers or people of confidence

Do the following: hire a good trader, open your nxt account on bter in order to buy and sell, put your btc and nxt funds you have in the traders hands (not the client funds but yours)...let the trader be a market maker buying low and selling high which is legal. You will earn money in this way and recover the losses
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: zuqka on August 16, 2014, 08:56:28 pm
DGEX, what safety procedures do you have for these coins? You are forging with them means you are not putting them in a cold wallet, or are they leased?
The stash is not deployed for forging currently while we contemplate the repercussions of the personal commitment decision to business.

Not leased. I reckon leasing to our own account could offer more protection, would it not.

My thirst for the hard fork is not motivated by a will to bail out BTER or save their customers. It is motivated by the will to keep NXT coherent and alive by avoiding 50 Million dump to the open market.

A hardfork of Nxt would make it seem like just another, failed crypto-currency that could not withhold a hack on a centralized entity. What you are proposing is killing Nxt's future and it won't get us anywhere near the place you want it to be.

50m Nxt flooding the markets are very unlikely. The hacker wants an easy way out and I'm sure that we will see another outcome than him simply dumping all his Nxt and keep the price down. Nxt is already well respected now for not choosing the easy way out of this event but instead we chose to fight.

Taking the easy way out is not an option for us. The third-party that lead to this event will have to pay for it but not the entire Nxt community. We will continue to fight and push Nxt to where we intend it to be.

I personally lost 350k Nxt in the hack but I am very confident that we will be stronger after this event. The community will unite and fight together - we can push Nxt to the NeXT level.
THIS
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: freeworm on August 16, 2014, 09:02:14 pm
Why? Dgex has been forging from beginning, I think.
No, just occasionally unintended.

We are considering forging for 1.2.5f though with 29M.

Thanks a lot man!
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: jonny on August 16, 2014, 09:03:02 pm
Option nr 1 is the only viable option.

Option 1!

Never bailout a exchange. Never bailout a bank!
I agree, I am active forging on the original blockchain. Companies with this level of security have nothing to do in the business of crypto-currencies.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: crimi on August 16, 2014, 09:05:00 pm
Technical speaking we are behind block 720 so there is no reorg. Even if some people run and forge 1.2.5f. The hacker can still send nxt with a 1.2.5 client and node below. So whats the point?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: superresistant on August 16, 2014, 09:06:12 pm
 
Who is going to buy NXT when most of the Nxt supporters lost everything and feel rejected ?

How will it affect the market ?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: WolfofCrypto on August 16, 2014, 09:06:41 pm
Domsch is right

I see there is a lot of newbie usernames in here and they all Crying for a rollback or a fork


Seems more like other cryptos out to destroy NXT

DGEX, what safety procedures do you have for these coins? You are forging with them means you are not putting them in a cold wallet, or are they leased?
The stash is not deployed for forging currently while we contemplate the repercussions of the personal commitment decision to business.

Not leased. I reckon leasing to our own account could offer more protection, would it not.

My thirst for the hard fork is not motivated by a will to bail out BTER or save their customers. It is motivated by the will to keep NXT coherent and alive by avoiding 50 Million dump to the open market.

A hardfork of Nxt would make it seem like just another, failed crypto-currency that could not withhold a hack on a centralized entity. What you are proposing is killing Nxt's future and it won't get us anywhere near the place you want it to be.

50m Nxt flooding the markets are very unlikely. The hacker wants an easy way out and I'm sure that we will see another outcome than him simply dumping all his Nxt and keep the price down. Nxt is already well respected now for not choosing the easy way out of this event but instead we chose to fight.

Taking the easy way out is not an option for us. The third-party that lead to this event will have to pay for it but not the entire Nxt community. We will continue to fight and push Nxt to where we intend it to be.

I personally lost 350k Nxt in the hack but I am very confident that we will be stronger after this event. The community will unite and fight together - we can push Nxt to the NeXT level.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: zingzong on August 16, 2014, 09:06:58 pm
option 3 should be used for now to put pressure on the hacker, while options 1 and 2 remain valid.

let's hope 1 or 2 will solve this before DGS block, that way, it's still possible to get back on 1.2.5.

PUT PRESSURE ON THE HACKER !!
+50,000,000
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Micky on August 16, 2014, 09:07:11 pm
Why? Dgex has been forging from beginning, I think.
No, just occasionally unintended.

We are considering forging for 1.2.5f though with 29M.

Good Man!!!!

+1000 Very good!!!
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: zingzong on August 16, 2014, 09:08:59 pm
So now we have exchanges with large holdings deciding to lead a hard fork against community consensus of yesterday?

Whether I agree personally with the outcome of yesterdays decision by Nxt forgers or not, this turn of events troubles me very much.

Seems more like a coup.

Actually the majority voted for a fork, it was abandoned as bter said they could handle it which they obviously couldnt
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: jl777 on August 16, 2014, 09:09:13 pm
The fourth solution:

Issue 51.x million stolenNXT assets and distribute them proportionally to the people who had the deposits in bter. This idea I copied from Lee.

Now, if any negotiations/bounty hunting/etc. gets all the NXT back, it is simple, put a bid on NXT AE at 1 NXT per 1 stolenNXT. 5 million NXT has already been recovered, so the initial bid should be ~0.1 NXT per stolenNXT. Those that are happy to recoup anything are then free to accept this bid, they get a guaranteed 10% back, the others will get a higher chance for full recovery.

Since full recovery from hacker is no 100% certain event, it is bter's responsibility to makegood the difference. This is what Tristan at Poloniex did, though 100 BTC vs 50 million NXT is so much different we cant compare the two, still bter used to be a significant exchange and if it can come up with a plan to make everybody whole, it will survive this. If not, I estimate chances of bter to become an irrelevant small exchange to be 90%+

sorry, freeworm, this is the reality. If bter does not have a plan that will make its depositors whole, you will lose 90%+ of all your other trading volumes and I doubt you will survive.

So, it is in bter's interest to make sure all NXT holders are repaid. I understand 50 45 million NXT is enormous amount, but if you can assure people that in spite of this impossible situation you have a plan with very good chance of success, then bter will become very well respected and will be able to not only survive but even become more popular.

This is what needs to be done. Allocate HALF your revenues to repurchase the stolenNXT. Each week, increase the bid for the stolenNXT by half your revenues added to the repurchase amount. So if you are doing 10000 BTC of trading in a week, at 0.2% commission on each side, 20 BTC is added to the bid of the stolenNXT. this will not be much of a change for one week, but over time, especially if your volumes grow as this becomes a way for the general crypto community to help out just by using bter for their trading, cuz they can trust bter to makegood. If your trading volumes double, then you actually are making the same revenues. Much better than 90% reductions.

let us work the numbers.

20 BTC @ 15000 NXT/BTC is 300,000 NXT per week, this is 150 weeks or three years. A long, long time, but this is much better than never.

Also, I expect that as the bid for the stolenNXT keeps increasing, more and more people will be selling and every sale below 1:1 is reducing this debt, so I estimate that if you can be adding 300K NXT per week, it will actually clear out the debt in closer to a year's time. If you get massive positive PR and a sympathy trading business, then maybe it could be much faster.

I hope that freeworm will be realistic and open to this plan. I will help how I can for the structuring of this

James
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Coradan on August 16, 2014, 09:13:02 pm
Match Results:
1.2.5: 112 - 11 :1.2.5f

Go, Go!!!
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: TheCryptoWoman on August 16, 2014, 09:14:22 pm
So now we have exchanges with large holdings deciding to lead a hard fork against community consensus of yesterday?

Whether I agree personally with the outcome of yesterdays decision by Nxt forgers or not, this turn of events troubles me very much.

Seems more like a coup.

Actually the majority voted for a fork, it was abandoned as bter said they could handle it which they obviously couldnt

Vocal majority voted. Forging, where the decision-making is really made told a different story.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: bitcoinpaul on August 16, 2014, 09:14:52 pm
lol forum sock puppet action  ;D

Bter, u should try harder!
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: jonny on August 16, 2014, 09:15:37 pm
The fourth solution:

Issue 51.x million stolenNXT assets and distribute them proportionally to the people who had the deposits in bter. This idea I copied from Lee.
I like your solution!
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Cassius on August 16, 2014, 09:15:47 pm
Excellent. Better still, the stolenNXT trade in their own right. Others can step in to help those who have lost NXT without risking all or it being an outright gift. I would buy stolenNXT for this reason.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: eimon on August 16, 2014, 09:17:49 pm
Excellent. Better still, the stolenNXT trade in their own right. Others can step in to help those who have lost NXT without risking all or it being an outright gift. I would buy stolenNXT for this reason.

Maybe stolenNXT ends up at # 8 or 9 on Coinmarketcap  ;D
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: yassin54 on August 16, 2014, 09:18:48 pm
Excellent. Better still, the stolenNXT trade in their own right. Others can step in to help those who have lost NXT without risking all or it being an outright gift. I would buy stolenNXT for this reason.

me tooooo ;D ;D ;D
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Graviton on August 16, 2014, 09:19:07 pm
Quote
A hardfork of Nxt would make it seem like just another, failed crypto-currency that could not withhold a hack on a centralized entity. What you are proposing is killing Nxt's future and it won't get us anywhere near the place you want it to be.
That is well debatable. The community is fully divided on that. Saying such as being a sure thing is foolish.

In my opinion the solution to block hacker's account only through a hard fork is a sign of exceptional communal resolve. It's not a rollback. It is a collaborative action that mitigates damage done by a malevolent party. The effect to NXT users is only beneficial. The effect to outside observers is mixed and not prominent. Do not let fear take you over and prevent you from taking action when it needs to be taken.

Quote
50m Nxt flooding the markets are very unlikely.
Not flooding but exerting incredible downward pressure during the next 3, 6 or even 12 months. It is nearly certain. The hacker will of course sell it to a private dark side investor who mixes it, cashes out some, and sells the rest forward to the next investor for a fraction of the market price. Rinse and repeat until done.

1.5 million USD extra injection to the buy side would not suffice to keep NXT afloat, because of the bad rep causing more sell pressure.

By blocking the 50M from being sold, we just have to deal with the bad rep and not the massive selling million after million until exhaustion.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: zingzong on August 16, 2014, 09:21:00 pm
can we get this straight. Does it make a difference how much we are forging with?? if not anyone with more than one computer , get them all running 1-2-5f.
Also how do i get this running on the mac client, new to macs.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: cromaclear on August 16, 2014, 09:21:32 pm
StolenNXT should trade as well...if will help bter to gain more fees and recover The losses earlier
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: galeki on August 16, 2014, 09:23:20 pm
Excellent. Better still, the stolenNXT trade in their own right. Others can step in to help those who have lost NXT without risking all or it being an outright gift. I would buy stolenNXT for this reason.

me tooooo ;D ;D ;D

me too, would buy some to support  :D
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: instacash on August 16, 2014, 09:24:29 pm
Also how do i get this running on the mac client, new to macs.

1. Download the client's .zip
2. Fire up Terminal.app then cd to your NXT client folder, e.g. cd ~/Downloads/nxt
3. ./run.sh
4. access via browser at http://localhost:7876
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: valarmg on August 16, 2014, 09:27:17 pm
Not flooding but exerting incredible downward pressure during the next 3, 6 or even 12 months. It is nearly certain. The hacker will of course sell it to a private dark side investor who mixes it, cashes out some, and sells the rest forward to the next investor for a fraction of the market price. Rinse and repeat until done.

1.5 million USD extra injection to the buy side would not suffice to keep NXT afloat, because of the bad rep causing more sell pressure.

By blocking the 50M from being sold, we just have to deal with the bad rep and not the massive selling million after million until exhaustion.

50M on the market is no different than one of the full bitcoin original founders deciding to sell. A bit of downward pressure on price is not something that Nxt can't handle. It's like the Ethereum IPO or the FBI sell-off for bitcoin. It'll just be a blip. The bad reputation would be much more damage in my opinion. Especially driven by the exchanges like this. One of the main criticisms of PoS is the fact that the exchanges with all their coins have too much power. If this wins, a lot of people will lose their trust in Nxt forever.

Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: gs02xzz on August 16, 2014, 09:28:01 pm
One more avenue for Bter to compensate the users is to convert some of the lost NXT to their stock shares.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: TheCryptoWoman on August 16, 2014, 09:29:03 pm
can we get this straight. Does it make a difference how much we are forging with?? if not anyone with more than one computer , get them all running 1-2-5f.
Also how do i get this running on the mac client, new to macs.

zingzong, welcome to the community! I see your account is less than half a day old. Your enthusiasm for Nxt is admirable, but I would would trust your input and your cheerleading more if you had some "age" behind your opinions.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Come-from-Beyond on August 16, 2014, 09:29:39 pm
I propose free escrow service to do option 1.

This is how it should be done:

1. I publish my BTC and NXT accounts
2. BTER sends 200 BTC to my BTC account (after that it doesn't control these coins)
3. We are waiting for a reply from the hacker (24 hours), the reply must be a public message with his BTC account from NXT-8WJ7-8A2H-MBYN-3W9K4 to my NXT account
4. The hacker sends 46'662'000 NXT to my account
5. I send 200 BTC to his BTC account
6. I send 46+ M NXT to BTER cold wallet that already got 5 M NXT

So, if the hacker trusts me we could do it this way (the 200 BTC are not mine anyway if he worries that I could break the deal).

Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: zuqka on August 16, 2014, 09:30:14 pm
Not flooding but exerting incredible downward pressure during the next 3, 6 or even 12 months. It is nearly certain. The hacker will of course sell it to a private dark side investor who mixes it, cashes out some, and sells the rest forward to the next investor for a fraction of the market price. Rinse and repeat until done.

1.5 million USD extra injection to the buy side would not suffice to keep NXT afloat, because of the bad rep causing more sell pressure.

By blocking the 50M from being sold, we just have to deal with the bad rep and not the massive selling million after million until exhaustion.

50M on the market is no different than one of the full bitcoin original founders deciding to sell. A bit of downward pressure on price is not something that Nxt can't handle. It's like the Ethereum IPO or the FBI sell-off for bitcoin. It'll just be a blip. The bad reputation would be much more damage in my opinion. Especially driven by the exchanges like this. One of the main criticisms of PoS is the fact that the exchanges with all their coins have too much power. If this wins, a lot of people will lose their trust in Nxt forever.

Community vs exchanges....I vote for us, for NXT...1.2.5
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: jl777 on August 16, 2014, 09:30:35 pm
Excellent. Better still, the stolenNXT trade in their own right. Others can step in to help those who have lost NXT without risking all or it being an outright gift. I would buy stolenNXT for this reason.
Since it is on AE, it cannot help but start trading. With bter's constantly rising bid, this is a guaranteed momentum trade :)

As long as bter uses strict formula (preferably approved by shortNXT as this is his field of expertise) on the week's repurchase price, this will create a relatively stable market for stolenNXT and once it becomes clear that it is just a matter of time before everybody is made whole, bter will have reputation for surviving 1.5 mil hack, NXT AE is used in nicely creative way that allows for bter gradual buyback, community support for stolenNXT victims, etc.

James
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: jl777 on August 16, 2014, 09:32:54 pm
One more avenue for Bter to compensate the users is to convert some of the lost NXT to their stock shares.
The stolenNXT is essentially 50% of bter revenues and represents a majority of their equity, but it will be only for the ~12 month estimated period.
Of course if bter wanted to do a fund raising by issuing BTER asset to represent their company and pledged a percentage of what they raise to increase their bid on stolenNXT, I would be happy to help

James
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Jacinto on August 16, 2014, 09:33:12 pm
I propose free escrow service to do option 1.

This is how it should be done:

1. I publish my BTC and NXT accounts
2. BTER sends 200 BTC to my BTC account (after that it doesn't control these coins)
3. We are waiting for a reply from the hacker (24 hours), the reply must be a public message with his BTC account from NXT-8WJ7-8A2H-MBYN-3W9K4 to my NXT account
4. The hacker sends 46'662'000 NXT to my account
5. I send 200 BTC to his BTC account
6. I send 46+ M NXT to BTER cold wallet that already got 5 M NXT

So, if the hacker trusts me we could do it this way (the 200 BTC are not mine anyway if he worries that I could break the deal).


This is a win-win for every part involved.

Hope the hacker is reading this topic.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: mf-tzo on August 16, 2014, 09:33:17 pm
I didn't read the forum for 2 days as I was on holidays and what a mess I found...
Gox,poloniex, now bter, Cyprus banks...I guess people will never learn to not to trust centralized institutions...

Anyway, since my tech skills are not great what on earth am I supposed to do so my few nxt don't become useless? How do we check which block chain is the most powerfull one and what happens if I am on the old 1.2.5 one and then 1.2.5f prevails?

I don't have much of experience in cryptos as to advise u what to do but nxt should not die in order to save bter..And the hacker should be found and punished so I would go for option 2 for what is worth..

In any case please explain me what happens if I am on 1.2.5 and the other prevail.. How long do I have to react?Are my nxts become useless?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: zingzong on August 16, 2014, 09:33:26 pm
TheSir take the deal if you know whats good for you!! Your options are rapidly shrinking!! This community is not going to let you run off with 50 million NXT scot free. All exchanges will be on the lookout for your NXT.  If you dont take the deal that 300 BTCs turns into a bounty on your head , there will be many talented and committed people searching for you. By the looks of it soon your NXT will very likely be worthless anyway!! So what are you going to do??????
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: colin012 on August 16, 2014, 09:33:43 pm
The fourth solution:

Issue 51.x million stolenNXT assets and distribute them proportionally to the people who had the deposits in bter. This idea I copied from Lee.

Now, if any negotiations/bounty hunting/etc. gets all the NXT back, it is simple, put a bid on NXT AE at 1 NXT per 1 stolenNXT. 5 million NXT has already been recovered, so the initial bid should be ~0.1 NXT per stolenNXT. Those that are happy to recoup anything are then free to accept this bid, they get a guaranteed 10% back, the others will get a higher chance for full recovery.

Since full recovery from hacker is no 100% certain event, it is bter's responsibility to makegood the difference. This is what Tristan at Poloniex did, though 100 BTC vs 50 million NXT is so much different we cant compare the two, still bter used to be a significant exchange and if it can come up with a plan to make everybody whole, it will survive this. If not, I estimate chances of bter to become an irrelevant small exchange to be 90%+

sorry, freeworm, this is the reality. If bter does not have a plan that will make its depositors whole, you will lose 90%+ of all your other trading volumes and I doubt you will survive.

So, it is in bter's interest to make sure all NXT holders are repaid. I understand 50 45 million NXT is enormous amount, but if you can assure people that in spite of this impossible situation you have a plan with very good chance of success, then bter will become very well respected and will be able to not only survive but even become more popular.

This is what needs to be done. Allocate HALF your revenues to repurchase the stolenNXT. Each week, increase the bid for the stolenNXT by half your revenues added to the repurchase amount. So if you are doing 10000 BTC of trading in a week, at 0.2% commission on each side, 20 BTC is added to the bid of the stolenNXT. this will not be much of a change for one week, but over time, especially if your volumes grow as this becomes a way for the general crypto community to help out just by using bter for their trading, cuz they can trust bter to makegood. If your trading volumes double, then you actually are making the same revenues. Much better than 90% reductions.

let us work the numbers.

20 BTC @ 15000 NXT/BTC is 300,000 NXT per week, this is 150 weeks or three years. A long, long time, but this is much better than never.

Also, I expect that as the bid for the stolenNXT keeps increasing, more and more people will be selling and every sale below 1:1 is reducing this debt, so I estimate that if you can be adding 300K NXT per week, it will actually clear out the debt in closer to a year's time. If you get massive positive PR and a sympathy trading business, then maybe it could be much faster.

I hope that freeworm will be realistic and open to this plan. I will help how I can for the structuring of this

James

+1
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: zuqka on August 16, 2014, 09:34:37 pm
One more avenue for Bter to compensate the users is to convert some of the lost NXT to their stock shares.
The stolenNXT is essentially 50% of bter revenues and represents a majority of their equity, but it will be only for the ~12 month estimated period.
Of course if bter wanted to do a fund raising by issuing BTER asset to represent their company and pledged a percentage of what they raise to increase their bid on stolenNXT, I would be happy to help

James

Cudos to you m8! Has freeworm already contacted you?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: colin012 on August 16, 2014, 09:35:29 pm
Who will issue the stolen NXT asset and what is it's ID?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Wakasaki808 on August 16, 2014, 09:36:16 pm
The fourth solution:

Issue 51.x million stolenNXT assets and distribute them proportionally to the people who had the deposits in bter. This idea I copied from Lee.

Now, if any negotiations/bounty hunting/etc. gets all the NXT back, it is simple, put a bid on NXT AE at 1 NXT per 1 stolenNXT. 5 million NXT has already been recovered, so the initial bid should be ~0.1 NXT per stolenNXT. Those that are happy to recoup anything are then free to accept this bid, they get a guaranteed 10% back, the others will get a higher chance for full recovery.

Since full recovery from hacker is no 100% certain event, it is bter's responsibility to makegood the difference. This is what Tristan at Poloniex did, though 100 BTC vs 50 million NXT is so much different we cant compare the two, still bter used to be a significant exchange and if it can come up with a plan to make everybody whole, it will survive this. If not, I estimate chances of bter to become an irrelevant small exchange to be 90%+

sorry, freeworm, this is the reality. If bter does not have a plan that will make its depositors whole, you will lose 90%+ of all your other trading volumes and I doubt you will survive.

So, it is in bter's interest to make sure all NXT holders are repaid. I understand 50 45 million NXT is enormous amount, but if you can assure people that in spite of this impossible situation you have a plan with very good chance of success, then bter will become very well respected and will be able to not only survive but even become more popular.

This is what needs to be done. Allocate HALF your revenues to repurchase the stolenNXT. Each week, increase the bid for the stolenNXT by half your revenues added to the repurchase amount. So if you are doing 10000 BTC of trading in a week, at 0.2% commission on each side, 20 BTC is added to the bid of the stolenNXT. this will not be much of a change for one week, but over time, especially if your volumes grow as this becomes a way for the general crypto community to help out just by using bter for their trading, cuz they can trust bter to makegood. If your trading volumes double, then you actually are making the same revenues. Much better than 90% reductions.

let us work the numbers.

20 BTC @ 15000 NXT/BTC is 300,000 NXT per week, this is 150 weeks or three years. A long, long time, but this is much better than never.

Also, I expect that as the bid for the stolenNXT keeps increasing, more and more people will be selling and every sale below 1:1 is reducing this debt, so I estimate that if you can be adding 300K NXT per week, it will actually clear out the debt in closer to a year's time. If you get massive positive PR and a sympathy trading business, then maybe it could be much faster.

I hope that freeworm will be realistic and open to this plan. I will help how I can for the structuring of this

James

+1

DO THIS BTER!!! I like the idea. At least keep this as a backup
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: zingzong on August 16, 2014, 09:36:30 pm
Also how do i get this running on the mac client, new to macs.

1. Download the client's .zip
2. Fire up Terminal.app then cd to your NXT client folder, e.g. cd ~/Downloads/nxt
3. ./run.sh
4. access via browser at http://localhost:7876

Thanks
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: mikesbmw on August 16, 2014, 09:37:38 pm
Quote
A hardfork of Nxt would make it seem like just another, failed crypto-currency that could not withhold a hack on a centralized entity. What you are proposing is killing Nxt's future and it won't get us anywhere near the place you want it to be.
That is well debatable. The community is fully divided on that. Saying such as being a sure thing is foolish.

In my opinion the solution to block hacker's account only through a hard fork is a sign of exceptional communal resolve. It's not a rollback. It is a collaborative action that mitigates damage done by a malevolent party. The effect to NXT users is only beneficial. The effect to outside observers is mixed and not prominent. Do not let fear take you over and prevent you from taking action when it needs to be taken.

Quote
50m Nxt flooding the markets are very unlikely.
Not flooding but exerting incredible downward pressure during the next 3, 6 or even 12 months. It is nearly certain. The hacker will of course sell it to a private dark side investor who mixes it, cashes out some, and sells the rest forward to the next investor for a fraction of the market price. Rinse and repeat until done.

1.5 million USD extra injection to the buy side would not suffice to keep NXT afloat, because of the bad rep causing more sell pressure.

By blocking the 50M from being sold, we just have to deal with the bad rep and not the massive selling million after million until exhaustion.
So where is the line when you say: we freeze that account?

Is it when 20 million gets stolen? 10 million? 100 thousand? Who needs to cry wolf to get people to freeze "account X"?
Do we need everyone to be affected by the theft? 1000 people? 100 people? 10?

It's a VERY slippery slope Graviton... Very. (besides you wanting to use CUSTOMER deposits, which aren't yours!)
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: jl777 on August 16, 2014, 09:40:10 pm
Who will issue the stolen NXT asset and what is it's ID?
Without commitment from BTER to fund the bid for stolenNXT, this wont work. Personally, short of pulling rabbit from hat, the fourth solution seems to be the only option. In any case, using the fourth option it is compatible with rabbit from hat scenario as that just allows for 1:1 NXT bid for stolenNXT as soon as the rabbit is from hat

James

P.S. It wont matter who issues the asset, I will gladly issue the asset and write whatever code is needed to distribute it to the people, I just need the list of accounts and amount of stolenNXT they need to be credited with. Then the rest is up to whatever happens on recovery, etc.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Coradan on August 16, 2014, 09:40:29 pm
I propose free escrow service to do option 1.

This is how it should be done:

1. I publish my BTC and NXT accounts
2. BTER sends 200 BTC to my BTC account (after that it doesn't control these coins)
3. We are waiting for a reply from the hacker (24 hours), the reply must be a public message with his BTC account from NXT-8WJ7-8A2H-MBYN-3W9K4 to my NXT account
4. The hacker sends 46'662'000 NXT to my account
5. I send 200 BTC to his BTC account
6. I send 46+ M NXT to BTER cold wallet that already got 5 M NXT

So, if the hacker trusts me we could do it this way (the 200 BTC are not mine anyway if he worries that I could break the deal).


This is a win-win for every part involved.

Hope the hacker is reading this topic.

Yep I agree with this!
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Graviton on August 16, 2014, 09:42:49 pm
Especially driven by the exchanges like this
Going to a fork is my personal opinion, and apparently it doesn't make difference if you forge on a node with 1 NXT or 29 million NXT. So I can forge with my 1 NXT and not the exchange funds.

What exactly will cause the bad rep? NXT community choosing to reverse an undeniable, large hack just once?

So where is the line when you say: we freeze that account?
Once. Very strict line.

Remember DGEX lost 150 BTC to a hacker a month ago and I paid for it personally. Freeze or rollback was not mentioned in a word.

TBH I would have preferred blocking the funds to the hacker's account forever. That would have taken 5%+ of NXT off the market and have everyone like BTER still handle their mistakes in a nasty but sort of crypto-fair way. But that's not an option in my power to choose.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: jl777 on August 16, 2014, 09:47:00 pm
Quote
A hardfork of Nxt would make it seem like just another, failed crypto-currency that could not withhold a hack on a centralized entity. What you are proposing is killing Nxt's future and it won't get us anywhere near the place you want it to be.
That is well debatable. The community is fully divided on that. Saying such as being a sure thing is foolish.

In my opinion the solution to block hacker's account only through a hard fork is a sign of exceptional communal resolve. It's not a rollback. It is a collaborative action that mitigates damage done by a malevolent party. The effect to NXT users is only beneficial. The effect to outside observers is mixed and not prominent. Do not let fear take you over and prevent you from taking action when it needs to be taken.

Quote
50m Nxt flooding the markets are very unlikely.
Not flooding but exerting incredible downward pressure during the next 3, 6 or even 12 months. It is nearly certain. The hacker will of course sell it to a private dark side investor who mixes it, cashes out some, and sells the rest forward to the next investor for a fraction of the market price. Rinse and repeat until done.

1.5 million USD extra injection to the buy side would not suffice to keep NXT afloat, because of the bad rep causing more sell pressure.

By blocking the 50M from being sold, we just have to deal with the bad rep and not the massive selling million after million until exhaustion.
So where is the line when you say: we freeze that account?

Is it when 20 million gets stolen? 10 million? 100 thousand? Who needs to cry wolf to get people to freeze "account X"?
Do we need everyone to be affected by the theft? 1000 people? 100 people? 10?

It's a VERY slippery slope Graviton... Very. (besides you wanting to use CUSTOMER deposits, which aren't yours!)
I dont remember any exchange and certainly not DGEX, ever saying they wont forge. It is common for banks to earn interest on customer deposits? I think they do a lot more than just earn interest (fractional reserve lending!), so on this issue regardless of the politics, the "possession in 90% of the law" seems to apply.

Whoever has access to the funds gets to decide what to do with it, eg. forge or not, which version or not.

Of course, if DGEX wants to reflect the will of his customers, he could setup a vote, weighed by the amount in their accounts and forge proportionally to each block. That is the math based way to defuse the politics around this

James
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: crimi on August 16, 2014, 09:50:28 pm
@Graviton
Quote
What exactly will cause the bad rep? NXT community choosing to reverse an undeniable, large hack just once?

Did you miss vericoin? They are done in cryptoworld.

Nxt is not vericoin.

http://www.cryptocoinsnews.com/news/vericoin-developer-believe-nxt-chain-rolled-back/2014/08/15 (http://www.cryptocoinsnews.com/news/vericoin-developer-believe-nxt-chain-rolled-back/2014/08/15)

VeriCoin Developer: “The NXT Chain Should Not Be Rolled Back”
Quote
“Because of this, I believe that the NXT chain should not be rolled back. We rolled back not to save the owners who held coin on Mintpal, but to preserve the integrity of the chain by preventing an illicit holder from attacking it.”

If there is no technical reason devs can not manipulate the blockchain.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Come-from-Beyond on August 16, 2014, 09:52:35 pm
I've checked

https://blockchain.info/address/1BCN1ugdKdWd9pQ8Am9hMhtHZfmbXzxE8a

and

https://blockchain.info/address/125EJ3HYXNZ8swr2UBcvKNBV2voAYACFu9

No messages from BCNext here. He would say us what to do - to fork or not to fork. At least this worked the last time. Maybe he just has not heard about the hack yet.  ;D
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: zingzong on August 16, 2014, 09:53:26 pm
can we get this straight. Does it make a difference how much we are forging with?? if not anyone with more than one computer , get them all running 1-2-5f.
Also how do i get this running on the mac client, new to macs.

zingzong, welcome to the community! I see your account is less than half a day old. Your enthusiasm for Nxt is admirable, but I would would trust your input and your cheerleading more if you had some "age" behind your opinions.

Actually QTBC iv been into NXT since November 2013 well before this forum even existed, paid between 700 - 1400 sats so ill ignore that thanx
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: TheWireMaster on August 16, 2014, 09:58:36 pm
1.2.5f already forging...
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Graviton on August 16, 2014, 09:59:41 pm
Did you miss vericoin? They are done in cryptoworld.
Yes I missed it. Quite a cultivated opinion. I suspect the "being done" part was not caused by the rollback.

The vericoin guy suggests the same I did: at most, blacklist the hacker’s address and make those coins ‘disappear’ from the chain.. That would be the fairest and absolutely the best course of action from NXT's self-interest point of view also (taking 50M off distribution, plus 50M off future sell pressure) yet not zeroing out the effects of the hack to the ones responsible. Very elaborate.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Coradan on August 16, 2014, 10:00:59 pm
1.2.5f forging!  All is ok: Number the NXT, number de Assets,...!  This solution would be easier and cheaper!
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: zingzong on August 16, 2014, 10:05:49 pm
@Graviton
Quote
What exactly will cause the bad rep? NXT community choosing to reverse an undeniable, large hack just once?

Did you miss vericoin? They are done in cryptoworld.

Nxt is not vericoin.

http://www.cryptocoinsnews.com/news/vericoin-developer-believe-nxt-chain-rolled-back/2014/08/15 (http://www.cryptocoinsnews.com/news/vericoin-developer-believe-nxt-chain-rolled-back/2014/08/15)

VeriCoin Developer: “The NXT Chain Should Not Be Rolled Back”
Quote
“Because of this, I believe that the NXT chain should not be rolled back. We rolled back not to save the owners who held coin on Mintpal, but to preserve the integrity of the chain by preventing an illicit holder from attacking it.”

If there is no technical reason devs can not manipulate the blockchain.

Yeah but whats being proposed isnt a rollback. its a fork which just freezes the hackers stolen nxt
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: apenzl on August 16, 2014, 10:07:04 pm
A 200 BTC "bounty" for the Nxt Community if we choose 1.2.5ef? Amazing.
I've been in a moral dilemma until now, but wtf??! It looks to me as BTer wants to buy the community will. I don't like being bribed.

I vote 1 > 2.
And of course for James' #4. Well thought out.

Just on a side note:
It's a VERY slippery slope Graviton... Very. (besides you wanting to use CUSTOMER deposits, which aren't yours!)

Forging for NXT > Fine.
Choosing blockchain history with customer funds is something else.
Nxters haven't chosen your exchange to make you decide for them in important matters like this. Maybe you should act carefully?

Same thing goes for forging hub admins - they should post their plan / choice of NRS here, ASAP. Imho.

I've checked

https://blockchain.info/address/1BCN1ugdKdWd9pQ8Am9hMhtHZfmbXzxE8a

and

https://blockchain.info/address/125EJ3HYXNZ8swr2UBcvKNBV2voAYACFu9

No messages from BCNext here. He would say us what to do - to fork or not to fork. At least this worked the last time. Maybe he just has not heard about the hack yet.  ;D
Wasn't Santa dead???   ;D
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: zingzong on August 16, 2014, 10:07:47 pm
Has anyone ascertained if it makes a difference how much is in yr wallet?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: apenzl on August 16, 2014, 10:10:41 pm
Actually QTBC iv been into NXT since November 2013 well before this forum even existed, paid between 700 - 1400 sats so ill ignore that thanx

Has anyone ascertained if it makes a difference how much is in yr wallet?

 ???
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: zingzong on August 16, 2014, 10:12:34 pm
Actually QTBC iv been into NXT since November 2013 well before this forum even existed, paid between 700 - 1400 sats so ill ignore that thanx

Has anyone ascertained if it makes a difference how much is in yr wallet?

 ???

as in how much yr forging with when on 1-2-5f
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: zuqka on August 16, 2014, 10:12:59 pm
Actually QTBC iv been into NXT since November 2013 well before this forum even existed, paid between 700 - 1400 sats so ill ignore that thanx

Has anyone ascertained if it makes a difference how much is in yr wallet?

 ???

hehe ;D
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: rickyjames on August 16, 2014, 10:15:01 pm
I propose free escrow service to do option 1.

This is how it should be done:

1. I publish my BTC and NXT accounts
2. BTER sends 200 BTC to my BTC account (after that it doesn't control these coins)
3. We are waiting for a reply from the hacker (24 hours), the reply must be a public message with his BTC account from NXT-8WJ7-8A2H-MBYN-3W9K4 to my NXT account
4. The hacker sends 46'662'000 NXT to my account
5. I send 200 BTC to his BTC account
6. I send 46+ M NXT to BTER cold wallet that already got 5 M NXT

So, if the hacker trusts me we could do it this way (the 200 BTC are not mine anyway if he worries that I could break the deal).


@ thesircom:

This is BY FAR the best deal you are going to get.  The only other ways this plays out is either BTC is given not to you but instead to others to hunt you down, or NXT is taken away from your control.   Or both.

DO THIS.  DO IT WHILE YOU STILL CAN.  DO IT NOW.

Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Graviton on August 16, 2014, 10:17:20 pm
Choosing blockchain history with customer funds is something else.
Nxters haven't chosen your exchange to make you decide for them in important matters like this. Maybe you should act carefully?
I do.

Should you read more carefully? ;)

apparently it doesn't make difference if you forge on a node with 1 NXT or 29 million NXT. So I can forge with my 1 NXT and not the exchange funds.

Has anyone ascertained if it makes a difference how much is in yr wallet?
No. Just rumors. Excellent question.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: apenzl on August 16, 2014, 10:21:00 pm
Should you read more carefully? ;)

I should. Too much catching up. Done.  :)
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: starik69 on August 16, 2014, 10:41:41 pm
BTER guy behaves very strangly.  :o
First - supports reorg, then refuses it in twitter.  ::) Now again supports 1.2.5f.  :-[
And ignores most questions about hacker.  >:(
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Coradan on August 16, 2014, 10:41:53 pm
I propose free escrow service to do option 1.

This is how it should be done:

1. I publish my BTC and NXT accounts
2. BTER sends 200 BTC to my BTC account (after that it doesn't control these coins)
3. We are waiting for a reply from the hacker (24 hours), the reply must be a public message with his BTC account from NXT-8WJ7-8A2H-MBYN-3W9K4 to my NXT account
4. The hacker sends 46'662'000 NXT to my account
5. I send 200 BTC to his BTC account
6. I send 46+ M NXT to BTER cold wallet that already got 5 M NXT

So, if the hacker trusts me we could do it this way (the 200 BTC are not mine anyway if he worries that I could break the deal).



CfB, you can delete the point 3 perhaps, I think it is not neccesary...  and you can write the point 5: I send 200 BTC to his BTC account (13UZjKkhHWyTmQ4mx28WT5Wj1zw4pEByZw)
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: johnna on August 16, 2014, 10:48:03 pm
Option 1 (or option 2) only, as I already said, it was BTer's fault, not a NXT's one.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: LeChatNoir on August 16, 2014, 10:53:40 pm
If NXT hard fork succeeds trust in NXT will evaporate and market cap will decrease by 20% minimum.
20% of 30M $ is 6M $ of value which is destroyed just to recover 1.5M $ from the hacker, this is a very stupid move.
Why would a rational stakeholder want to pay the bill for BTER mistake?

I'm forging on the original blockchain and i will dump my stake if the hard fork option 3 succeeds.
I'm sorry for NXT users who will lose money because of this.

I vote for option 1, give the hacker 24 hours and after that go with option 2 if he doesn't accept the deal.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: WolfofCrypto on August 16, 2014, 10:59:36 pm
I can add a twist to this

They should put the asset on the Exchange Asset VS BTC this way people can sell at no loss and the token is exchangeable for all therefore it makes no difference.

What could be very shocking is if the token gets more  value than NXT itself

there are some other options to bring stability to this proposal as well which would mean less financial stress to Bter

If they would look at my concept well somebody has James

it's wrong of Bter to expect NXT to totaly damage itself by doig forks and rollback that means NXT drops to the floor this would then mean Bter is able to buy highly reduced NXT to refund users as NXT would be killed rollback or fork its the same kill the image of NXT

2 options

Bter has the cash flot

Create asset token with some legal requirements via the asset exchange.

This safety net has enormous marketing potential and will rebuild trust for users in Bter



The fourth solution:

Issue 51.x million stolenNXT assets and distribute them proportionally to the people who had the deposits in bter. This idea I copied from Lee.

Now, if any negotiations/bounty hunting/etc. gets all the NXT back, it is simple, put a bid on NXT AE at 1 NXT per 1 stolenNXT. 5 million NXT has already been recovered, so the initial bid should be ~0.1 NXT per stolenNXT. Those that are happy to recoup anything are then free to accept this bid, they get a guaranteed 10% back, the others will get a higher chance for full recovery.

Since full recovery from hacker is no 100% certain event, it is bter's responsibility to makegood the difference. This is what Tristan at Poloniex did, though 100 BTC vs 50 million NXT is so much different we cant compare the two, still bter used to be a significant exchange and if it can come up with a plan to make everybody whole, it will survive this. If not, I estimate chances of bter to become an irrelevant small exchange to be 90%+

sorry, freeworm, this is the reality. If bter does not have a plan that will make its depositors whole, you will lose 90%+ of all your other trading volumes and I doubt you will survive.

So, it is in bter's interest to make sure all NXT holders are repaid. I understand 50 45 million NXT is enormous amount, but if you can assure people that in spite of this impossible situation you have a plan with very good chance of success, then bter will become very well respected and will be able to not only survive but even become more popular.

This is what needs to be done. Allocate HALF your revenues to repurchase the stolenNXT. Each week, increase the bid for the stolenNXT by half your revenues added to the repurchase amount. So if you are doing 10000 BTC of trading in a week, at 0.2% commission on each side, 20 BTC is added to the bid of the stolenNXT. this will not be much of a change for one week, but over time, especially if your volumes grow as this becomes a way for the general crypto community to help out just by using bter for their trading, cuz they can trust bter to makegood. If your trading volumes double, then you actually are making the same revenues. Much better than 90% reductions.

let us work the numbers.

20 BTC @ 15000 NXT/BTC is 300,000 NXT per week, this is 150 weeks or three years. A long, long time, but this is much better than never.

Also, I expect that as the bid for the stolenNXT keeps increasing, more and more people will be selling and every sale below 1:1 is reducing this debt, so I estimate that if you can be adding 300K NXT per week, it will actually clear out the debt in closer to a year's time. If you get massive positive PR and a sympathy trading business, then maybe it could be much faster.

I hope that freeworm will be realistic and open to this plan. I will help how I can for the structuring of this

James
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: joseginxt on August 16, 2014, 11:08:49 pm
The hacker may not answer whether their work was 'hijack' 50 million NXT to cause a large drop in price or volatility.

Who are you that could be interested?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Coradan on August 16, 2014, 11:14:00 pm
Match Results:
1.2.5: 112 - 17 :1.2.5f

Go, Go!!!
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: thesircom on August 16, 2014, 11:14:47 pm
1. too low.
2. not possible.
3. kills nxt.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Coradan on August 16, 2014, 11:17:03 pm
1. too low.
2. not possible.
3. kills nxt.

hehehe!
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Jacinto on August 16, 2014, 11:18:36 pm
Here we go again.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Costner on August 16, 2014, 11:18:44 pm
Option nr 1 is the only viable option.

Option 1 is the baddest one.
I choose 2 or 3
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Wakasaki808 on August 16, 2014, 11:20:34 pm
1. too low.
2. not possible.
3. kills nxt.

ITS YOUUUUU!!!!  :)

what would you want then?

may i suggest Come-from-Beyond's proposal maybe the deal could be sweetened on Bter's side

I propose free escrow service to do option 1.

This is how it should be done:

1. I publish my BTC and NXT accounts
2. BTER sends 200 BTC to my BTC account (after that it doesn't control these coins)
3. We are waiting for a reply from the hacker (24 hours), the reply must be a public message with his BTC account from NXT-8WJ7-8A2H-MBYN-3W9K4 to my NXT account
4. The hacker sends 46'662'000 NXT to my account
5. I send 200 BTC to his BTC account
6. I send 46+ M NXT to BTER cold wallet that already got 5 M NXT

So, if the hacker trusts me we could do it this way (the 200 BTC are not mine anyway if he worries that I could break the deal).

Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: seek4dream on August 16, 2014, 11:21:30 pm
can we really "choose" No. 1?
Bter and hacker have a deal?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Isildur23 on August 16, 2014, 11:22:02 pm
1. too low.
2. not possible.
3. kills nxt.
Do you really care about the price, or you just want to make bter suffer?
p.s. I am just curious, as i lost some Nxt in bter...
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: mczarnek on August 16, 2014, 11:22:53 pm
Option 2... why would you release a statement saying cancel fork, we have him.. if you don't have him?

I propose free escrow service to do option 1.

This is how it should be done:

1. I publish my BTC and NXT accounts
2. BTER sends 200 BTC to my BTC account (after that it doesn't control these coins)
3. We are waiting for a reply from the hacker (24 hours), the reply must be a public message with his BTC account from NXT-8WJ7-8A2H-MBYN-3W9K4 to my NXT account
4. The hacker sends 46'662'000 NXT to my account
5. I send 200 BTC to his BTC account
6. I send 46+ M NXT to BTER cold wallet that already got 5 M NXT

So, if the hacker trusts me we could do it this way (the 200 BTC are not mine anyway if he worries that I could break the deal).


I'd screw you over if asked to escrow like this.. unfortunately, I can vouch that Come-From-Beyond would follow through.

1. too low.
2. not possible.
3. kills nxt.

You have a counter-offer?  By holding onto the Nxt people flee and it also kills Nxt.  I'd prefer to kill it on our terms and screw you over if it comes down to it.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: hash on August 16, 2014, 11:27:38 pm
1. too low.
2. not possible.
3. kills nxt.

An unexpected supporter of the no-fork proponents  :o
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Jacinto on August 16, 2014, 11:28:52 pm
1. too low.
2. not possible.
3. kills nxt.

An unexpected supporter of the no-fork proponents  :o

Who would expect this?!  ::)
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: thesircom on August 16, 2014, 11:32:48 pm
you are from Chojnice, Poland?
No. Right now - I'm from Hamilton, Canada.

An unexpected supporter of the no-fork proponents  :o

Indeed.

You have a counter-offer?
At least double it.

Whole 55mil NXT might not be worth 1.8mil right now, or next 6 months... but even me holding it - I don't see why it couldn't be back to 1.8mil in a year. I believe in NXT! :)

I don't need to get ride of them out any time soon, they can sit there..

If forks happens, then it happens. I eat my losses.

Either case - 200 BTC does't satisfy me.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Floater on August 16, 2014, 11:33:22 pm
We need the combination of 1 and 3, we as a community not a horde of scums need to put pressure on a cheeky criminal and show the world how internet justice is done.

I for myself I will buy NXT just to do the right thing with the F version. Everyone download please and pressure the tardball hacker. Remember it could be you after a trade on BTER who is now stuck.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: sava0123 on August 16, 2014, 11:34:54 pm
He didn't even prove that he is a hacker. Or am I missing something?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Wakasaki808 on August 16, 2014, 11:35:49 pm
He not even proved that he is a hacker. Or am I missing something?

the guy stated he knew passcodes for bter's accounts here prior to announcing it to bter in the nxt messanger

Lin used same password for 90% of his services including his linode account.

I'll be willing to give everything back if there is reward in btc from the profits Lin is making..

Complete lack of security.. same password for everything.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: sava0123 on August 16, 2014, 11:37:27 pm
He not even proved that he is a hacker. Or am I missing something?

the guy stated he knew passcodes for bter's accounts here prior to announcing it to bter in the nxt messanger

He said here that lin had same password for 90% of his services. And in nxt messanger were about 'dumping your md5 passwords'.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: eimon on August 16, 2014, 11:38:47 pm

 200 BTC does't satisfy me.

You already got 100 BTC, so with this 200 you'll be getting 300 total.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: skycontroller on August 16, 2014, 11:39:37 pm
Either case - 200 BTC does't satisfy me.

Nothing would satisfy you ...
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Jacinto on August 16, 2014, 11:40:05 pm
Ok, enough is enough, it is time to make him to "eat his losses".

Pls, lets make justice as a community and lets forge with the 1.2.5f client:


https://nxtforum.org/nrs-releases/nrs-v1-2-5f/ (https://nxtforum.org/nrs-releases/nrs-v1-2-5f/)

Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: yassin54 on August 16, 2014, 11:40:20 pm
What do you want as deal
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: EvilDave on August 16, 2014, 11:40:56 pm
I was around for the first few hours after the theft, and I'm pretty damn certain that thesircom is the happy holder of the NXT....K4 account.
And lots of BTERs BTC....
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: sava0123 on August 16, 2014, 11:41:46 pm
I was around for the first few hours after the theft, and I'm pretty damn certain that thesir is the happy holder of the NXT....K4 account.
And lots of BTERs BTC....

Proofs?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Wakasaki808 on August 16, 2014, 11:42:53 pm
What do you want as deal

at least 400btc


You have a counter-offer?
At least double it.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: nextcafe on August 16, 2014, 11:44:51 pm
Can we get bter people in here to start negotiating, so we can get a quick resolution between both parties.

Anyone have @freeworm on speed dial?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: eimon on August 16, 2014, 11:45:04 pm
What do you want as deal

thesir said double the 200btc offer

He said "at least" double. If you offer him 400 he'll demand 800, and so on. I say stick with the 200 (which is actually 300) and tell him to take it or leave it. Let him try to sell the 45M NXT and see how that goes.

EDIT: Of course it's up to Bter whether to negotiate on price. You there Bter?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: yassin54 on August 16, 2014, 11:46:23 pm
What do you want as deal

thesir said double the 200btc offer
be specific
how want?

for me yu are note serious man
you have not respect deal
yur are hungry
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: TimmyD on August 16, 2014, 11:47:11 pm
why not return 40mill and keep 5,mill then we can concentrate on making nxt 1$
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Darkmoon on August 16, 2014, 11:47:40 pm
I think option #2 is viable. He has left a lot of traces, and for 300 BTC people will find him.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: EvilDave on August 16, 2014, 11:48:22 pm
I was around for the first few hours after the theft, and I'm pretty damn certain that thesir is the happy holder of the NXT....K4 account.
And lots of BTERs BTC....

Proofs?

Hmmm....good question. No, I'm not 100% certain, but the timing of thesircoms messages and their content ties in with the thiefs actions yesterday.

@thesircom
Simple proof test:
Send the AM: 'EvilDave is a complete plonker' to my sig account from the K4 account, please.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: skycontroller on August 16, 2014, 11:49:17 pm
I go for option X: outlawed manhunt of whatever hides behind the alias 'thesircom'.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: frohlocke on August 16, 2014, 11:50:34 pm
Provide Token?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: cbw on August 16, 2014, 11:51:31 pm
1. too low.
You have deal with BTER - they pay 100 BTC, you refunds 50kk NXT. BTER fulfilled the terms of a deal. May be answer for your words and follow the terms of a deal? And I did not see any reason why BTER do transfer to you another 200BTC or 400BTC - you again do not fulfill the terms of a deal.
PS Those who do not keep their word - do not respect anybody, even the criminal world.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: sava0123 on August 16, 2014, 11:51:36 pm
I was around for the first few hours after the theft, and I'm pretty damn certain that thesir is the happy holder of the NXT....K4 account.
And lots of BTERs BTC....

Proofs?

Hmmm....good question. No, I'm not 100% certain, but the timing of thesircoms messages and their content ties in with the thiefs actions yesterday.

@thesircom
Simple proof test:
Send the AM: 'EvilDave is a complete plonker' to my sig account from the K4 account, please.

He being asked to make a token right after his first post here. But we get nothing.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Isildur23 on August 16, 2014, 11:51:58 pm
you are from Chojnice, Poland?
No. Right now - I'm from Hamilton, Canada.

An unexpected supporter of the no-fork proponents  :o

Indeed.

You have a counter-offer?
At least double it.

Whole 55mil NXT might not be worth 1.8mil right now, or next 6 months... but even me holding it - I don't see why it couldn't be back to 1.8mil in a year. I believe in NXT! :)

I don't need to get ride of them out any time soon, they can sit there..

If forks happens, then it happens. I eat my losses.

Either case - 200 BTC does't satisfy me.
Why waiting and having so much headache with that "dirty" NXTs, when you can accept 200BTC and buy "clean" and cheap NXT now? Btw we need developers, and you seem like a very smart guy (and are still anonymous), you can join the developers, be paid, and make your "clean" NXTs worth much more than 1m $!
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: skycontroller on August 16, 2014, 11:56:56 pm
is it just me or who else finds it ridiculous how mildly and rosy people talk to a dirty thief when they want their money back.

return the funds or BURN. that are your choices.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: sava0123 on August 16, 2014, 11:58:57 pm
is it just me or who else finds it ridiculous how mildly and rosy people talk to a dirty thief when they want their money back.

return the funds or BURN. that are your choices.

How could one possibly be rude to a person named 'Sir'?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: TimmyD on August 16, 2014, 11:59:01 pm
best for both worlds is he returns 45mill and keep 5 mill. bter could handle a aller loss. theif gets 5 mill to hodl
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Costner on August 17, 2014, 12:00:35 am
1. too low.
2. not possible.
3. kills nxt.
????????????????????????
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: skycontroller on August 17, 2014, 12:01:33 am
is it just me or who else finds it ridiculous how mildly and rosy people talk to a dirty thief when they want their money back.

return the funds or BURN. that are your choices.

How could one possibly be rude to a person named 'Sir'?

he's a littly pussy hiding behind swiss vpn, fake nick and his screen. there is nothing behind all this but a wimpy man who feels big now for a while. it's ridiculous...
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: TheSirsPenis on August 17, 2014, 12:03:10 am
I am small :(
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: skycontroller on August 17, 2014, 12:03:27 am
best for both worlds is he returns 45mill and keep 5 mill. bter could handle a aller loss. theif gets 5 mill to hodl

if the community sends 1 more NXT or BTC to this miserable being I am going to facepalm eternally.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Floater on August 17, 2014, 12:06:07 am
Many say here oh the hacker is so clever. Than how can he not figure out simply that BTER does not have as much profit he thinks they have. He is completely irrational at demands who needs to be exterminated , and I will give 1 BTC in a bounty to get him if collection starts.

It is simple math 0.36% * 300BTC daily average volume is their daily profit, so about 1 BTC. 300BTC hurts them a lot. Most certainly more than a whole years of profit after expenses, salaries and they learn an expensive lesson on internet security. Altough they were dumb at handling our money, but at least they are doing the right thing and do not do a runner with the rest.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: rtrtcrypto on August 17, 2014, 12:06:26 am
If everyone calms down and stops giving him the dramatic show and histrionics he is looking for he will skip to the next logical step in this game... to accept the bitcoin and return the NXT so that he doesn't destroy the price of the currency and so that he can sleep well at night.

Return 40 million NXT... keep 5 million and take 200 more BTC. That's 300 BTC and 5 million NXT - there is a good chance he will both be alive to enjoy it in 5 years time AND that the price will rebound.

Any other scenario and there is extreme risk involved. It's time to accept the payday and move on in a way that still works two years from now.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Isildur23 on August 17, 2014, 12:06:48 am

Whole 55mil NXT might not be worth 1.8mil right now, or next 6 months... but even me holding it - I don't see why it couldn't be back to 1.8mil in a year. I believe in NXT! :)

I don't need to get ride of them out any time soon, they can sit there..

If forks happens, then it happens. I eat my losses.

Either case - 200 BTC does't satisfy me.
So you didn't steal them to intentionally hurt Nxt?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: qqNxt on August 17, 2014, 12:10:53 am
I vote 1 and I hope hacker complies.
I don't want any deaths. People are greedy but people will also go insane for greed. You can't just trust people  on the internet to hunt safely.

This post needs to be published across the web so the hacker sees his options.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Ludom on August 17, 2014, 12:11:03 am
MIC is interested : https://nxtforum.org/assets-board/%28ann%29%28micoin%29the-most-interesting-coin-in-the-world-pure-90-pom/msg84866/#msg84866
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: msin on August 17, 2014, 12:12:16 am

Whole 55mil NXT might not be worth 1.8mil right now, or next 6 months... but even me holding it - I don't see why it couldn't be back to 1.8mil in a year. I believe in NXT! :)

I don't need to get ride of them out any time soon, they can sit there..

If forks happens, then it happens. I eat my losses.

Either case - 200 BTC does't satisfy me.
So you didn't steal them to intentionally hurt Nxt?

This is about profit, not intentionally hurting Nxt.  Anyway, I think it's best to put that 200BTC towards a bounty to hunt him down.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: bidji29 on August 17, 2014, 12:14:53 am
Thar's right. 300 btc is probably more than 6 months profits for BTER.
They don't have that much volume and they have a team + server to pay.
I think they may have some BTC in reserve but the 200+ deal is probably the most they can allow themselve to give instantly
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: xyzzyx on August 17, 2014, 12:15:17 am
1. too low.
2. not possible.
3. kills nxt.

I choose kill nxt.  HTH.

(http://i.imgur.com/6qzjyrn.gif)
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Ludom on August 17, 2014, 12:16:20 am
What will kill Nxt ?

Nothing. Nxt is a community with a lot of solidarity. The motherfucker hacker will not kill us. It's sure !!!

What is 50 mio of NXT ? He can dump it. Since the beginning of NXT a big part is dump, all the next were dump.

Let's go to the future. And remember him ! We will catch him one day.


I really like the idea of JL777. We can make a solution with our assets. We can make a big big reward to catch the hacker.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Wakasaki808 on August 17, 2014, 12:18:57 am
I was around for the first few hours after the theft, and I'm pretty damn certain that thesir is the happy holder of the NXT....K4 account.
And lots of BTERs BTC....

Proofs?

Hmmm....good question. No, I'm not 100% certain, but the timing of thesircoms messages and their content ties in with the thiefs actions yesterday.

@thesircom
Simple proof test:
Send the AM: 'EvilDave is a complete plonker' to my sig account from the K4 account, please.


eyyyy

thesircom responded lol

https://nxtblocks.info/#section/txid/15478816768324662561

"EvilDave is a complete plonker"

or if anything the real hacker is reading the forums.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: nextcafe on August 17, 2014, 12:20:24 am
Thar's right. 300 btc is probably more than 6 months profits for BTER.
They don't have that much volume and they have a team + server to pay.
I think they may have some BTC in reserve but the 200+ deal is probably the most they can allow themselve to give instantly

Well, if they don't make their users whole they are out of business anyway.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: rickyjames on August 17, 2014, 12:22:21 am
If everyone calms down and stops giving him the dramatic show and histrionics he is looking for he will skip to the next logical step in this game... to accept the bitcoin and return the NXT so that he doesn't destroy the price of the currency and so that he can sleep well at night.

Return 40 million NXT... keep 5 million and take 200 more BTC. That's 300 BTC and 5 million NXT - there is a good chance he will both be alive to enjoy it in 5 years time AND that the price will rebound.

Any other scenario and there is extreme risk involved. It's time to accept the payday and move on in a way that still works two years from now.

I agree wholeheartedly with your initial statement.  I would also extend it to stop giving him offers of additional rewards.

Sir, thanks for showing up and joining the party.  This is between you and Bter.  Please wait until we get Bter here.

We've got to get a lead negotiator established here.  It needs to be Bter.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: jl777 on August 17, 2014, 12:23:14 am
Thar's right. 300 btc is probably more than 6 months profits for BTER.
They don't have that much volume and they have a team + server to pay.
I think they may have some BTC in reserve but the 200+ deal is probably the most they can allow themselve to give instantly

Well, if they don't make their users whole they are out of business anyway.
Hence the fourth solution is the only rational choice, plus it is backwards compatible with any of the other solutions
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: OnlytheTruth on August 17, 2014, 12:23:18 am
Do not negotiate with a thief. Life is much easier with a principle. Fork the chain. BTER has to give a bounty of 200 BTC to a trust escrow catch or "HURT" the thief. PLUS 100 BTC from people who recover fund from the fork. The bounty stays active indefinitely.

There will be 300 BTC bounty on his head FOREVER. I don't believe he has no trace, not when 300 btc = 1 or 2 million $. IF the community pressures BTER to negotiate, there will be an active campaign against NXT for tolerating and supporting thief and dirty scumbags of this world. NXT will be done for.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Ludom on August 17, 2014, 12:26:08 am
Thar's right. 300 btc is probably more than 6 months profits for BTER.
They don't have that much volume and they have a team + server to pay.
I think they may have some BTC in reserve but the 200+ deal is probably the most they can allow themselve to give instantly

Well, if they don't make their users whole they are out of business anyway.
Hence the fourth solution is the only rational choice, plus it is backwards compatible with any of the other solutions

+ 1440
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Darkmoon on August 17, 2014, 12:28:43 am
Do not negotiate with a thief. Life is much easier with a principle. Fork the chain. BTER has to give a bounty of 200 BTC to a trust escrow catch or "HURT" the thief. PLUS 100 BTC from people who recover fund from the fork. The bounty stays active indefinitely.

There will be 300 BTC bounty on his head FOREVER. I don't believe he has no trace, not when 300 btc = 1 or 2 million $. IF the community pressures BTER to negotiate, there will be an active campaign against NXT for tolerating and supporting thief and dirty scumbags of this world. NXT will be done for.

Agreed!
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Jack Needles on August 17, 2014, 12:30:26 am
Nxt Wallet for Mac with 1.2.5f core
https://nxtforum.org/index.php?topic=4496.msg84883#msg84883
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: ElliottHe on August 17, 2014, 12:30:45 am
Do not negotiate with a thief. Life is much easier with a principle. Fork the chain. BTER has to give a bounty of 200 BTC to a trust escrow catch or "HURT" the thief. PLUS 100 BTC from people who recover fund from the fork. The bounty stays active indefinitely.

There will be 300 BTC bounty on his head FOREVER. I don't believe he has no trace, not when 300 btc = 1 or 2 million $. IF the community pressures BTER to negotiate, there will be an active campaign against NXT for tolerating and supporting thief and dirty scumbags of this world. NXT will be done for.

+1
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Ezravdb on August 17, 2014, 12:30:49 am
I choose 1.

Because that's the only way to win credibility and a little bit trust from the customers of Bter.

Bter will lose some money, but it will be a win - win situation after a while.

Other choices are risky and can hurt NXT as a whole. And NXT isn't guilty at all.

But. This time we need something like an escrow!

This
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: rickyjames on August 17, 2014, 12:31:04 am
Nevermind.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: ejt009 on August 17, 2014, 12:31:12 am
2 and 3

A deal was already made and he broke it.  There should be no more negotiations IMO.  Best option is to try and track him down and have him arrested.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: EvilDave on August 17, 2014, 12:31:20 am
He's right, I am:

https://nxtblocks.info/#section/txid/15478816768324662561

Shall we just assume that thesircom really is the K4 holder?
But just don't make any payments to any address that isn't specified in an AM from the K4 account.

Now, can we have the NXT back, please?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: rickyjames on August 17, 2014, 12:34:17 am
2 and 3

A deal was already made and he broke it.  There should be no more negotiations IMO.  Best option is to try and track him down and have him arrested.

Let me tell you from my current efforts on another hit I took six weeks ago that an arrest is easier said than done.  But that wasn't the loss of so very much from very many, either.

Sir is going to get identified in real life sooner rather than later.  We are going to need to reevaluate what our situation once we have him identified.  Almost certainly we can get his passport pulled and isolated in one country - he is a terrorist.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: sparta_cuss on August 17, 2014, 12:35:03 am

...

Hence the fourth solution is the only rational choice, plus it is backwards compatible with any of the other solutions

Why are you concerned with backwards compatibility, anyway?  ;)
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: nextcafe on August 17, 2014, 12:35:21 am
IF the community pressures BTER to negotiate, there will be an active campaign against NXT for tolerating and supporting thief and dirty scumbags of this world. NXT will be done for.

If the community pressures BTER to negotiate?

How does rejecting a hard fork of a functioning ecosystem based on the security flaws of an exchange equate to pressuring Bter to negotiate?

Bter is responsible for the negotiations thus far and this thread was started by one of their employees.

Everyone wants a resolution to this that makes bter users whole and keeps the existing chain intact so that Nxt can thrive as it aught to.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: rickyjames on August 17, 2014, 12:36:10 am
Hi Sparta_Cuss, I owe you an email to get NAOP rolling again.  This weekend, I promise. 
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: sparta_cuss on August 17, 2014, 12:36:55 am
Hi Sparta_Cuss, I owe you an email to get NAOP rolling again.  This weekend, I promise.

I think we're all a bit busy right now.  :)  No worries, and no rush.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Coradan on August 17, 2014, 12:37:08 am
Match Results:
1.2.5: 94 - 13 :1.2.5f
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Yuzu on August 17, 2014, 12:38:21 am
2 and 3

A deal was already made and he broke it.  There should be no more negotiations IMO. 

This.  One thousand times.

I'm sorry this is my first post on the forum, but I'm not much of a talker.  I do know that thesir is a liar.  If he gets some BTC he'll demand more.  We've already seen that.  I don't think a fork is the best option, but I also don't believe NXT will die.  It will stumble, true.  But it will go forward.  I hate a thief, and I'm not down for giving him any more money.

He's made the mistake of thinking he has more power than he really does.  Let's not let him totally control the situation.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: rickyjames on August 17, 2014, 12:38:27 am

Everyone wants a resolution to this that makes bter users whole and keeps the existing chain intact so that Nxt can thrive as it aught to.

Yes.  Do not loose sight of this goal.  Nor do we want Bter destroyed.

Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: tersagun on August 17, 2014, 12:40:09 am
Guys, I'm back at home and it's already too late so I cannot follow all the new posts.
Can someone please let me know what happened in the last 24 hours?

When I left, BTER asked for no rollback: Why would BTER actually want no rollback anyway? Are they really so idealistic that they don't want to hurt NXT ecosystem even if it means their bankrupt?
Was it BTER who sent the additional 90+BTC to the thiefs account without receiving the remaining 45M NXT? If so, why haven't they continue with 10BTC for 5M NXT?
Are some people (around half of the community) still against any kind of hardfork/rollback/blacklist?
I see a new version of "f"; do most people agree on this one?


Thank you in advance and sorry for my laziness but it's already 03:39 and I can hardly keep my eyes open :-)
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: OnlytheTruth on August 17, 2014, 12:41:37 am
IF the community pressures BTER to negotiate, there will be an active campaign against NXT for tolerating and supporting thief and dirty scumbags of this world. NXT will be done for.

If the community pressures BTER to negotiate?

How does rejecting a hard fork of a functioning ecosystem based on the security flaws of an exchange equate to pressuring Bter to negotiate?

Bter is responsible for the negotiations thus far and this thread was started by one of their employees.

Everyone wants a resolution to this that makes bter users whole and keeps the existing chain intact so that Nxt can thrive as it aught to.

It is not about BTER or its lack of security. They will have to pay dearly anyway. It is about the community's response to the thief's demand or a general response to these type of behaviors. I don't approve a community that tolerating and supporting thief and ransom for the ideological sake. Many will agree with me.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: AreYouCereal on August 17, 2014, 12:43:45 am
how to run the 1.2.5.f version on mac?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: EvilDave on August 17, 2014, 12:44:47 am
Guys, I'm back at home and it's already too late so I cannot follow all the new posts.
Can someone please let me know what happened in the last 24 hours?

When I left, BTER asked for no rollback: Why would BTER actually want no rollback anyway? Are they really so idealistic that they don't want to hurt NXT ecosystem even if it means their bankrupt?
Was it BTER who sent the additional 90+BTC to the thiefs account without receiving the remaining 45M NXT? If so, why haven't they continue with 10BTC for 5M NXT?
Are some people (around half of the community) still against any kind of hardfork/rollback/blacklist?
I see a new version of "f"; do most people agree on this one?


Thank you in advance and sorry for my laziness but it's already 03:39 and I can hardly keep my eyes open :-)
My advice would be to go to bed....like i'm going to do.

Yes, BTER send the 90 BTC without waiting for thief to return anything.
BTER now big fans of rollback/re-org, but I'm pretty sure it won't happen.
Looks like 10-15% for re-org (1.2.5f NRS) and 85-90% for the main chain (1.2.5 and older)
http://www.peerexplorer.com/

Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: tersagun on August 17, 2014, 12:46:28 am

My advice would be to go to bed....like i'm going to do.

Yes, BTER send the 90 BTC without waiting for thief to return anything.
BTER now big fans of rollback/re-org, but I'm pretty sure it won't happen.
Looks like 10-15% for re-org (1.2.5f NRS) and 85-90% for the main chain (1.2.5 and older)
http://www.peerexplorer.com/


Thanks mate.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: zingzong on August 17, 2014, 12:46:40 am
how to run the 1.2.5.f version on mac?
Also how do i get this running on the mac client, new to macs.

1. Download the client's .zip
2. Fire up Terminal.app then cd to your NXT client folder, e.g. cd ~/Downloads/nxt
3. ./run.sh
4. access via browser at http://localhost:7876
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: zingzong on August 17, 2014, 12:47:41 am
Tict Tock Tick Tock
come on thesir this has gone on long enough
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Ludom on August 17, 2014, 12:47:54 am
Good night!
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: OnlytheTruth on August 17, 2014, 12:48:47 am
IF the community pressures BTER to negotiate, there will be an active campaign against NXT for tolerating and supporting thief and dirty scumbags of this world. NXT will be done for.

If the community pressures BTER to negotiate?

How does rejecting a hard fork of a functioning ecosystem based on the security flaws of an exchange equate to pressuring Bter to negotiate?

Bter is responsible for the negotiations thus far and this thread was started by one of their employees.

Everyone wants a resolution to this that makes bter users whole and keeps the existing chain intact so that Nxt can thrive as it aught to.

It is not about BTER or its lack of security. They will have to pay dearly anyway. It is about the community's response to the thief's demand or a general response to these type of behaviors. I don't approve a community that tolerating and supporting thief and ransom for the ideological sake. Many will agree with me.

To be clear. BTER exchange would be difficult to survive in any case given the hit to its reputation. I don't approve BTER earlier blunder in sending him BTC. Negotiating with thief and giving them money is not the way to go. Thief have to be threatened and hurt so they no longer like to do their dirty deeds.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Jack Needles on August 17, 2014, 12:49:37 am
how to run the 1.2.5.f version on mac?

Another option:
https://nxtforum.org/index.php?topic=4496.msg84883#msg84883
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: cromaclear on August 17, 2014, 12:50:33 am
I've got all my nxt in bter. I think the best solution is the point made by James. Issue an asset, let it be trade freely with dividends bound to bter profits. Let's take risk to people who love risk and forget a rollback which damage the coin. The asset for nxtstolen is the best conduit to make money for bter and risk takers.
From my point of view, bter could raise money to issue the asset. In this way, people could participate in this bail out and take profits from it.
With the money from this IPO, bter could invest in new infrastructure to increase its service and get new users. Just let bter to issue a clear prospect about the plans for the invested money and payment of nxt stolen
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: maro.mueller on August 17, 2014, 12:50:58 am
If you all sell your NXT for crash, his hack is worth nothing. If you don't, he will sell all his NXT for crash and your coins are worth nothing. :)
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: qqNxt on August 17, 2014, 12:53:59 am
Why? Dgex has been forging from beginning, I think.
No, just occasionally unintended.

We are considering forging for 1.2.5f though with 29M.

lol, you deny that your exchange forges intentionally and then state that you are considering forging. Whatever  ::)

Wtf forging and mining are two different things. Anyone has control of any amount of Nxt should forge to protect their Nxt! Includes exchanges! That's the right thing to do!

But tbh you did freakd graviton abit lol.  DW You doing the right thing graviton!
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: subnav on August 17, 2014, 12:56:05 am
i don't have the answers but...

never deal with thieves (*especially* when they have already fucked you over once)

bter was incompetent with its security and then its negotiations. at this stage bter probably should not be trusted either

300BTC is a lot of money for a bounty and he has been sloppy. success is likely. plus a bounty shows strength and deters future hacks

i think we can all agree thesir probably has a small penis ;)
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: sparta_cuss on August 17, 2014, 12:59:36 am
I think it's a mistake to focus too much on the 50 million. There are many whales who, together, control far far more. How many of them are watching Nxt right now, prepared to dump many times 50 million if Nxt does something that causes them to lose faith in Nxt? It's a hypothetical question, of course, but it serves to remind us that not only do we not really know what the thief will do with his loot (dump, save, sell slowly), we have no idea what any of the other big and small investors will do. Thinking that we understand the thief's plans is just another trap of focusing too much on market price and not enough on the integrity of the product (which is amazing) and the story of decentralized, collaborative invention (which is also quite incredible).
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: nextcafe on August 17, 2014, 01:03:29 am
We need a hotline to the bter people right now!

They started this thread and should be considering option 4, if and 1 and 2 are not currently feasible.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: frohlocke on August 17, 2014, 01:04:50 am


i think we can all agree thesir probably has a small penis ;)

Agreed: His small penis is small. :D

Source
https://nxtblocks.info/#section/txid/2477617738393289065 (https://nxtblocks.info/#section/txid/2477617738393289065)
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: sparta_cuss on August 17, 2014, 01:19:27 am
I also like Option 4 (the James/Lee asset creation option). I had about 1% of my Nxt worth on Bter, which isn't much compared to many others. I would be willing to buy the stolenNXT equal to 2% of my Nxt worth. In fact, I'll send it now if someone wants to provide escrow. The commitment conditions include having an asset that is acceptable to James. He said he would write it up, so that should not be a problem. I would also like some commitments from Bter that they will clean up their act - put new security measures in place, and be audited by security experts, for example. This is something they would have to do, anyway, to regain the trust of potential investors.

Does Option 4 punish the thief or recover the NXT? No. But I don't think Option 3 is the way to go. Like QBTC and crimi, I am very suspicious of a plan so heavily promoted by the very exchange that was harmed. I do not want to set a precedent of letting centralized exchanges have so much influence over what Nxt does with its blockchain.

If this escrow thing and getting Option 4 off the ground is something that catches fire, we can iron out the details as we go. I just wanted to make a pledge of some funds to begin making Option 4 a reality. If you also support Option 4, speak up here and pledge something, a percentage or amount, so we can see where we are.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: WolfofCrypto on August 17, 2014, 01:20:11 am
Whats option 4

We need a hotline to the bter people right now!

They started this thread and should be considering option 4, if and 1 and 2 are not currently feasible.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: sparta_cuss on August 17, 2014, 01:22:24 am
Whats option 4

We need a hotline to the bter people right now!

They started this thread and should be considering option 4, if and 1 and 2 are not currently feasible.

Option 4 is the one James wrote up, inspired, he said, by your proposal, for Bter to issue a stolenNXT asset.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: jl777 on August 17, 2014, 01:25:53 am
I also like Option 4 (the James/Lee asset creation option). I had about 1% of my Nxt worth on Bter, which isn't much compared to many others. I would be willing to buy the stolenNXT equal to 2% of my Nxt worth. In fact, I'll send it now if someone wants to provide escrow. The commitment conditions include having an asset that is acceptable to James. He said he would write it up, so that should not be a problem. I would also like some commitments from Bter that they will clean up their act - put new security measures in place, and be audited by security experts, for example. This is something they would have to do, anyway, to regain the trust of potential investors.

Does Option 4 punish the thief or recover the NXT? No. But I don't think Option 3 is the way to go. Like QBTC and crimi, I am very suspicious of a plan so heavily promoted by the very exchange that was harmed. I do not want to set a precedent of letting centralized exchanges have so much influence over what Nxt does with it's blockchain.

If this escrow thing and getting Option 4 off the ground is something that catches fire, we can iron out the details as we go. I just wanted to make a pledge of some funds to begin making Option 4 a reality. If you also support Option 4, speak up here and pledge something, a percentage or amount, so we can see where we are.
As soon as there is enough support for option 4, I will issue the stolenNXT asset and I am assuming bter will be able to get me a list of accounts/amounts. If not, I am not sure how to properly distribute the stolenNXT

Once the stolenNXT is issued and distributed, then the free market decides when people want to collect on whatever bid there is.

I can keepsafe any funds raised, but really just need to put bids in AE no need to send any funds anywhere. As soon as I get the distribution list, the stolenNXT gets dividended out and the long road to clearing out the stolenNXT can begin. As soon as bter has purchased all the stolenNXT, this asset will cease to exist, I suggest that bter would send to genesis any stolenNXT they purchase back

James
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: rickyjames on August 17, 2014, 01:38:47 am

As soon as there is enough support for option 4, I will issue the stolenNXT asset and I am assuming bter will be able to get me a list of accounts/amounts.... As soon as bter has purchased all the stolenNXT, this asset will cease to exist, I suggest that bter would send to genesis any stolenNXT they purchase back

James

It looks to me like a new stolenNXT asset is effectively an installment plan for Bter to pay off their losses to their customers.  Unfortunately, this gives Bter a reason to want NXT price to go to near-zero so they can pay off as cheaply as possible.  Also, to pay off 45M NXT they've got to move around 4.5 billion NXT across their exchange to make enough in fees at 1% to make the payoff.  That's gonna take a while. 

If ever there was a time for a vote, it's BEFORE any new stolenNXT asset is issued.  The order here is NOT "create the asset, get the list of owners from Bter, distribute the asset to wronged Bter customers."   The order is "Get the list of wronged customers, do a vote to see if THEY want a stolenNXT asset to be issued, THEN do what the vote says".

I'll kick off the fun here - one vote per Bter customer or one vote per stolen NXT?

James, this mess isn't even 48 hours old and you are already taking on the role of a lawyer filing a class action suit.  You are truly a jack of all trades.   
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: rickyjames on August 17, 2014, 01:42:48 am
We need a hotline to the bter people right now!


freeworm is online.  But now thesircom is not.  Sigh.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: jl777 on August 17, 2014, 01:43:48 am

As soon as there is enough support for option 4, I will issue the stolenNXT asset and I am assuming bter will be able to get me a list of accounts/amounts.... As soon as bter has purchased all the stolenNXT, this asset will cease to exist, I suggest that bter would send to genesis any stolenNXT they purchase back

James

It looks to me like a new stolenNXT asset is effectively an installment plan for Bter to pay off their losses to their customers.  Unfortunately, this gives Bter a reason to want NXT price to go to near-zero so they can pay off as cheaply as possible.  Also, to pay off 45M NXT they've got to move around 4.5 billion NXT across their exchange to make enough in fees to make the payoff.  That's gonna take a while. 

If ever there was a time for a vote, it's BEFORE any new stolenNXT asset is issued.  The order here is NOT "create the asset, get the list of owners from Bter, distribute the asset to wronged Bter customers."   The order is "Get the list of wronged customers, do a vote to see if THEY want a stolenNXT asset to be issued, THEN do what the vote says".

I'll kick off the fun here - one vote per Bter customer or one vote per stolen NXT?

James, this mess isn't even 48 hours old and you are already taking on the role of a lawyer filing a class action suit.  You are truly a jack of all trades.   
I am just a simple C programmer trying to use some math to solve this. Also I am proposing a percentage from ALL of bter trade commissions, not just NXT. The are doing ~10000 BTC per week so that is 20 BTC per week if 50% goes to the repurchase. Estimated 3 year payback, but a lot of people will take the bid at a discount, so I am estimating closer to one year payback at these rates.

The alternative for bter is the loss of ~90% of their business. That is just a guess, but my intuition returns such a number when I think about the scenario of bter not coming up with a believable plan for makegood.

James
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: S3MKi on August 17, 2014, 01:49:26 am
guys use 1.2.5f please. i had 121kNXT on bter. U see that hacker don't want deal with bter.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: nextcafe on August 17, 2014, 01:52:22 am
We need a hotline to the bter people right now!


freeworm is online.  But now thesircom is not.  Sigh.

The order here is NOT "create the asset, get the list of owners from Bter, distribute the asset to wronged Bter customers."   The order is "Get the list of wronged customers, do a vote to see if THEY want a stolenNXT asset to be issued, THEN do what the vote says".


This

I wonder how much of the 50 mil is user funds vs bter holdings, accounting for the 5mil payed back of course.

Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: jefdiesel on August 17, 2014, 01:57:03 am
OOH Ricky, missed you, sorry this pain brought you back. Hope you didn't have too much on Bter..

I had a good handful on Bter, ~30k for trading, and I'm definitely going to say 1NXT 1 Vote (like always)
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: zingzong on August 17, 2014, 02:01:24 am

As soon as there is enough support for option 4, I will issue the stolenNXT asset and I am assuming bter will be able to get me a list of accounts/amounts.... As soon as bter has purchased all the stolenNXT, this asset will cease to exist, I suggest that bter would send to genesis any stolenNXT they purchase back

James

It looks to me like a new stolenNXT asset is effectively an installment plan for Bter to pay off their losses to their customers.  Unfortunately, this gives Bter a reason to want NXT price to go to near-zero so they can pay off as cheaply as possible.  Also, to pay off 45M NXT they've got to move around 4.5 billion NXT across their exchange to make enough in fees at 1% to make the payoff.  That's gonna take a while. 

If ever there was a time for a vote, it's BEFORE any new stolenNXT asset is issued.  The order here is NOT "create the asset, get the list of owners from Bter, distribute the asset to wronged Bter customers."   The order is "Get the list of wronged customers, do a vote to see if THEY want a stolenNXT asset to be issued, THEN do what the vote says".

I'll kick off the fun here - one vote per Bter customer or one vote per stolen NXT?

James, this mess isn't even 48 hours old and you are already taking on the role of a lawyer filing a class action suit.  You are truly a jack of all trades.   

Its too early to be going down this road, negotiation is in process!!!! When we do yes a vote first for sure and id say definitely 1 vote per stolen NXT , or to make it easier 1 Vote per every 1000 or less NXT.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: rickyjames on August 17, 2014, 02:07:01 am
OOH Ricky, missed you, sorry this pain brought you back. Hope you didn't have too much on Bter..

I had a good handful on Bter, ~30k for trading, and I'm definitely going to say 1NXT 1 Vote (like always)

Thanks, pal, nice to be missed.  I am just now coming out of a catatonic state from another coin loss several weeks ago to an anonymous SOB I'm still tracking down.   I had 450K NXT of skin in the game on this one.  Lucky I'm still feeling numb and shellshocked or it would hurt more.

I'm going to go to the Sonic down the street for a chocolate milkshake and then I'm going to bed.  My level of frustration is so high lately I could just blow a gasket.  I feel like these gifs, my only problem is I just don't know who I want to slap the most right now.

http://uproxx.com/tv/2012/06/20-awesome-television-bitch-slap-gifs/

 
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: jl777 on August 17, 2014, 02:14:54 am

As soon as there is enough support for option 4, I will issue the stolenNXT asset and I am assuming bter will be able to get me a list of accounts/amounts.... As soon as bter has purchased all the stolenNXT, this asset will cease to exist, I suggest that bter would send to genesis any stolenNXT they purchase back

James

It looks to me like a new stolenNXT asset is effectively an installment plan for Bter to pay off their losses to their customers.  Unfortunately, this gives Bter a reason to want NXT price to go to near-zero so they can pay off as cheaply as possible.  Also, to pay off 45M NXT they've got to move around 4.5 billion NXT across their exchange to make enough in fees at 1% to make the payoff.  That's gonna take a while. 

If ever there was a time for a vote, it's BEFORE any new stolenNXT asset is issued.  The order here is NOT "create the asset, get the list of owners from Bter, distribute the asset to wronged Bter customers."   The order is "Get the list of wronged customers, do a vote to see if THEY want a stolenNXT asset to be issued, THEN do what the vote says".

I'll kick off the fun here - one vote per Bter customer or one vote per stolen NXT?

James, this mess isn't even 48 hours old and you are already taking on the role of a lawyer filing a class action suit.  You are truly a jack of all trades.   

Its too early to be going down this road, negotiation is in process!!!! When we do yes a vote first for sure and id say definitely 1 vote per stolen NXT , or to make it easier 1 Vote per every 1000 or less NXT.
It is never too early to reassure people that there is a plan to maximize the amount of money they will be able to salvage. The longer this drags on, the less likely for bter to survive. If they can make fast decision, get a plan in place to makegood, then their reputation is intact and even battle tested.
Whatever amounts are negotiated, stolenNXT asset can be used to distribute fairly and according to each persons acceptance/rejection of current bid vs uncertainity of future

But, that is just my opinion, I have been known to be wrong
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: jefdiesel on August 17, 2014, 02:22:32 am
On one hand, Bter could collapse and no one gets anything, on the other hand this Asset might not be what all bagholders want to vote for.

BUT as James says, making an asset is a solid start, and if it ONLY represents the StolenNXT, and no plan or rate forced upon us now.
Bter can make a good show and hope to pull through this
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: cobaltskky on August 17, 2014, 02:29:29 am
you are from Chojnice, Poland?
No. Right now - I'm from Hamilton, Canada.

Cool.  You're about five hours from me.  Want to get lunch some time?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Jimmy2011 on August 17, 2014, 02:38:37 am

I'm sorry. I need to say option 1 or 2 is the right choice for healthy Nxt though the hacker may dump them and hurt Nxt a little in the short term.

Tomorrow is another day.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: lucky88888 on August 17, 2014, 02:44:11 am
So now we have exchanges with large holdings deciding to lead a hard fork against community consensus of yesterday?

Whether I agree personally with the outcome of yesterdays decision by Nxt forgers or not, this turn of events troubles me very much.

Can you pls provide the link where this "consensus" was reach?  ::)

Quote
Seems more like a coup.

LOL, a coup? by who? the community against the community?

When I woke up this morning and checked, "we" the community of forgers had decided not to participate in the reorganization plan.

This is not community against community. This is an outside force stepping in to agitate an outcome (coup).

This is a horrible situation and I feel terrible for all affected. My concerns have to do with the question of exchanges having this much power to influence the future of Nxt or any other coin.

Does anybody else have this concern?

Im 100% on your side on that.

Or you could say this is just early stages of crypto where it needs a little bit of centralization to give it some strength. Bootstrap stage 2, its for the good intention that's the important bit.

in the future this scenario would not be possible. TF and 10minute time and 90%stakes, not possible. it will only be there to prevent attacking the chain for bad intention.

If you think this is going to prevent businesses coming in, then you have to think again.
If suddenly businesses gets hacked they think with nxt there is hope of humanity when the community combines to fight against hack.
and if you think that business would rather not have this option? why? only hackers and businesses with pure bad intentions do not like this option!

for example THE GOVERNMENT, THE FEDERAL RESERVE!
THEY ARE STEALING FROM ALL OF US RIGHT NOW. WE WORK OUR LIVES TO BE SLAVES FOR THEM.

This is exactly what decentralization is for! we humans need to be controlled, we need leadership! leadership from the whole community, but we do not want to be controlled by bad intentions for the good of single entity.

quote me if you think what i think. if not then this is my opinion.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: xyzzyx on August 17, 2014, 02:45:59 am
Why? Dgex has been forging from beginning, I think.
No, just occasionally unintended.

We are considering forging for 1.2.5f though with 29M.

It's in all exchanges best interests (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enlightened_self-interest) to fork the blockchain.  You and Bter should try to get the other exchanges on board.

Edit: got my first "bitcoinpaul"  Thanks sile16!
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: sile16 on August 17, 2014, 02:47:26 am
Do not fork.  Option4 is the best.  Salvage as  much as possible over time but let some users who need coins now the option of selling asset at discount.  Best option in a bad scenario. 
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Cyclone on August 17, 2014, 02:49:25 am
I am just a simple C programmer trying to use some math to solve this. Also I am proposing a percentage from ALL of bter trade commissions, not just NXT. The are doing ~10000 BTC per week so that is 20 BTC per week if 50% goes to the repurchase. Estimated 3 year payback, but a lot of people will take the bid at a discount, so I am estimating closer to one year payback at these rates.

The alternative for bter is the loss of ~90% of their business. That is just a guess, but my intuition returns such a number when I think about the scenario of bter not coming up with a believable plan for makegood.

James
I like this idea. A combination of this (option 4) and option 2 might be the way to go. The hacker already has 110BTC, equating to approximately $57,000 at current prices; while working away in the background on James' plan, Bter could announce that this money, plus another 90BTC, would be the reward for unmasking the hacker, and returning the stolen NXT. 200BTC, or approx $100,000, would be a great motivator for a lot of very smart people.

If the hacker is as smart as he thinks he is, then there'll be no bounty payout, and Bter can proceed with funding option 4; this'll provide Bter with the best option of staying in business, and for theft victims to be made whole on their loses. If the hacker has, however, been careless at any stage so far, or in the future while trying to move funds, then he'll leave himself open to being traced; if successful, this may result in the recovery of the stolen NXT, and allow Bter to avoid having to pay out as much money.

In terms of options 1 and 3, giving the hacker more money seems to be a very bad idea when he has already proven he can't be trusted; it also encourages future hacking attempts against NXT, and damages the standing of this community in the eyes of the greater cryptocurrency community. The option of a fork, meanwhile, would likely do more harm than good at this stage, and further damage the standing of NXT, along with its long term future; the time to pursue this option was before the 720 blocks had elapsed, and is now long gone.

Going back to a combination of options 4 and 2, what the community can do while James and Bter are working on the asset, is start working together to do whatever we can to trace the hacker and recover the funds. We could give the initiative its own NXT Project forum, and call it Operation TSCTrace. If we publicise it well enough (bitcointalk, reddit, cryptonews sites, etc.), we could even try turning it into some positive publicity for ourselves and Bter, and use it to recruit new people to Nxt. ;)
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Anonymous on August 17, 2014, 02:57:19 am
600k point to 1.2.5f

Yous are all brainwashed by bit coin and their miners!
Say no to hackers!
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: ElliottHe on August 17, 2014, 03:00:00 am
Go with #3 (or #2 even better if it's possible). Don't compromise with thief. This is a good opportunity the whole crypto world can learn from NXT on how to deal with this situation. The future needs this kind of try and error.
 
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: mczarnek on August 17, 2014, 03:05:00 am
Why? Dgex has been forging from beginning, I think.
No, just occasionally unintended.

We are considering forging for 1.2.5f though with 29M.

It's in all exchanges best interests (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enlightened_self-interest) to fork the blockchain.  You and Bter should try to get the other exchanges on board.

We can't fork every time an exchange gets hacked.  BTER and the people who left a lot of Nxt on an exchange for any period of time were the ones who screwed up.  If there is any silver lining to this, it's that at least the thief realizes how valuable his nxt are.  I tend to believe him when he says he's not going to dump.  The reason he hasn't moved it yet, isn't because he's taunting us.. it's because he think he can sell it for more in the future..  probably after someone makes a NXT mixer.. and Nxt hits $1  Which is a shame..
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: lucky88888 on August 17, 2014, 03:08:28 am
Not flooding but exerting incredible downward pressure during the next 3, 6 or even 12 months. It is nearly certain. The hacker will of course sell it to a private dark side investor who mixes it, cashes out some, and sells the rest forward to the next investor for a fraction of the market price. Rinse and repeat until done.

1.5 million USD extra injection to the buy side would not suffice to keep NXT afloat, because of the bad rep causing more sell pressure.

By blocking the 50M from being sold, we just have to deal with the bad rep and not the massive selling million after million until exhaustion.

50M on the market is no different than one of the full bitcoin original founders deciding to sell. A bit of downward pressure on price is not something that Nxt can't handle. It's like the Ethereum IPO or the FBI sell-off for bitcoin. It'll just be a blip. The bad reputation would be much more damage in my opinion. Especially driven by the exchanges like this. One of the main criticisms of PoS is the fact that the exchanges with all their coins have too much power. If this wins, a lot of people will lose their trust in Nxt forever.

Community vs exchanges....I vote for us, for NXT...1.2.5

Its not community vs exchange. Its community vs Hacker. Its the communities money on the exchange.
Damages to exchange are already done for.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: xyzzyx on August 17, 2014, 03:09:04 am
We can't fork every time an exchange gets hacked.  BTER and the people who left a lot of Nxt on an exchange for any period of time were the ones who screwed up.  If there is any silver lining to this, it's that at least the thief realizes how valuable his nxt are.  I tend to believe him when he says he's not going to dump.  The reason he hasn't moved it yet, isn't because he's taunting us.. it's because he think he can sell it for more in the future..  probably after someone makes a NXT mixer.. and Nxt hits $1  Which is a shame..

We shouldn't trust the hacker to do the right thing.  We should remove his ability to cheat.

Edit: now where have I heard that before (http://wiki.nxtcrypto.org/wiki/BCNext%27s_Plan)?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: cobaltskky on August 17, 2014, 03:12:50 am
Not flooding but exerting incredible downward pressure during the next 3, 6 or even 12 months. It is nearly certain. The hacker will of course sell it to a private dark side investor who mixes it, cashes out some, and sells the rest forward to the next investor for a fraction of the market price. Rinse and repeat until done.

1.5 million USD extra injection to the buy side would not suffice to keep NXT afloat, because of the bad rep causing more sell pressure.

By blocking the 50M from being sold, we just have to deal with the bad rep and not the massive selling million after million until exhaustion.

50M on the market is no different than one of the full bitcoin original founders deciding to sell. A bit of downward pressure on price is not something that Nxt can't handle. It's like the Ethereum IPO or the FBI sell-off for bitcoin. It'll just be a blip. The bad reputation would be much more damage in my opinion. Especially driven by the exchanges like this. One of the main criticisms of PoS is the fact that the exchanges with all their coins have too much power. If this wins, a lot of people will lose their trust in Nxt forever.

Community vs exchanges....I vote for us, for NXT...1.2.5

Its not community vs exchange. Its community vs Hacker. Its the communities money on the exchange.
Damages to exchange are already done for.

Maybe it should be community vs hacker AND exchange?  Hacker is a thief who specifically targeted NXT, our platform.  Exchange is a business who failed the trust of members of our community.  I don't think we have an obligation to either of them.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: nextcafe on August 17, 2014, 03:17:41 am
I am just a simple C programmer trying to use some math to solve this. Also I am proposing a percentage from ALL of bter trade commissions, not just NXT. The are doing ~10000 BTC per week so that is 20 BTC per week if 50% goes to the repurchase. Estimated 3 year payback, but a lot of people will take the bid at a discount, so I am estimating closer to one year payback at these rates.

The alternative for bter is the loss of ~90% of their business. That is just a guess, but my intuition returns such a number when I think about the scenario of bter not coming up with a believable plan for makegood.

James
I like this idea. A combination of this (option 4) and option 2 might be the way to go. The hacker already has 110BTC, equating to approximately $57,000 at current prices; while working away in the background on James' plan, Bter could announce that this money, plus another 90BTC, would be the reward for unmasking the hacker, and returning the stolen NXT. 200BTC, or approx $100,000, would be a great motivator for a lot of very smart people.

If the hacker is as smart as he thinks he is, then there'll be no bounty payout, and Bter can proceed with funding option 4; this'll provide Bter with the best option of staying in business, and for theft victims to be made whole on their loses. If the hacker has, however, been careless at any stage so far, or in the future while trying to move funds, then he'll leave himself open to being traced; if successful, this may result in the recovery of the stolen NXT, and allow Bter to avoid having to pay out as much money.

In terms of options 1 and 3, giving the hacker more money seems to be a very bad idea when he has already proven he can't be trusted; it also encourages future hacking attempts against NXT, and damages the standing of this community in the eyes of the greater cryptocurrency community. The option of a fork, meanwhile, would likely do more harm than good at this stage, and further damage the standing of NXT, along with its long term future; the time to pursue this option was before the 720 blocks had elapsed, and is now long gone.

Going back to a combination of options 4 and 2, what the community can do while James and Bter are working on the asset, is start working together to do whatever we can to trace the hacker and recover the funds. We could give the initiative its own NXT Project forum, and call it Operation TSCTrace. If we publicise it well enough (bitcointalk, reddit, cryptonews sites, etc.), we could even try turning it into some positive publicity for ourselves and Bter, and use it to recruit new people to Nxt. ;)

+1  A combination of this (option 4) and option 2

Laid out nicely, I agree with this whole heartily if the community wants to go this route. Bter needs to be transparent and work with whoever creates the Asset.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Dontclick on August 17, 2014, 03:39:55 am
600k point to 1.2.5f

Yous are all brainwashed by bit coin and their miners!
Say no to hackers!


I agree
3 million to 1.2.5f
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Perado on August 17, 2014, 03:47:03 am
Not flooding but exerting incredible downward pressure during the next 3, 6 or even 12 months. It is nearly certain. The hacker will of course sell it to a private dark side investor who mixes it, cashes out some, and sells the rest forward to the next investor for a fraction of the market price. Rinse and repeat until done.

1.5 million USD extra injection to the buy side would not suffice to keep NXT afloat, because of the bad rep causing more sell pressure.

By blocking the 50M from being sold, we just have to deal with the bad rep and not the massive selling million after million until exhaustion.

50M on the market is no different than one of the full bitcoin original founders deciding to sell. A bit of downward pressure on price is not something that Nxt can't handle. It's like the Ethereum IPO or the FBI sell-off for bitcoin. It'll just be a blip. The bad reputation would be much more damage in my opinion. Especially driven by the exchanges like this. One of the main criticisms of PoS is the fact that the exchanges with all their coins have too much power. If this wins, a lot of people will lose their trust in Nxt forever.

Community vs exchanges....I vote for us, for NXT...1.2.5

Its not community vs exchange. Its community vs Hacker. Its the communities money on the exchange.
Damages to exchange are already done for.

Maybe it should be community vs hacker AND exchange?  Hacker is a thief who specifically targeted NXT, our platform.  Exchange is a business who failed the trust of members of our community.  I don't think we have an obligation to either of them.

So the alternative option is that the exchange give the bitcoins to the community and the team and we promise to fork 1.2.5f.
Thats the best solution.People get there coins back, hacker lost the coins,bter pay the costs becoz of his fault.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Perado on August 17, 2014, 03:52:02 am
Not flooding but exerting incredible downward pressure during the next 3, 6 or even 12 months. It is nearly certain. The hacker will of course sell it to a private dark side investor who mixes it, cashes out some, and sells the rest forward to the next investor for a fraction of the market price. Rinse and repeat until done.

1.5 million USD extra injection to the buy side would not suffice to keep NXT afloat, because of the bad rep causing more sell pressure.

By blocking the 50M from being sold, we just have to deal with the bad rep and not the massive selling million after million until exhaustion.

50M on the market is no different than one of the full bitcoin original founders deciding to sell. A bit of downward pressure on price is not something that Nxt can't handle. It's like the Ethereum IPO or the FBI sell-off for bitcoin. It'll just be a blip. The bad reputation would be much more damage in my opinion. Especially driven by the exchanges like this. One of the main criticisms of PoS is the fact that the exchanges with all their coins have too much power. If this wins, a lot of people will lose their trust in Nxt forever.

Community vs exchanges....I vote for us, for NXT...1.2.5

Its not community vs exchange. Its community vs Hacker. Its the communities money on the exchange.
Damages to exchange are already done for.

Maybe it should be community vs hacker AND exchange?  Hacker is a thief who specifically targeted NXT, our platform.  Exchange is a business who failed the trust of members of our community.  I don't think we have an obligation to either of them.

So the alternative option is that the exchange give the bitcoins to the community and the team and we promise to fork 1.2.5f.
Thats the best solution.People get there coins back, hacker lost the coins,bter pay the costs becoz of his fault.

And we can improve NXT by these coins,it wont do harm to the integrity of NXT coz all this will contribute to the development of NXT.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: yin on August 17, 2014, 03:58:59 am
So Bter creates an asset on NXT AE called "VictimCompensation" worth the amounts lost and hand them over to the people who lost NXT to the hacker.

The asset shall be funded by a portion of gross Bter revenues over the nxt 3 years.

The holders of VictimCompensation can sell off to more patient buyers, if they so wish.

We all refocus on NXT roadmap, committee improvement, more open/inclusive development...

Dealing with the hacker becomes Bter's problem

Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: nmlowry on August 17, 2014, 04:01:28 am
As someone who lost >100k NXT, I vote for 2, the bounty.  In fact I'll chip in 1 more BTC myself.

I've seen some impressive sleuthing in cases like this, and although Bter (and customers who left savings on Bter, like me) deserve their losses, I'm quite keen to put the fear in thieves.

Of the other options my preference is 4, 3, or 1, in that order.  I don't think any of them is crazy, there's a lot of tween hyperbole on this board.  Shit happens and adults deal.  Whatever some of you may think NXT's fate won't be determined by the choice between these four options.

If 2 indeed wins out, I'd ask freeworm & co to post all the info they have on thesircom and let the hunt begin.  (Only if 2 wins!  Posting this info will make 1 harder.)
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Jimmy2011 on August 17, 2014, 04:05:31 am
http://www.btcside.com/new/detail/1029

According to this interview, Lin, the boss of bter, was cheated 100 BTC by a Canadian in 2013, and Bter is co-founded by Lin and his Ph. D. advisor from Canada. BTW, TheSirCom is right now in Canada according to his post.

-----------------------------------

Translation by Google

Interview: Bit help round
Edit: Bit help round

1 bit to help: Korea always has been, the external are relatively low-key, this very honored to have this opportunity to interview you, you can simply introduce yourself?
 
Korea: Hello, I am also very pleased to be interviewed bit to help. I do, is a technology house, that is, we say that only focus on technology and less likely to communicate that. Jinan University and graduate students are spent. Ph.D. graduate from Canada early in 2012, optical professional, high-performance computing direction. 90% of my time doing technical work and research and development, so the market is not good, so be mistaken for a low-key, in fact, is a high-profile up. Thanks to the joint efforts of all members of the company, bits children to come today.
 
2 bits of help: Ask a relatively common problem, Han had always know what way bitcoins to enter this field it? Child's life experience we are interested in the bit of it. The future of your digital currency is how to treat it?
 
Korea: 2011 I worked with mentors and create Jinan overseas companies to create this foreign company in early 2012, is mainly engaged in high-performance computing algorithm and optical device simulation software development. Bitcoin was learned that there are many high-performance mining techniques can learn where this began to understand the depth Bitcoin. Early 2013 I was in bitcointalk forum with a Canadian private transactions 100BTC cheated, did not realize how important a secure trading platform for gamers Bitcoin is. So determined to create their own trading platform, April 10, 2013, bit child was born.
Piece of digital currency. I always felt that there is a vast digital currency future, I was believer digital currency. Now digital currency like the early Internet, I think it will become a part of everyone's daily life in the near future, a bit on the child site has a word, a good expression of our attitude: Come with us, Change the world!
 
3. Bit to help: the current domestic currency cottage varieties are endless, there are nearly 40 bits children currency, ask children what a bit evaluation criteria of the new currency is it?
 
Han: Yes, and now the community is very prosperous cottage currency, the new currency, new technologies, new ways to promote operational endless. On the one hand, the new technology to promote the development of digital currency, a new way to promote accelerated the application of digital currency, on the other hand inferior "copy money" through false propaganda to deceive a lot of novice users, allowing users to losses, but also to digital currency suffered criticism. As the market and technology have long-term and in-depth understanding of us have a responsibility to filter out innovative, potential currency trading provides users a convenient platform to promote the development of digital currency. Based on this consideration, the bit children on-line new currency standard has always been: 1) innovation, 2) active, responsible for the development and operation and maintenance team.
 
Based on this standard, we have a lot of on-line currency widely recognized, such DOGE, NXT, XCP, DRK, etc., are now trading very active. Because of its lack of capacity and the market is constantly changing, and we makes mistakes. For example, do not look for a fraction of the first digital currency CENT on line in 2013. Shortly after his wallet on the problem, the original developer of the abandoned maintenance, external disk crash, our platform while taking by limiting the recharge measures do its utmost to protect the disk market, but there are still users a loss of a lot of bits children and therefore suffered criticism, I also it remorse. Now we are more cautious on the line the new currency, in addition to in-depth investigation, we are many more to listen to the views of users, users are our best teachers.
 
4 bits of help: Bit children currently registered on many users, the daily trading volume is also a great platform to do business at first, too, and your previous relevant experience of being cheated, how that bit child is to ensure transaction security platform it? There are no coins appeared lost, stolen currency situation?
 
Han: You are quite right, as a trading platform, safety is our first consideration. This includes two aspects, one of the secure storage is a digital currency, and the other is a secure transaction.
In secure storage, the most mature platform will be cold, hot wallet isolated storage, against hacker attacks. And a bit further children, the use of ice, cold, hot, three purse storage, the very inactive wallet balance stored in ice and networking in isolation, cut off its being attacked by hackers might.
In the secure transactions, we are assured by the cluster computing and multi-level backup of impartiality and reliability of the user transaction data, currently has nearly 100 children a bit servers provide services to domestic and foreign users, very smooth transaction.
Reliability is currently trading platform bloody lesson from the previous exchange, at this point would have to mention the "balancing the books" event by the end of 2013 bits children, when attracted a lot of criticism, resulting in the loss of a large number of users. The direct cause of the incident is November 2013 and other virtual currency Bitcoin domestic boom suddenly arrived, the influx of a large number of user bits children trading platform, resulting platform server overworked, sparked off a single transaction, resulting in uneven user funds. After this incident, we have a substantial increase and upgrade the server to improve the trading software systems, increasing the multi-level protection measures.
Faced with this incident, I am more of its processing from a technical level, by way of re-processing the raw data for the user to check the accounts that we called "balancing the books." My approach was too blunt, neglect and users exchange and communication, it is conceivable that the process of "balancing the books" in very smoothly, our customer service pressures are also very large, although with customers patiently explained, but still popular criticism, and led to the loss of a certain user, I feel very guilty. Here to every affected users to apologize, I hope you come back, we will provide you the best deals. Although the incident was caused us the loss of hundreds of Bitcoin, but the good news is that we use this lesson now robust security exchange trading system and to allow us to realize the importance of communication and the player.
Also on the Pirates of the coins that you just mentioned are some of the things, the user's account information disclosure of which would cause the account virtual currency stolen. To this end, we provide funding password, Google two-factor authentication, login and put coins free SMS verification, such as multiple security measures to protect user accounts. So now trading on a bit child is safe.
 
5 bits of help: after talking with such a serious topic, another issue of concern to readers now, a bit on the dark children now regarded currency gains greater currency, many investors say that you look great, but also want to know a bit children initially Diablo currency on what to consider it? Investigate its is not really replaced Wright currency it?
 
Korea: In fact, a few days after the release of Diablo coins brought to our attention, it brings the release of multiple innovations, including anonymous transfers, X11 algorithm, DGW difficult adjustment algorithms have achieved great success, is the currency back widely used. These do not need unique vision can see out, I regret that we are too cautious, no earlier trading platform to provide support for it.
Technically, Wright currency Bitcoin is no essential for innovation, almost all the features of virtual currency can replace it. However, due to Wright coins issued earlier, user acceptance is high, so in the short term but also more difficult to catch up with other currencies. In the long term, if there is no continuous innovation Wright coins, currency advantages, such as the DRK, NXT, XCP, etc., is likely to surpass it. Bitcoin is the same.
 
6. Bit help: as a trading platform should rely less amount of transaction fees as a profit point, and now there are 20 kinds of bits on children currency is zero transaction costs, including some popular currency, and that in the current market conditions, the actual transaction under the volume is not high, a bit child's earnings from where? Can not simply talk about it?
 
Korea: because there is no financing melt coins, we insist on not participating in the market, do not charge any fees on the currency, the only means of bits of children is profitable fee. 25% fee income as a ratio to return to the user characteristics, 25% as interest returned to the user. In the current market conditions is indeed depleted. But not in front of us to see, is currently the most depressed market, we believe that the future of digital currency, the market is very broad in the future, so we will stick to it.
 
7 bits of help: a lighter overall market does now is to develop the market stage, so profitability is not the most important. It comes to this, do you think based on the current developments in the domestic industry Bitcoin, what is the most difficult issues facing children of bits is it? Are there any solutions to deal with it?
 
Korea: Bit children from the outset was founded on sub bilingual, but for the domestic and overseas markets. Currently overseas markets have been developing smoothly, and other virtual currency Bitcoin has been gaining popularity and attention. Domestic market itself is large, strong user demand, but also the most important part of our most difficult problems encountered is the trading platform of RMB recharge regulated, we can only observe the current regulations, to focus on its development.
The current solution is to allow users access to the station to recharge code convertible top, although it is not perfect, as a direct recharge smooth, affecting the user to recharge enthusiasm, but at least still be able to maintain a good development of the trading platform.
 
8-bit help: time off soon, and Korea is always very happy to talk, ask one last question, and before also asked bit era, the era of competition and face, Bter advantage is in the wrong? A development strategy for the future is like?
 
Korea: age is a good trading platform, I learned a lot from them, especially how and user exchanges, such as creating micro-Bo, and more communication users. Virtual currency market is a very broad market, compared to the competition, I think we and the times more cooperation, the development of this market, expanding the user base, to provide users with better services, and promote the development of virtual currency. Bit children advantage of technology and focus. The future, we will continue to enhance the user experience, improve service quality, enhance transparency platform to provide users with the perfect trading platform for digital currency.
------------------------------

Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Shagufta on August 17, 2014, 04:11:15 am
Quote
Option 4

Sounds like something banks did when they realized they were FUCKED with the United States' housing market. Creating instruments to cover perceived losses and re-create something out of nothing is not something I will support. Call it a "loan", that's even worse.

Quote
Option 2

I'm for this in a non-publicized manner. Fuck this thesircom, either there's a motivation in BTC or emotion to bring him to justice or he walks away with the NXT.

Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: 520Bit on August 17, 2014, 04:14:01 am
1. too low.
2. not possible.
3. kills nxt.

Let me guess your motivation.

1) You do this because of money.
2) You want to prove bter has a bad security.
3) You want to revenge.

If 1), then speak your price, we will see if bter could afford it. Or you can sell them out in market, backroom deals, either way.
If 2), you really did it, not necessary show up everywhere, just keep the stolen NXT and go away.
If 3), you also did it, what else do you need?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: junsha on August 17, 2014, 04:26:32 am
NXT-R3V3-2S79-F3ZM-BVXKZ got 2M.

Seems No.1 is working.?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: TwinWinNerD on August 17, 2014, 04:30:07 am
If you want to lose the core beleivers of NXT then do a hard fork.

If this happens I and all the people I referred to NXT will be out. Selling everything!
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Wakasaki808 on August 17, 2014, 04:30:29 am
NXT-R3V3-2S79-F3ZM-BVXKZ got 2M.

Seems No.1 is working.?

plus another 2m after that.

https://nxtblocks.info/#section/txid/8895654521560377519

big blocks incoming...

2'000 nxt for this one lol
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Wakasaki808 on August 17, 2014, 04:31:16 am
If you want to lose the core beleivers of NXT then do a hard fork.

If this happens I and all the people I referred to NXT will be out. Selling everything!

don't worry the 1.2.5 users out there far outnumber the 1.2.5f users
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Cyclone on August 17, 2014, 04:31:39 am
NXT-R3V3-2S79-F3ZM-BVXKZ got 2M.

Seems No.1 is working.?
Or perhaps wariness of the possibility of options 2, 3 and/or 4.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: jones on August 17, 2014, 04:32:41 am
NXT-R3V3-2S79-F3ZM-BVXKZ got 2M.

Seems No.1 is working.?

plus another 2m after that.

https://nxtblocks.info/#section/txid/8895654521560377519

big blocks incoming...

2'000 nxt for this one lol

somethings actually happening, good for bter  :)
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: tonyk on August 17, 2014, 04:35:06 am
Good news. I think.
NXT are coming from hacker to bter.
If indeed this: NXT-R3V3-2S79-F3ZM-BVXKZ
is bter's account.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Wakasaki808 on August 17, 2014, 04:36:44 am
At the moment looks like the hacker is sending some back.


So far that equates up to 9,333,142.35 NXT for BTER
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Wakasaki808 on August 17, 2014, 04:37:20 am
Good news. I think.
NXT are coming from hacker to bter.
If indeed this: NXT-R3V3-2S79-F3ZM-BVXKZ
is bter's account.

this is BTER's account according to nxt messanger

https://nxtblocks.info/#section/txid/6979951452037127922

"return all the NXT back to NXT-R3V3-2S79-F3ZM-BVXKZ, otherwise we are going to take all our power and a huge bounty to hunt you down . be smart"
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: nextcafe on August 17, 2014, 04:38:20 am
-Breaking News-
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: whale on August 17, 2014, 04:42:51 am
This is great news   ;D
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: tonyk on August 17, 2014, 04:43:15 am
sorry, got too exited took the bter's balance for the hacker's one.

Anyway 12 1/3 total returned. In addition to the 5 mil initial return.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: jones on August 17, 2014, 04:46:50 am
8'000'000 more NXT back to BTER  :D
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Wakasaki808 on August 17, 2014, 04:47:00 am
8 MILLION NXT MORE BTERS WAY  ??? ;D ;D

https://nxtblocks.info/#section/txid/4434767683702203214
https://nxtblocks.info/#section/txid/16341543401727222258

around 17M NXT total now by the hacker
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Darkhorse on August 17, 2014, 04:50:17 am
What was the deal?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Wakasaki808 on August 17, 2014, 04:51:33 am
What was the deal?

never stated anything to us here.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: TwinWinNerD on August 17, 2014, 04:54:43 am
Can someone link me to the hackers BTC address?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Wakasaki808 on August 17, 2014, 04:55:11 am
Hacker stop on by again and tell us something...
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Wakasaki808 on August 17, 2014, 04:56:11 am
Can someone link me to the hackers BTC address?

this was his old one. May have got a different one now though

https://blockchain.info/address/13UZjKkhHWyTmQ4mx28WT5Wj1zw4pEByZw
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Cyclone on August 17, 2014, 04:56:35 am
Can someone link me to the hackers BTC address?
http://mynxt.info/blockexplorer/details.php?action=ac&ac=1244396688755618309
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: jones on August 17, 2014, 04:56:42 am
It looks to be one transaction roughly every ten minutes, hope it keeps up
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: sparta_cuss on August 17, 2014, 04:56:51 am
Perhaps he's accepted Option #5:

https://nxtforum.org/news-and-announcements/forgers-have-been-faced-with-a-choice/msg84795/#msg84795
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Wakasaki808 on August 17, 2014, 05:03:52 am
6 million more NXT!!!

https://nxtblocks.info/#section/txid/18319840736574167234

maybe bter and hacker has agreed on a deal then... ???
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: msin on August 17, 2014, 05:05:23 am
This whole thing is an experiment to see if we would fork
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: TwinWinNerD on August 17, 2014, 05:05:56 am
This is like one of this "hostage" situations. Even though BTER lost much money and many customers, they still feel like they won :D
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: sparta_cuss on August 17, 2014, 05:06:52 am
He's figuring out the wallet, too. The last two transactions had fees of only 1NXT. The others had (the default) fees in the thousands!
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Wakasaki808 on August 17, 2014, 05:07:41 am
He's figuring out the wallet, too. The last two transactions had fees of only 1NXT. The others had (the default) fees in the thousands!

yup...at least 2.3k, and 2k NXT blocks coming up in the future. Hopefully I am lucky  ;D
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: xyzzyx on August 17, 2014, 05:08:09 am
This whole thing is an experiment to see if we would fork

I'm still running 1.2.5f until all is paid back.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: tonyk on August 17, 2014, 05:10:11 am
He's figuring out the wallet, too. The last two transactions had fees of only 1NXT. The others had (the default) fees in the thousands!

Yes, I saw that too. For the first 2 transfers he paid ~2000NXT each.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: jones on August 17, 2014, 05:10:36 am
This whole thing is an experiment to see if we would fork

The beta test is over!!!
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: whale on August 17, 2014, 05:11:33 am
This whole thing is an experiment to see if we would fork

trolls have stooped to a new low  ;)
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Wakasaki808 on August 17, 2014, 05:13:09 am
at least BTER has got almost half of the stolen NXT amount...let's see where the sending stops...
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: HinnomTX on August 17, 2014, 05:14:32 am
He's figuring out the wallet, too. The last two transactions had fees of only 1NXT. The others had (the default) fees in the thousands!
He wanted to make sure his stolen coins came through! Now, sending them back, he doesn't really give a fuck.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: TwinWinNerD on August 17, 2014, 05:14:34 am
at least BTER has got almost half of the stolen NXT amount...let's see where the giving stops...

If you think he "gave" them back, then you are naive.

They probably paid 30-50% of market price.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: TwinWinNerD on August 17, 2014, 05:15:04 am
He's figuring out the wallet, too. The last two transactions had fees of only 1NXT. The others had (the default) fees in the thousands!
He wanted to make sure his stolen coins came through! Now, sending them back, he doesn't really give a fuck.

lol NXT doesn't work like BTC right now. 1 NXT is enough.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Wakasaki808 on August 17, 2014, 05:17:39 am
at least BTER has got almost half of the stolen NXT amount...let's see where the giving stops...

If you think he "gave" them back, then you are naive.

They probably paid 30-50% of market price.

I didn't mean like "gave" more like "send"  ;D
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: m30188 on August 17, 2014, 05:17:54 am
Perhaps he's accepted Option #5:

https://nxtforum.org/news-and-announcements/forgers-have-been-faced-with-a-choice/msg84795/#msg84795

CobaltSkky came through for us!
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: HinnomTX on August 17, 2014, 05:18:29 am
He's figuring out the wallet, too. The last two transactions had fees of only 1NXT. The others had (the default) fees in the thousands!
He wanted to make sure his stolen coins came through! Now, sending them back, he doesn't really give a fuck.

lol NXT doesn't work like BTC right now. 1 NXT is enough.
So why scale the fee in the first place? Should be 1 NXT always.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Wakasaki808 on August 17, 2014, 05:18:45 am
Perhaps he's accepted Option #5:

https://nxtforum.org/news-and-announcements/forgers-have-been-faced-with-a-choice/msg84795/#msg84795

COBALTSKYY!!!COBALTSKYY!!!

now hold up your end of the deal  ;D
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Wakasaki808 on August 17, 2014, 05:19:39 am
10M NXT MORE FOR BTER

https://nxtblocks.info/#section/txid/8141432553069582300

Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: TwinWinNerD on August 17, 2014, 05:19:51 am
He's figuring out the wallet, too. The last two transactions had fees of only 1NXT. The others had (the default) fees in the thousands!
He wanted to make sure his stolen coins came through! Now, sending them back, he doesn't really give a fuck.

lol NXT doesn't work like BTC right now. 1 NXT is enough.
So why scale the fee in the first place? Should be 1 NXT always.

Because then sometimes people make an accident and pay too much, that is good for forgers ;)
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: sparta_cuss on August 17, 2014, 05:20:15 am
Perhaps he's accepted Option #5:

https://nxtforum.org/news-and-announcements/forgers-have-been-faced-with-a-choice/msg84795/#msg84795

COBALTSKYY!!!COBALTSKYY!!!

now hold up your end of the deal  ;D

Yes, Dear. Your end.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: mczarnek on August 17, 2014, 05:20:42 am
at least BTER has got almost half of the stolen NXT amount...let's see where the giving stops...

If you think he "gave" them back, then you are naive.

They probably paid 30-50% of market price.

Could be why they are being sent in chunks.. hopefully BTER learned and he's sending first, he sends 4 million Nxt.. they send BTC.  Which is reason for 10 minute interval too.. waiting for confirmation.

Or maybe 'TheSir' got a pm containing his home address?  Will be interested in learning what happened.. would be ideal
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Darkhorse on August 17, 2014, 05:25:39 am
Another 10m waiting for confirmation i think. He is left with 8m for now.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Wakasaki808 on August 17, 2014, 05:26:34 am
Another 10m waiting for confirmation i think. He is left with 8m for now.

just about done then. Thank You Hacker for being legit enough to send NXT back in edition to making NXT more safe with BTER creating a new secure account.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: tonyk on August 17, 2014, 05:28:56 am
at least BTER has got almost half of the stolen NXT amount...let's see where the giving stops...

If you think he "gave" them back, then you are naive.

They probably paid 30-50% of market price.

Could be why they are being sent in chunks.. hopefully BTER learned and he's sending first, he sends 4 million Nxt.. they send BTC.  Which is reason for 10 minute interval too.. waiting for confirmation.

Or maybe 'TheSir' got a pm containing his home address?  Will be interested in learning what happened.. would be ideal

Yes, and am I the only one interested in who sent the hacker 100 BTC in MTG BTCs, yesterday?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: mczarnek on August 17, 2014, 05:29:50 am
That is awesome..  glad I didn't sell my Nxt.. this means press for Nxt without the worry of a thief dumping :)
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Wakasaki808 on August 17, 2014, 05:30:06 am
at least BTER has got almost half of the stolen NXT amount...let's see where the giving stops...

If you think he "gave" them back, then you are naive.

They probably paid 30-50% of market price.

Could be why they are being sent in chunks.. hopefully BTER learned and he's sending first, he sends 4 million Nxt.. they send BTC.  Which is reason for 10 minute interval too.. waiting for confirmation.

Or maybe 'TheSir' got a pm containing his home address?  Will be interested in learning what happened.. would be ideal

Yes, and am I the only one interested in who sent the hacker 100 BTC in MTG BTCs, yesterday?

it was 100 satoshi...not 100btc
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: xyzzyx on August 17, 2014, 05:30:51 am
So why scale the fee in the first place? Should be 1 NXT always.

To make sure your transaction is included in a block when there are more transactions queued than will fit in a block.  Otherwise, your transaction will take a back seat to ones with higher fees.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: tonyk on August 17, 2014, 05:32:20 am
at least BTER has got almost half of the stolen NXT amount...let's see where the giving stops...

If you think he "gave" them back, then you are naive.

They probably paid 30-50% of market price.

Could be why they are being sent in chunks.. hopefully BTER learned and he's sending first, he sends 4 million Nxt.. they send BTC.  Which is reason for 10 minute interval too.. waiting for confirmation.

Or maybe 'TheSir' got a pm containing his home address?  Will be interested in learning what happened.. would be ideal

Yes, and am I the only one interested in who sent the hacker 100 BTC in MTG BTCs, yesterday?

it was 100 satoshi...not 100btc
OK my bad and good to know!
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: m30188 on August 17, 2014, 05:34:48 am
So why scale the fee in the first place? Should be 1 NXT always.

To make sure your transaction is included in a block when there are more transactions queued than will fit in a block.  Otherwise, your transaction will take a back seat to ones with higher fees.
Cool. I didn't know that either.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Buratino on August 17, 2014, 05:38:31 am
Glad, it turned that thief is human too. He has chosen most reasonable walk-out. I would thank him.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Wakasaki808 on August 17, 2014, 05:50:23 am
New Payment of 10M

https://nxtblocks.info/#section/txid/4548299113229732862

8M NXT remaining...wonder if he gets to keep it as part of whatever deal they planned..  :D
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: tonyk on August 17, 2014, 05:52:19 am
New Payment of 10M

https://nxtblocks.info/#section/txid/4548299113229732862

8M NXT remaining...wonder if he gets to keep it as part of whatever deal they planned...lol

And a message by him:
"NXT being return. How about that deal? "
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: nextcafe on August 17, 2014, 05:53:19 am
Perhaps he's accepted Option #5:

https://nxtforum.org/news-and-announcements/forgers-have-been-faced-with-a-choice/msg84795/#msg84795

it was 100 satoshi...not 100btc

too funny
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Wakasaki808 on August 17, 2014, 05:53:45 am
New Payment of 10M

https://nxtblocks.info/#section/txid/4548299113229732862

8M NXT remaining...wonder if he gets to keep it as part of whatever deal they planned...lol

And a message by him:
"NXT being return. How about that deal? "

yup. to this account
https://nxtblocks.info/#section/accountId/NXT-QT7P-HWS6-SABB-G59H8

LOL :-X :P

earlier message by her...
https://nxtblocks.info/#section/txid/12270192656192983805

and this by him earlier (prior to the release of funds)
https://nxtblocks.info/#section/txid/10624364534511351073

maybe we were right...*cough*

MUCH THANKS COBALTSKYY for taking it for the team  ;D ;D

...unless of course the hacker is playing around.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: mczarnek on August 17, 2014, 06:10:07 am
Nice going Cobalt :)

Think he's waiting for a reply before sending the last of it...
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: m30188 on August 17, 2014, 06:11:19 am
Nice going Cobalt :)

Think he's waiting for a reply before sending the last of it...
She went offline a couple hours ago and missed all the fun.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: whale on August 17, 2014, 06:18:16 am
Nice going Cobalt :)

Think he's waiting for a reply before sending the last of it...
She went offline a couple hours ago and missed all the fun.

Maybe she has met with the hacker and now he is holding up his end of the agreement?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: tonyk on August 17, 2014, 06:18:53 am
I will leave you guys waiting for the pics or final payment. Whatever each of you is waiting for.

This was happy enough ending for me.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: m30188 on August 17, 2014, 06:20:16 am
I will leave you guys waiting for the pics or final payment. Whatever each of you is waiting for.

This was happy enough ending for me.
Pics.

Seriously though, wherever the negotiations ended up, I'm glad we didn't roll back.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: ElliottHe on August 17, 2014, 06:22:33 am

And a message by him:
"NXT being return. How about that deal? "

TheSir sent msg to the right people? Who is this guy NXT-QT7P-HWS6-SABB-G59H8?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Wakasaki808 on August 17, 2014, 06:25:50 am

And a message by him:
"NXT being return. How about that deal? "

TheSir sent msg to the right people? Who is this guy NXT-QT7P-HWS6-SABB-G59H8?

It's cobaltskyy
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: m30188 on August 17, 2014, 06:26:00 am

And a message by him:
"NXT being return. How about that deal? "

TheSir sent msg to the right people? Who is this guy NXT-QT7P-HWS6-SABB-G59H8?
lol
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: lucky88888 on August 17, 2014, 06:28:17 am
So what happened? What made him return the funds?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: maddy83 on August 17, 2014, 06:28:29 am
Assuming the deal was reached with option #1, would be interesting to know how much Bter ended up paying him.  ::) Lets see if Bter discloses this or not...

I hope the next step is for Bter to announce a comprehensive upgrade to their security procedures. They have lost a lot of trust and customers, now it is time they will start to build that trust back up.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: bitcoinpaul on August 17, 2014, 06:38:00 am
Obviously Cobaltskyy offered a deal. Now tell this the press!
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Jimmy2011 on August 17, 2014, 06:38:23 am
Assuming the deal was reached with option #1, would be interesting to know how much Bter ended up paying him.  ::) Lets see if Bter discloses this or not...


I think I have probably found the deal on the chain :)  I don't know whether I can disclose the address.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: bitcoinpaul on August 17, 2014, 06:41:26 am
https://nxtblocks.info/#section/txid/15648141648587944629

:D
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Cassius on August 17, 2014, 06:41:32 am
Helen of Troy had a face that launched 1,000 ships.
Cobaltsky... Nice going.
Good to know this was resolved before I'm out of internet access for 2 weeks. I do wonder what price BTER paid, though.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: mczarnek on August 17, 2014, 06:41:38 am
Assuming the deal was reached with option #1, would be interesting to know how much Bter ended up paying him.  ::) Lets see if Bter discloses this or not...


I think I have probably found the deal on the chain :)  I don't know whether I can disclose the address.


I think I did too ;) :  https://nxtblocks.info/#section/txid/12270192656192983805
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Jimmy2011 on August 17, 2014, 06:44:26 am
Assuming the deal was reached with option #1, would be interesting to know how much Bter ended up paying him.  ::) Lets see if Bter discloses this or not...


I think I have probably found the deal on the chain :)  I don't know whether I can disclose the address.


I think I did too:  https://nxtblocks.info/#section/txid/12270192656192983805

No. It's on Bitcoin Blockchain.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: lucky88888 on August 17, 2014, 06:45:01 am
and where is the last 8mil?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: TwinWinNerD on August 17, 2014, 06:47:21 am
and where is the last 8mil?

He licked blood and now wants to be part of NXT too!
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: zingzong on August 17, 2014, 06:49:49 am
We can't fork every time an exchange gets hacked.  BTER and the people who left a lot of Nxt on an exchange for any period of time were the ones who screwed up.  If there is any silver lining to this, it's that at least the thief realizes how valuable his nxt are.  I tend to believe him when he says he's not going to dump.  The reason he hasn't moved it yet, isn't because he's taunting us.. it's because he think he can sell it for more in the future..  probably after someone makes a NXT mixer.. and Nxt hits $1  Which is a shame..

We shouldn't trust the hacker to do the right thing.  We should remove his ability to cheat.

Edit: now where have I heard that before (http://wiki.nxtcrypto.org/wiki/BCNext%27s_Plan)?

and very soon this will be impossible anyways so everyone will no it cant happen again so how can this affect NXT badly???
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: zingzong on August 17, 2014, 07:08:50 am
just caught up. Seems like seriously dodged a bullet in last few days. My resolution and please everyone no more coins on exchanges, lets get the asset exchange used thats what it was designed for. Thank fuck thesir saw sense. still hope someone tracks the fuck down and he gets sent straight to jail wher he can share his small penis with hairy black men in the shower!!
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Jimmy2011 on August 17, 2014, 07:14:27 am
What I found some txs on the chain: all 7 btc txs have got more than 6 confirmations, and they matched perfectly with Nxt txs https://nxtblocks.info/#section/accountId/NXT-8WJ7-8A2H-MBYN-3W9K4

It seems that Nxt was sent first, and then bitcoin secondly. One Nxt tx seems to be even before the last btc tx, and the last btc and nxt tx interval is about 28 minutes, so maybe hacker was impatient again.

I'm wondering whether what I found on btc chain is the deal between BTER and the hacker.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: starfishi on August 17, 2014, 07:15:35 am
just caught up. Seems like seriously dodged a bullet in last few days. My resolution and please everyone no more coins on exchanges, lets get the asset exchange used thats what it was designed for. Thank fuck thesir saw sense. still hope someone tracks the fuck down and he gets sent straight to jail wher he can share his small penis with hairy black men in the shower!!

Yes, could you imagine a better promotion for MGW, than this whole story ?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: mczarnek on August 17, 2014, 07:18:54 am
What I found some txs on the chain: all 7 btc txs have got more than 6 confirmations, and they matched perfectly with Nxt txs https://nxtblocks.info/#section/accountId/NXT-8WJ7-8A2H-MBYN-3W9K4

It seems that Nxt was sent first, and then bitcoin secondly. One Nxt tx seems to be even before the last btc tx, and the last btc and nxt tx interval is about 28 minutes, so maybe hacker was impatient again.

I'm wondering whether what I found on btc chain is the deal between BTER and the hacker.

I suspect you're right, I say stick it up here.. both blockchains are public and if you don't share it, someone else will.  I suspect BTER just doesn't want to say anything until they receive the last bit because they don't want to risk blowing it.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: blackyblack1 on August 17, 2014, 07:33:52 am
I guess the deal is already over. Hacker will leave the rest of NXT for himself.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: mikesbmw on August 17, 2014, 07:41:26 am
I guess the deal is already over. Hacker will leave the rest of NXT for himself.
That's still hundredths of BTC!  >:(
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Coradan on August 17, 2014, 07:42:21 am
what's happened?  I can see that Thesir returned back the money...
The fork is not neccessary then, isnt it?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Wakasaki808 on August 17, 2014, 07:42:41 am
Guess hacker got 8m NXT out of the deal. At least bter got most of it back.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Jimmy2011 on August 17, 2014, 07:44:46 am

https://blockchain.info/address/1AEEasymuZCAXFEcLmgUwQZLA69Kc6GGUW
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Fatih87SK on August 17, 2014, 07:45:29 am
Guess hacker got 8m NXT out of the deal. At least bter got most of it back.
This is a nice sum of a bounty to catch him.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: farl4bit on August 17, 2014, 07:47:41 am
He didn't even prove that he is a hacker. Or am I missing something?

I don't believe this guy neither. He looks like someone who wants attention. Let him create a token to prove it.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Wakasaki808 on August 17, 2014, 07:52:55 am
He didn't even prove that he is a hacker. Or am I missing something?

I don't believe this guy neither. He looks like someone who wants attention. Let him create a token to prove it.

The guy messaged evildave what he wanted earlier. So if anything he read for forum
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: TwinWinNerD on August 17, 2014, 07:54:59 am

https://blockchain.info/address/1AEEasymuZCAXFEcLmgUwQZLA69Kc6GGUW


Wow, that was really cheap!!!!
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Wakasaki808 on August 17, 2014, 07:56:36 am

https://blockchain.info/address/1AEEasymuZCAXFEcLmgUwQZLA69Kc6GGUW


Wow, that was really cheap!!!!

Guess he accepted the offer pretty much. Just got the 8m of NXT as a final compensation
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: sava0123 on August 17, 2014, 07:59:33 am
440 + (8'325'356 * 0.000062) = 916 BTC. Well, like Fatih87SK said:

This is a nice sum of a bounty to catch him.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: TwinWinNerD on August 17, 2014, 08:03:00 am
440 + (8'325'356 * 0.000062) = 916 BTC. Well, like Fatih87SK said:

This is a nice sum of a bounty to catch him.

Not saying it is not much money, just saying BTER got away cheap ;)
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Come-from-Beyond on August 17, 2014, 08:10:31 am
This whole thing is an experiment to see if we would fork

Haha, extreme marketing.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: mikesbmw on August 17, 2014, 08:24:49 am

https://blockchain.info/address/1AEEasymuZCAXFEcLmgUwQZLA69Kc6GGUW


Wow, that was really cheap!!!!

Cheap? Hope you're kidding...

EDIT: just read your other comment.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: sava0123 on August 17, 2014, 08:28:59 am

https://blockchain.info/address/1AEEasymuZCAXFEcLmgUwQZLA69Kc6GGUW

How did you find this adress anyway?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: bitcoinpaul on August 17, 2014, 08:30:09 am

https://blockchain.info/address/1AEEasymuZCAXFEcLmgUwQZLA69Kc6GGUW

How did you find this adress anyway?

Obviously he's the hacker.

Moving on.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Jimmy2011 on August 17, 2014, 08:36:28 am

https://blockchain.info/address/1AEEasymuZCAXFEcLmgUwQZLA69Kc6GGUW

How did you find this adress anyway?

Obviously he's the hacker.

Moving on.

Perform blockchain analysis.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Sebastien256 on August 17, 2014, 08:40:59 am
@freeworm, an update in a new topic would be appropriate.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: zingzong on August 17, 2014, 08:56:02 am
ok so now if im forging with NXT in wallet on 1-2-5f can i just switch back to 1-2-5 with no issues?
edit: will transactions made on 1-2-5f be ok and in my wallet on 1-2-5, if not what to do?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Sebastien256 on August 17, 2014, 08:58:43 am
ok so now if im forging with NXT in wallet on 1-2-5f can i just switch back to 1-2-5 with no issues?

Yes, if the 1.2.5 directory has not been touch since you made the switch.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: ThomasVeil on August 17, 2014, 08:59:24 am
@freeworm, an update in a new topic would be appropriate.

Yes, name it "CobaltSkky wins!" :D
Man, one is out half a day for some social life, and misses a whole thriller plot, start to finish! I'll never do that mistake again.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: TimmyD on August 17, 2014, 09:02:01 am
Yey happy day i think
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: bitcoinpaul on August 17, 2014, 09:02:27 am
Man, one is out half a day for some social life, and misses a whole thriller plot, start to finish! I'll never do that mistake again.

Wtf r u doing outside? Internet is the real deal!
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: kodtycoon on August 17, 2014, 09:07:16 am
This is great to wake up to :) congrats to everyone getting their money back :D

Sent from my C1905 using Tapatalk

Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: zingzong on August 17, 2014, 09:09:16 am
ok so now if im forging with NXT in wallet on 1-2-5f can i just switch back to 1-2-5 with no issues?
edit: will transactions made on 1-2-5f be ok and in my wallet on 1-2-5, if not what to do?

all good just reverted back and balance including what was sent on 1-2-5f is as it should be. Im so fuckin relieved. Thank you 2 all for dealing with this situation. Much respect. remember no coins on exchanges !!!!
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: TimmyD on August 17, 2014, 09:10:31 am
i think ppl are getting <5k nxt at bter
the trades are dated 16/8 yesterday. or are these the old bter trades?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: lucky88888 on August 17, 2014, 09:12:04 am
8m still in his hands, not good enough.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Floater on August 17, 2014, 09:19:22 am
That piece of shit hacker was again not trustworthy. He just kept the 70BTC for the last batch and the 8mio NXT as well. What a fag. If BTER gives me back my money I will donate large part of it for hunting down the hacker if multiple hundred BTC bounty could come about by that.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Sebastien256 on August 17, 2014, 09:20:57 am
That piece of shit hacker was again not trustworthy. He just kept the 70BTC for the last batch and the 8mio NXT as well. What a fag. If BTER gives me back my money I will donate large part of it for hunting down the hacker if multiple hundred BTC bounty could come about by that.

was not Nxt send first on this deal? So that would simply mean that the hacker kept the Nxt.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: SamIbandii on August 17, 2014, 09:21:25 am
OK! And what have we learned about this? A hacker steals and got away with an amount of BTC and remaining NXT.
I urge all crypto exchanges to focus on security and credibility.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: mczarnek on August 17, 2014, 09:21:31 am
440 + (8'325'356 * 0.000062) = 916 BTC. Well, like Fatih87SK said:

This is a nice sum of a bounty to catch him.

Not saying it is not much money, just saying BTER got away cheap ;)

I don't call that cheap at all...  man that thief made a lot of money and BTER took a big hit.. within just a couple days this thief still has more money than I'd like him too.  Whole lot better than the situation a few months ago but I'd much rather he sell it all.  I don't want the stolen Nxt to be owned by the thief.

If he wants to take the BTC he received as payment and buy back in like the rest of us did.. so be it.  But the story does read better if he returned all the money.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Jacinto on August 17, 2014, 09:21:53 am
i think ppl are getting <5k nxt at bter
the trades are dated 16/8 yesterday. or are these the old bter trades?

That was another "fuck up" by Bter, who left open their old api, and some people took advantage from it. They closed it 10min after.
See:

https://twitter.com/btercom/status/500660592374321152 (https://twitter.com/btercom/status/500660592374321152)
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Sebastien256 on August 17, 2014, 09:22:54 am
i think ppl are getting <5k nxt at bter
the trades are dated 16/8 yesterday. or are these the old bter trades?

That was another "fuck up" by Bter, who left open their old api, and some people took advantage from it. They closed it 10min after.
See:

https://twitter.com/btercom/status/500660592374321152 (https://twitter.com/btercom/status/500660592374321152)

Those who sold low might end being the one getting fuck!
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: devphp on August 17, 2014, 09:26:31 am
Oh well, that's not a bad ending, I was already going to offer a trade to sell 5 "funny moneys" (that's what "f" stands for in 1.2.5f) on the forked chain for 1 true NXT of the main chain. I am sure advocates of the forked chain would jump on this offer with both feet.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: zingzong on August 17, 2014, 09:40:10 am
i think ppl are getting <5k nxt at bter
the trades are dated 16/8 yesterday. or are these the old bter trades?

That was another "fuck up" by Bter, who left open their old api, and some people took advantage from it. They closed it 10min after.
See:

https://twitter.com/btercom/status/500660592374321152 (https://twitter.com/btercom/status/500660592374321152)

Those who sold low might end being the one getting fuck!

think bter said they were gonna reverse the trades??
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Sebastien256 on August 17, 2014, 09:41:51 am
that would be the thing to do from bter, at least offer the possibility with a ticket.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Eadeqa on August 17, 2014, 09:42:15 am
i think ppl are getting <5k nxt at bter
the trades are dated 16/8 yesterday. or are these the old bter trades?

That was another "fuck up" by Bter, who left open their old api, and some people took advantage from it. They closed it 10min after.
See:

https://twitter.com/btercom/status/500660592374321152 (https://twitter.com/btercom/status/500660592374321152)

Those who sold low might end being the one getting fuck!

think bter said they were gonna reverse the trades??

How? The sellers probably withdrew the BTC from Bter
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: SamIbandii on August 17, 2014, 09:44:37 am
Now there is a thief who will enjoy exchanging his BTC and NXT. For how long can we trace his transactions?

How about calling the Bitcoin community for help and try to block the Hacker's BTC account?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Floater on August 17, 2014, 09:44:58 am


was not Nxt send first on this deal? So that would simply mean that the hacker kept the Nxt.
[/quote]

It depends... There were 7 BTC transfers and 7 NXT today, but yesterday the hacker just kept the last BTC transfer without anything in return.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Sebastien256 on August 17, 2014, 09:45:07 am
i think ppl are getting <5k nxt at bter
the trades are dated 16/8 yesterday. or are these the old bter trades?

That was another "fuck up" by Bter, who left open their old api, and some people took advantage from it. They closed it 10min after.
See:

https://twitter.com/btercom/status/500660592374321152 (https://twitter.com/btercom/status/500660592374321152)

Those who sold low might end being the one getting fuck!

think bter said they were gonna reverse the trades??

How? The sellers probably withdrew the BTC from Bter

these who withdraw won't be compensate for sure. I would not make sense otherwise.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: martismartis on August 17, 2014, 09:47:51 am
Hacker bought mgwBTC asset. Story not finished :)
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: WhiteRabbit on August 17, 2014, 09:48:47 am
Hey, Check it out. BgCaffe got quote on cryptocoinsnews:
http://www.cryptocoinsnews.com/news/blockchain-manipulated/2014/08/16?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=blockchain-manipulated (http://www.cryptocoinsnews.com/news/blockchain-manipulated/2014/08/16?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=blockchain-manipulated)
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: yassin54 on August 17, 2014, 09:49:07 am
hi all
i just woke up
small update plz?

the story is finished?  ;D ;D ;D

what is bilan final?

thanks
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Eadeqa on August 17, 2014, 09:49:35 am
Hacker bought mgwBTC asset. Story not finished :)

mgwBTC is centralized. Lock it -- ask jl77 to lock his BTC :)
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Sebastien256 on August 17, 2014, 09:56:23 am
Hacker bought mgwBTC asset. Story not finished :)

link or source would be nice when telling such thing.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Ezravdb on August 17, 2014, 09:59:25 am
Just read everything again.

40+ million returned..good first step..
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Jacinto on August 17, 2014, 09:59:37 am
Hacker bought mgwBTC asset. Story not finished :)

Lies.

The only new is that some joker has sent him 89000 MICoins: 

https://nxtblocks.info/#section/txid/15502930820461380096 (https://nxtblocks.info/#section/txid/15502930820461380096)

:D
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: maddy83 on August 17, 2014, 10:01:55 am
I think we will eventually be stronger because of the incident.

1. Exchanges will increase their security.
2. Customers will learn (once again) that keeping money at exchanges is not safe. (How many MtGoxes we need?)
3. New investors will see that rollback of NXT blockchain is not done lightly.

There has been a lot of negative incidents in NXT in the last few months. How about everyone of us does few small steps to prevent this, whether is to increase your security or something else? We have to learn from these incidents. Will we?

I wonder if the hacker is keeping the last 8 million until cobaltskky keeps her end of the "deal"?  :o
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: farl4bit on August 17, 2014, 10:04:16 am
I wonder if the hacker is keeping the last 8 million until cobaltskky keeps her end of the "deal"?  :o

NXT NSFW  ;D
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: martismartis on August 17, 2014, 10:04:51 am
Hacker bought mgwBTC asset. Story not finished :)

Lies.

The only new is that some joker has sent him 89000 MICoins: 

https://nxtblocks.info/#section/txid/15502930820461380096 (https://nxtblocks.info/#section/txid/15502930820461380096)

:D

http://87.230.14.1/nxt/nxt.cgi?action=3000&acc=1244396688755618309&switch=5
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: TimmyD on August 17, 2014, 10:04:57 am
Btdr should still get this guy found. you cant just appear and cause this amount of a shit storm and walk off onto the sunset. he will do it again .Now most of the nxt is returned lets find him. make an example of the piece of shit he is. hes a cancer to the crypto world we need to cut him off
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: yassin54 on August 17, 2014, 10:05:30 am
Just read everything again.

40+ million returned..good first step..

it is good news for customer bter  ;D ;D ;D  and marketing Nxt  :D :D

right now
be careful at all
 :D :D :D
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: farl4bit on August 17, 2014, 10:06:22 am
Are we sure the other exchanges have good safety? We should contact them and ask.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Come-from-Beyond on August 17, 2014, 10:08:21 am
Btdr should still get this guy found. you cant just appear and cause this amount of a shit storm and walk off onto the sunset. he will do it again .Now most of the nxt is returned lets find him. make an example of the piece of shit he is. hes a cancer to the crypto world we need to cut him off

No. If the deal included that he could walk away without bounty for his head then we ought to respect it.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: TheWireMaster on August 17, 2014, 10:10:28 am
Is there a way to create a direct bridge between fiat and mgw?


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Sebastien256 on August 17, 2014, 10:10:58 am
Btdr should still get this guy found. you cant just appear and cause this amount of a shit storm and walk off onto the sunset. he will do it again .Now most of the nxt is returned lets find him. make an example of the piece of shit he is. hes a cancer to the crypto world we need to cut him off

No. If the deal included that he could walk away without bounty for his head then we ought to respect it.

That do not stop anyone from putting bounty on his head anyway (fundraising bounty).
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: WolfofCrypto on August 17, 2014, 10:11:42 am
http://pubmemo.com/i/other-tidbits/more-tidings/2014/nxt-cryptocurrency-maintains-integrity-after-the-stolen-1-65-million_1639362.html
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: TimmyD on August 17, 2014, 10:12:20 am
Btdr should still get this guy found. you cant just appear and cause this amount of a shit storm and walk off onto the sunset. he will do it again .Now most of the nxt is returned lets find him. make an example of the piece of shit he is. hes a cancer to the crypto world we need to cut him off

No. If the deal included that he could walk away without bounty for his head then we ought to respect it.
Dude i have not 1 single ounce of respect for that guy at all. he nearly fcked it for all of us. he deserves no respect
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Eadeqa on August 17, 2014, 10:12:40 am
Are we sure the other exchanges have good safety? We should contact them and ask.

Lets not use exchanges as wallets

https://wallet.mynxt.info/
https://nxtblocks.info/#wallet
https://trade.secureae.com/

All these are better options if someone doesn't want to download software/blockchain
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: abctc on August 17, 2014, 10:15:59 am
I wonder if the hacker is keeping the last 8 million until cobaltskky keeps her end of the "deal"? 
- no, she has written "If you send me the 45mil NXT" - not to Bter.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: lucky88888 on August 17, 2014, 10:17:03 am
Btdr should still get this guy found. you cant just appear and cause this amount of a shit storm and walk off onto the sunset. he will do it again .Now most of the nxt is returned lets find him. make an example of the piece of shit he is. hes a cancer to the crypto world we need to cut him off

No. If the deal included that he could walk away without bounty for his head then we ought to respect it.

Not if he keeps that remaining 8mil to himself! We need the full funds!
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: devphp on August 17, 2014, 10:21:01 am
Is 40+ mil returned to bter or is this still not confirmed? Did freeworm confirm this officially?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: martismartis on August 17, 2014, 10:22:27 am
Hacker bought mgwBTC asset. Story not finished :)

Lies.

The only new is that some joker has sent him 89000 MICoins: 

https://nxtblocks.info/#section/txid/15502930820461380096 (https://nxtblocks.info/#section/txid/15502930820461380096)

:D

http://87.230.14.1/nxt/nxt.cgi?action=3000&acc=1244396688755618309&switch=5

So what we can do with this? IMO will be big dump on MGW.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Eadeqa on August 17, 2014, 10:27:37 am
So what we can do with this? IMO will be big dump on MGW.

Let him dump. 8 million isn't as bad 45 million. The market will absorb it. Plus he risks getting locked by JL7.

I don't think he is planning to dump anything for an year. He will disappear till everything is forgotten. 
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Sebastien256 on August 17, 2014, 10:29:41 am
So what we can do with this? IMO will be big dump on MGW.

Let him dump. 8 million isn't as bad 45 million. The market will absorb it. Plus he risks getting locked by JL7.

I don't think he is planning to dump anything for an year. He will disappear till everything is forgotten.

hey, you think Bter will forgot this?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: valarmg on August 17, 2014, 10:30:00 am
Is there a way to create a direct bridge between fiat and mgw?


You need to create a Fiat gateway. So someone creates a special bank account and a gatewayDOLLAR asset, and everyone who deposits dollars in that bank account gets gatewayDOLLARs, and it costs gatewayDOLLARs to withdraw. Then gatewayDOLLARs can be traded for mgwBTC on the AE. I'm sure there are lots of complications on the banking and legal side.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: TwinWinNerD on August 17, 2014, 10:30:17 am
So what we can do with this? IMO will be big dump on MGW.

Let him dump. 8 million isn't as bad 45 million. The market will absorb it. Plus he risks getting locked by JL7.

I don't think he is planning to dump anything for an year. He will disappear till everything is forgotten. 

It would be awesome if he dumps on the MGW!
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Sebastien256 on August 17, 2014, 10:32:10 am
It would be awesome if he dumps on the MGW!

probably not. unless James have anti-theft security measure.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Eadeqa on August 17, 2014, 10:34:14 am
It would be awesome if he dumps on the MGW!

probably not. unless James have anti-theft security measure.

Why? He has real nxt., They will be absorbed/bought.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Sebastien256 on August 17, 2014, 10:35:49 am
It would be awesome if he dumps on the MGW!

probably not. unless James have anti-theft security measure.

Why? He has real nxt., They will be absorbed/bought.

Come on! Those Nxt are not belonging to the thief!
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Eadeqa on August 17, 2014, 10:38:01 am
Come on! Those Nxt are not belonging to the thief!

He owns them now.  Bter made a deal with him -- not that we can do anything about it now.

But as I said, I doubt he will dump anything now. He can sit on those nxt for years.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Ezravdb on August 17, 2014, 10:38:18 am
It would be awesome if he dumps on the MGW!

probably not. unless James have anti-theft security measure.

Why? He has real nxt., They will be absorbed/bought.

Come on! Those Nxt are not belonging to the thief!

In deed, would you be happy to buy NXT stolen from your fellow community members? While the thief gets BTC for it
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Ezravdb on August 17, 2014, 10:38:54 am
Come on! Those Nxt are not belonging to the thief!

He owns them now.  Bter made a deal with him.

What deal?

We dont know shit atm
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: crimi on August 17, 2014, 10:39:11 am
Im highly invested in MICoins as you can see in my address ;D

Will he dump this 89000 MICoins? Will he anounce it? OMG worst day of my life...
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Eadeqa on August 17, 2014, 10:40:06 am
Come on! Those Nxt are not belonging to the thief!

He owns them now.  Bter made a deal with him.

What deal?

We dont know shit atm

They paid him 330 BTC for 43 million nxt. We know that much?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Eadeqa on August 17, 2014, 10:41:43 am
In deed, would you be happy to buy NXT stolen from your fellow community members? While the thief gets BTC for it

I would be happy if he dumps it now than 2 years later. Why do you want him to keep the nxt?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: sava0123 on August 17, 2014, 10:43:28 am
Guys what are you talking about? He has only 0.000001 at MGW and 89000 MIC.

https://nxtblocks.info/#section/accountId/NXT-8WJ7-8A2H-MBYN-3W9K4 (https://nxtblocks.info/#section/accountId/NXT-8WJ7-8A2H-MBYN-3W9K4)
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: devphp on August 17, 2014, 10:43:59 am
He said he believes in NXT, why do you think he will dump? He is apparently not stupid and understands the potential of NXT. He's got enough BTC to dump for a while, he'll wait till NXT is worth much more.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Ezravdb on August 17, 2014, 10:44:30 am
I still hope that he gives the last batch back..

And I am waiting for an official announcement from BTER
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Eadeqa on August 17, 2014, 10:49:26 am
I still hope that he gives the last batch back..

That's "dump" too as he getting BTC for it.

Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: TwinWinNerD on August 17, 2014, 10:51:15 am
Why I would be happy if he dumps NXT on the MGW? Because cheap NXT, that is why.

BTER will refund customers, this is not my problem (also I have NXT on bter too)
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Eadeqa on August 17, 2014, 10:52:38 am
By the way, how do you know the remaining 8 million are people's Nxt? Some of those Nxt were Bter's own as they must have collected a large chunk after 8 months of trading
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: TwinWinNerD on August 17, 2014, 10:53:36 am
By the way, how do you know the remaining 8 million are people's Nxt? Some of those Nxt were Bter's own as they must have collected a large chunk after 8 months of trading

+ 8 months of 0.5% withdrawal fees.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Ezravdb on August 17, 2014, 10:57:15 am
True..Lets just wait for announcement from BTER's side.

I am sure they  will be able to fix a lot with 45 million NXT.

Also they had another wallet with a smaller portion of NXT.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: devphp on August 17, 2014, 10:58:33 am
Let's guess how many NXTs will be withdrawn within 24 hours when they open withdrawals again. My guess is 5 mil will be withdrawn, no more :)
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Sebastien256 on August 17, 2014, 11:00:18 am
Let's guess how many NXTs will be withdrawn within 24 hours when they open withdrawals again. My guess is 5 mil will be withdrawn, no more :)

yes, if they put a 2% withdraw fee  ::). otherwise it will be more...
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Ezravdb on August 17, 2014, 11:00:59 am
Let's guess how many NXTs will be withdrawn within 24 hours when they open withdrawals again. My guess is 5 mil will be withdrawn, no more :)

200K from my side
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: devphp on August 17, 2014, 11:01:24 am
Let's guess how many NXTs will be withdrawn within 24 hours when they open withdrawals again. My guess is 5 mil will be withdrawn, no more :)

yes, if they put a 2% withdraw fee  ::). otherwise it will be more...

Would a 2% fee stop people from withdrawing despite the recent hack?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: davethetrousers on August 17, 2014, 11:01:38 am
Let's guess how many NXTs will be withdrawn within 24 hours when they open withdrawals again. My guess is 5 mil will be withdrawn, no more :)

We could also speculate on their new interest rate that they pay for NXT holdings.

10%? 20%? How much do they have to step it up to regain any form of trust :D
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Sebastien256 on August 17, 2014, 11:04:07 am
Let's guess how many NXTs will be withdrawn within 24 hours when they open withdrawals again. My guess is 5 mil will be withdrawn, no more :)

yes, if they put a 2% withdraw fee  ::). otherwise it will be more...

Would a 2% fee stop people from withdrawing despite the recent hack?

idk. this was more a joke than anything else... Althougt, they could do that for the first few weeks to calm down everything.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Jacinto on August 17, 2014, 11:08:18 am
Hacker bought mgwBTC asset. Story not finished :)

Lies.

The only new is that some joker has sent him 89000 MICoins: 

https://nxtblocks.info/#section/txid/15502930820461380096 (https://nxtblocks.info/#section/txid/15502930820461380096)

:D

http://87.230.14.1/nxt/nxt.cgi?action=3000&acc=1244396688755618309&switch=5

So what we can do with this? IMO will be big dump on MGW.

Martismartis why do you keep liying?

He did not buy a single piece of mgwBTC.

2days ago somebody sent him 100sats of mgwBTC...which is peanuts.

End of the story.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: martismartis on August 17, 2014, 11:12:34 am
Hacker bought mgwBTC asset. Story not finished :)

Lies.

The only new is that some joker has sent him 89000 MICoins: 

https://nxtblocks.info/#section/txid/15502930820461380096 (https://nxtblocks.info/#section/txid/15502930820461380096)

:D

http://87.230.14.1/nxt/nxt.cgi?action=3000&acc=1244396688755618309&switch=5

So what we can do with this? IMO will be big dump on MGW.

Martismartis why do you keep liying?

He did not buy a single piece of mgwBTC.

2days ago somebody sent him 100sats of mgwBTC...which is peanuts.

End of the story.

Are you blind or what is the problem with you?
http://www.mynxt.info/blockexplorer/details.php?action=ac&ac=1244396688755618309

Look at the last transaction and the date of it.

Check the stakeholders list of mgwBTC asset on nxtblocks.info

Check the date here again: http://87.230.14.1/nxt/nxt.cgi?action=3000&acc=1244396688755618309&switch=5

Or I don't understand something?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Ezravdb on August 17, 2014, 11:15:40 am
Hacker bought mgwBTC asset. Story not finished :)

Lies.

The only new is that some joker has sent him 89000 MICoins: 

https://nxtblocks.info/#section/txid/15502930820461380096 (https://nxtblocks.info/#section/txid/15502930820461380096)

:D

http://87.230.14.1/nxt/nxt.cgi?action=3000&acc=1244396688755618309&switch=5

So what we can do with this? IMO will be big dump on MGW.

Martismartis why do you keep liying?

He did not buy a single piece of mgwBTC.

2days ago somebody sent him 100sats of mgwBTC...which is peanuts.

End of the story.

Are you blind or what is the problem with you?
http://www.mynxt.info/blockexplorer/details.php?action=ac&ac=1244396688755618309

Look at the last transaction and the date of it.

Check the stakeholders list of mgwBTC asset on nxtblocks.info

Check the date here again: http://87.230.14.1/nxt/nxt.cgi?action=3000&acc=1244396688755618309&switch=5

Or I don't understand something?

It says 100 QNT when you click on transaction id.
Which is the equivalent of 100 mgwBTC satoshis
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Come-from-Beyond on August 17, 2014, 11:16:19 am
That do not stop anyone from putting bounty on his head anyway (fundraising bounty).

In this case next time we won't have an option to make a deal with a hacker.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: sava0123 on August 17, 2014, 11:16:46 am
Hacker bought mgwBTC asset. Story not finished :)

Lies.

The only new is that some joker has sent him 89000 MICoins: 

https://nxtblocks.info/#section/txid/15502930820461380096 (https://nxtblocks.info/#section/txid/15502930820461380096)

:D

http://87.230.14.1/nxt/nxt.cgi?action=3000&acc=1244396688755618309&switch=5

So what we can do with this? IMO will be big dump on MGW.

Martismartis why do you keep liying?

He did not buy a single piece of mgwBTC.

2days ago somebody sent him 100sats of mgwBTC...which is peanuts.

End of the story.

Are you blind or what is the problem with you?
http://www.mynxt.info/blockexplorer/details.php?action=ac&ac=1244396688755618309

Look at the last transaction and the date of it.

Check the stakeholders list of mgwBTC asset on nxtblocks.info

Check the date here again: http://87.230.14.1/nxt/nxt.cgi?action=3000&acc=1244396688755618309&switch=5

Or I don't understand something?


He holds 0.000001 at MGW and 89000 MIC.

https://nxtblocks.info/#section/accountId/NXT-8WJ7-8A2H-MBYN-3W9K4 (https://nxtblocks.info/#section/accountId/NXT-8WJ7-8A2H-MBYN-3W9K4)
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Jacinto on August 17, 2014, 11:17:25 am
is martismartis in a mental hard-fork?  ???

I don't understand!
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: TimmyD on August 17, 2014, 11:17:36 am
Let's guess how many NXTs will be withdrawn within 24 hours when they open withdrawals again. My guess is 5 mil will be withdrawn, no more :)
Get forging those fees lol
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: martismartis on August 17, 2014, 11:18:07 am
Hacker bought mgwBTC asset. Story not finished :)

Lies.

The only new is that some joker has sent him 89000 MICoins: 

https://nxtblocks.info/#section/txid/15502930820461380096 (https://nxtblocks.info/#section/txid/15502930820461380096)

:D

http://87.230.14.1/nxt/nxt.cgi?action=3000&acc=1244396688755618309&switch=5

So what we can do with this? IMO will be big dump on MGW.

Martismartis why do you keep liying?

He did not buy a single piece of mgwBTC.

2days ago somebody sent him 100sats of mgwBTC...which is peanuts.

End of the story.

Are you blind or what is the problem with you?
http://www.mynxt.info/blockexplorer/details.php?action=ac&ac=1244396688755618309

Look at the last transaction and the date of it.

Check the stakeholders list of mgwBTC asset on nxtblocks.info

Check the date here again: http://87.230.14.1/nxt/nxt.cgi?action=3000&acc=1244396688755618309&switch=5

Or I don't understand something?

It says 100 QNT when you click on transaction id.
Which is the equivalent of 100 mgwBTC satoshis

Yes and I didn't say that he already dumped. Maybe, he is not familiar with MGW and now he is testing with small amount how it works. It is only my personal opinion :)
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: TimmyD on August 17, 2014, 11:18:49 am
That do not stop anyone from putting bounty on his head anyway (fundraising bounty).

In this case next time we won't have an option to make a deal with a hacker.
the idea of catching this guynis to make an examplenof the douche and hopefully everyone else will make the smarter choice and not steal!
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: devphp on August 17, 2014, 11:21:23 am
Let's guess how many NXTs will be withdrawn within 24 hours when they open withdrawals again. My guess is 5 mil will be withdrawn, no more :)
Get forging those fees lol

Oh I am forging, not getting much with my little stake, but it still gives me importance in my own eyes :D
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: thebutterfly on August 17, 2014, 11:34:44 am
I respectfully submit that, "Option 1" is the proper, legitimate manner to proceed.

Best regards to all NXT community members.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Picsou on August 17, 2014, 11:42:57 am

Now that this whole thing is coming to an end, I like to understand something :

What is the risk of forging, regarding to the account password ?

'cause if I understood well, the hacker got access to bter server, and discovered a few passwords. Then he just had to connect to this own node or even an online wallet service to try those password, and succesfully got access to bter nxt account because of using the same password on 90% of his admin accounts.
That means bter nxt account could have been offline, the result would have been the same.

Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Eadeqa on August 17, 2014, 11:52:09 am
Yes and I didn't say that he already dumped. Maybe, he is not familiar with MGW and now he is testing with small amount how it works. It is only my personal opinion :)

He didn't buy MGW. Soneone sent to him 100 satoshi https://nxtblocks.info/#section/txid/3943495016275895492
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Eadeqa on August 17, 2014, 11:54:34 am
What is the risk of forging, regarding to the account password ?

There is no risk with forging. The password is in memory (only forge on your own machine though, not on VPS)
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: martismartis on August 17, 2014, 11:55:28 am
Yes and I didn't say that he already dumped. Maybe, he is not familiar with MGW and now he is testing with small amount how it works. It is only my personal opinion :)

He didn't buy MGW. Soneone sent to him 100 satoshi https://nxtblocks.info/#section/txid/3943495016275895492

So what is the operation 2 hours ago?

http://www.mynxt.info/blockexplorer/details.php?action=ac&ac=1244396688755618309
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Eadeqa on August 17, 2014, 11:58:36 am
Yes and I didn't say that he already dumped. Maybe, he is not familiar with MGW and now he is testing with small amount how it works. It is only my personal opinion :)

He didn't buy MGW. Soneone sent to him 100 satoshi https://nxtblocks.info/#section/txid/3943495016275895492

So what is the operation 2 hours ago?

http://www.mynxt.info/blockexplorer/details.php?action=ac&ac=1244396688755618309


Someone sent him micoin in that transaction.  Are you even looking at "From" and "To"?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Wakasaki808 on August 17, 2014, 11:59:00 am
Yes and I didn't say that he already dumped. Maybe, he is not familiar with MGW and now he is testing with small amount how it works. It is only my personal opinion :)

He didn't buy MGW. Soneone sent to him 100 satoshi https://nxtblocks.info/#section/txid/3943495016275895492

So what is the operation 2 hours ago?

http://www.mynxt.info/blockexplorer/details.php?action=ac&ac=1244396688755618309

The 89000 micoins I believe
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Jacinto on August 17, 2014, 11:59:16 am
Yes and I didn't say that he already dumped. Maybe, he is not familiar with MGW and now he is testing with small amount how it works. It is only my personal opinion :)

He didn't buy MGW. Soneone sent to him 100 satoshi https://nxtblocks.info/#section/txid/3943495016275895492

So what is the operation 2 hours ago?

http://www.mynxt.info/blockexplorer/details.php?action=ac&ac=1244396688755618309

My god martismartis!
That was the joke-transfer of MICoins (https://nxtblocks.info/#section/txid/15502930820461380096 (https://nxtblocks.info/#section/txid/15502930820461380096)). Is all right now?  :-\
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Ezravdb on August 17, 2014, 12:02:30 pm
Please STAHP martismartis
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: martismartis on August 17, 2014, 12:02:51 pm
Yes and I didn't say that he already dumped. Maybe, he is not familiar with MGW and now he is testing with small amount how it works. It is only my personal opinion :)

He didn't buy MGW. Soneone sent to him 100 satoshi https://nxtblocks.info/#section/txid/3943495016275895492

So what is the operation 2 hours ago?

http://www.mynxt.info/blockexplorer/details.php?action=ac&ac=1244396688755618309

The 89000 micoins I believe

Ah, OK, my mistake :(
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: lucky88888 on August 17, 2014, 12:04:09 pm

Now that this whole thing is coming to an end, I like to understand something :

What is the risk of forging, regarding to the account password ?

'cause if I understood well, the hacker got access to bter server, and discovered a few passwords. Then he just had to connect to this own node or even an online wallet service to try those password, and succesfully got access to bter nxt account because of using the same password on 90% of his admin accounts.
That means bter nxt account could have been offline, the result would have been the same.

The hacker has Bter nxt wallet's passphrase as well. He wouldn't be able to send the nxt out without that, forging or not forging.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Picsou on August 17, 2014, 12:06:45 pm
What is the risk of forging, regarding to the account password ?

There is no risk with forging. The password is in memory

Thanks.

By memory, do you mean RAM ? If yes, I suppose only a hash of the password is readable for someone skilled enough to dump and read the ram of the server ? And is the password still kept in clear in the browser memory ? (means is it still safer to swip the browser memory or to close it ? 

edit : I forge on a nas (syno) and get connected from a windows pc with a firefox browser dedicated to that (no other websurfing with it)
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: gs02xzz on August 17, 2014, 12:06:58 pm
http://pubmemo.com/i/other-tidbits/more-tidings/2014/nxt-cryptocurrency-maintains-integrity-after-the-stolen-1-65-million_1639362.html

+1. Great article!

Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Darkmoon on August 17, 2014, 12:13:06 pm
440 + (8'325'356 * 0.000062) = 916 BTC. Well, like Fatih87SK said:

This is a nice sum of a bounty to catch him.

Not saying it is not much money, just saying BTER got away cheap ;)

What are you walking about? BTER makes 500 BTC a year at most.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Picsou on August 17, 2014, 12:15:48 pm

Now that this whole thing is coming to an end, I like to understand something :

What is the risk of forging, regarding to the account password ?

'cause if I understood well, the hacker got access to bter server, and discovered a few passwords. Then he just had to connect to this own node or even an online wallet service to try those password, and succesfully got access to bter nxt account because of using the same password on 90% of his admin accounts.
That means bter nxt account could have been offline, the result would have been the same.

The hacker has Bter nxt wallet's passphrase as well. He wouldn't be able to send the nxt out without that, forging or not forging.

By password, I mean the nxt account passphrase too. As far as I understand, the passphrase was the same as an admin password of Lin's BTER server.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Ezravdb on August 17, 2014, 12:20:16 pm
440 + (8'325'356 * 0.000062) = 916 BTC. Well, like Fatih87SK said:

This is a nice sum of a bounty to catch him.

Not saying it is not much money, just saying BTER got away cheap ;)

What are you walking about? BTER makes 500 BTC a year at most.

Hmm I think more, their CNY markets are pretty big.
Plus the fees are not too shabby
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: TheWireMaster on August 17, 2014, 12:20:51 pm


You need to create a Fiat gateway. So someone creates a special bank account and a gatewayDOLLAR asset, and everyone who deposits dollars in that bank account gets gatewayDOLLARs, and it costs gatewayDOLLARs to withdraw. Then gatewayDOLLARs can be traded for mgwBTC on the AE. I'm sure there are lots of complications on the banking and legal side.

If exchanges can do it, it should be possible... If someone would have a bitpay account and then distribute the deposits according to the address specified, there will be a direct conversion and directly in the mgwBTC account, or not?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: nexern on August 17, 2014, 12:21:24 pm
good, a deal has been made. i am curious about the official bter statement later. hope they can remain in business.

btw, the best reply within whole AM conversations  #4  ;D

http://nxtexplorer.com/nxt/nxt.cgi?action=3000&acc=1244396688755618309&switch=900
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Mexxer on August 17, 2014, 12:25:45 pm


You need to create a Fiat gateway. So someone creates a special bank account and a gatewayDOLLAR asset, and everyone who deposits dollars in that bank account gets gatewayDOLLARs, and it costs gatewayDOLLARs to withdraw. Then gatewayDOLLARs can be traded for mgwBTC on the AE. I'm sure there are lots of complications on the banking and legal side.

If exchanges can do it, it should be possible... If someone would have a bitpay account and then distribute the deposits according to the address specified, there will be a direct conversion and directly in the mgwBTC account, or not?

That would be pretty illegal in every country in know.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: frohlocke on August 17, 2014, 12:27:59 pm
440 + (8'325'356 * 0.000062) = 916 BTC. Well, like Fatih87SK said:

This is a nice sum of a bounty to catch him.

Not saying it is not much money, just saying BTER got away cheap ;)

What are you walking about? BTER makes 500 BTC a year at most.

Hmm I think more, their CNY markets are pretty big.
Plus the fees are not too shabby

Sum of withdrawl fees are hardly  predictable.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Come-from-Beyond on August 17, 2014, 12:39:07 pm
That would be pretty illegal in every country in know.

Even Somalia?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Mexxer on August 17, 2014, 12:41:07 pm
I just catched up with this thread ...

Honestly people ... that was the best possible outcome for Nxt. We didn't do the rollback, the hacker gave most of the Nxt back, BTER learned an expensive security lesson, and all this gave Nxt alot of publicity, the incident is on the frontpage of r/bitcoin again. Very bullish outlook!
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Mexxer on August 17, 2014, 12:41:56 pm
That would be pretty illegal in every country in know.

Even Somalia?

That I don't know.  ;D
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Ezravdb on August 17, 2014, 12:43:28 pm
I just catched up with this thread ...

Honestly people ... that was the best possible outcome for Nxt. We didn't do the rollback, the hacker gave most of the Nxt back, BTER learned an expensive security lesson, and all this gave Nxt alot of publicity, the incident is on the frontpage of r/bitcoin again. Very bullish outlook!

Could have been much worse in deed..

Hope BTER will not be in a great net loss
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: cobaltskky on August 17, 2014, 01:06:47 pm
Yay, we won!  I didn't even have to put out! lol  Of course, I didn't get any NXT either. :'(
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: vincentvincent on August 17, 2014, 01:07:57 pm
hxxp://www.mynxt.info/blockexplorer/details.php?action=tx&tx=4809715070403526432

Message: Dumbass. You didn't send it to my account. Send me 5 mill NXT, and I'll let you lick my brown starfish.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: cobaltskky on August 17, 2014, 01:17:43 pm
hxxp://www.mynxt.info/blockexplorer/details.php?action=tx&tx=4809715070403526432

Message: Dumbass. You didn't send it to my account. Send me 5 mill NXT, and I'll let you lick my brown starfish.

Yep! lol  I think I will be flippant now that he isn't holding 5% of our marketcap hostage. ;)  Don't forget the next couple messages! lol

QUOTE: This is taking too long. I spent an hour catching up on the forums, and ten minutes waiting for your reply.

QUOTE: Deal is off. Good night.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Berzerk on August 17, 2014, 01:19:54 pm
Yay, we won!  I didn't even have to put out! lol  Of course, I didn't get any NXT either. :'(

Will we see a video? :D
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: TimmyD on August 17, 2014, 01:22:30 pm
Yes all looks good if you ask me. Nxt pr we are stronger than ever. nxt returned to bter or most of. cobaltskky still has her decency lol. today is a new beginning.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Ezravdb on August 17, 2014, 01:27:25 pm
Lol did she really put out that message herself? :-X
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: bation on August 17, 2014, 01:32:50 pm
Didn't we say that he lives in Poland?

I think i've found something...
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: bidji29 on August 17, 2014, 01:44:52 pm
Bter is now at -400 btc and -8Millions NXT.
Nothing like before but still a huge amount. What is their plan from now on? Are they solvent?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: bitcoinpaul on August 17, 2014, 01:47:57 pm
Didn't we say that he lives in Poland?

I think i've found something...

Now it get's interesting...
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: vincentvincent on August 17, 2014, 01:49:12 pm
hxxp://www.mynxt.info/blockexplorer/details.php?action=tx&tx=4809715070403526432

Message: Dumbass. You didn't send it to my account. Send me 5 mill NXT, and I'll let you lick my brown starfish.

Yep! lol  I think I will be flippant now that he isn't holding 5% of our marketcap hostage. ;)  Don't forget the next couple messages! lol

QUOTE: This is taking too long. I spent an hour catching up on the forums, and ten minutes waiting for your reply.

QUOTE: Deal is off. Good night.

Woooohaaaa!
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: TimmyD on August 17, 2014, 01:51:45 pm
Didn't we say that he lives in Poland?

I think i've found something...

Now it get's interesting...
Also interested to hear. please do tell
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: 8 on August 17, 2014, 01:53:22 pm
Someone whose money is stolen has to pay quite many amount of money to the thief to beg him to return the stolen money. It is none sense in reality. At some extent it incourage the hackers who try to discover security flaw and exploit it to steal the cryptocurrency.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Ezravdb on August 17, 2014, 01:55:27 pm
Bter is now at -400 btc and -8Millions NXT.
Nothing like before but still a huge amount. What is their plan from now on? Are they solvent?

-330 BTC right?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: bation on August 17, 2014, 02:02:54 pm
Didn't we say that he lives in Poland?

I think i've found something...

Now it get's interesting...

I'm not allowed to share links here because of my newbie status.

can I send the text to someone else to publish it for me?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: cobaltskky on August 17, 2014, 02:14:40 pm
Didn't we say that he lives in Poland?

I think i've found something...

Now it get's interesting...

Sure - send it over.

I'm not allowed to share links here because of my newbie status.

can I send the text to someone else to publish it for me?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: cobaltskky on August 17, 2014, 02:14:55 pm
Lol did she really put out that message herself? :-X

Yes, she did. lol
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: bation on August 17, 2014, 02:16:54 pm
Didn't we say that he lives in Poland?

I think i've found something...

Now it get's interesting...

Sure - send it over.

I'm not allowed to share links here because of my newbie status.

can I send the text to someone else to publish it for me?

Sent...
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: bation on August 17, 2014, 02:20:43 pm
Didn't we say that he lives in Poland?

I think i've found something...

Now it get's interesting...

Personally I think that he is an amateur who got lucky...

*REMOVED by Damelon*

what do you say about that?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: crypto4jan on August 17, 2014, 02:26:44 pm
Would you presonaly buy NXT if you encountered it only now, this day, knowing that there are stole 46mils flying around. I wouldn't..

This argument goes both ways. Who would trust Nxt blockchain when the transactions can be reversed if most people don't like it? What's next? What if in the future the govt demands to reverse transactions from silkroad  for example?

+1440
+1440^999999
Option 1 or 2
Don't mess wit thee blockchain that is the end of NXT imo.

Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Tiger on August 17, 2014, 02:31:24 pm
what do you say about that?

The internet says that he accepts Bitcoins...
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: feeleep on August 17, 2014, 02:32:25 pm
the domain has privacy which is very uncommon for an address like that.
but the person could be revealed by purchasing the full report for $49.
(it shows 7 years of historical Whois records)


I can see the domain was updated 2 days ago...:

Created on 2001-09-13 - Expires on 2015-09-13 - Updated on 2014-08-15

Interesting...
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: bation on August 17, 2014, 02:33:01 pm
what do you say about that?

The internet says that he accepts Bitcoins...

How do you know that?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: bation on August 17, 2014, 02:34:10 pm
the domain has privacy which is very uncommon for an address like that.
but the person could be revealed by purchasing the full report for $49.
(it shows 7 years of historical Whois records)


I can see the domain was updated 2 days ago...:

Created on 2001-09-13 - Expires on 2015-09-13 - Updated on 2014-08-15

Interesting...

Yes . I saw it also...

there are also 2 cities which he can live in. one of them is very small.

Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Jacinto on August 17, 2014, 02:41:13 pm

Personally I think that he is an amateur who got lucky...

INFORMATION REMOVED BY FORUM STAFF


Amazing!

You should publish this info in a new thread.

I hope you are in the right way, I will love to see the hacker crying for his life  :)
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: pazor on August 17, 2014, 02:43:26 pm
option 1 -> prefer
option 2 -> last exit
option 3 -> never ever
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: wesley on August 17, 2014, 02:50:10 pm
Quote
is following 16 groups. one of the is "Hacker News"...

Lol, hacker news is quite well known has nothing to do with "hacking". http://news.ycombinator.com

Also, thesir.com is probably just a domain squatted domain, it's for sale.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: bitcoinpaul on August 17, 2014, 02:55:09 pm
Created on 2001-09-13 - Expires on 2015-09-13 - Updated on 2014-08-15


Mmmmhhhh
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: bation on August 17, 2014, 03:02:16 pm
Also, thesir.com is probably just a domain squatted domain, it's for sale.

eNom.com, as far as I know, don't squat for themselves, and if I was a major squatter I wouldn't buy/host the domain with them,
due to extra unnecessary commissions.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: freeworm on August 17, 2014, 03:05:24 pm
Update: Aug. 17 2014: As you can see in our wallet, We have got most NXT back except the last 8m. The hacker disappeared again before we finish the new deal with him. We are still working on it for the left 8m. Will keep you updated. 
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: pazor on August 17, 2014, 03:07:45 pm
Update: Aug. 17 2014: As you can see in our wallet, We have got most NXT back except the last 8m. The hacker disappeared again before we finish the new deal with him. We are still working on it for the left 8m. Will keep you updated.

good news !
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: qbd1313 on August 17, 2014, 03:10:04 pm
Update: Aug. 17 2014: As you can see in our wallet, We have got most NXT back except the last 8m. The hacker disappeared again before we finish the new deal with him. We are still working on it for the left 8m. Will keep you updated.

we will find him。。。
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Jacinto on August 17, 2014, 03:11:03 pm
Update: Aug. 17 2014: As you can see in our wallet, We have got most NXT back except the last 8m. The hacker disappeared again before we finish the new deal with him. We are still working on it for the left 8m. Will keep you updated.

 :)

Thanks! Hope you will continue with your bussiness as before.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: TheCryptoWoman on August 17, 2014, 03:11:29 pm

Personally I think that he is an amateur who got lucky...

INFORMATION REMOVED BY FORUM STAFF


Here is a screenshot of Whois history from DomainTools for you sleuths:

INFORMATION REMOVED BY FORUM STAFF

Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: lucky88888 on August 17, 2014, 03:12:15 pm
edit

Good catch! Lets see how this goes! if anything came out of this, you should get some reward for this.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: EvilDave on August 17, 2014, 03:12:54 pm
Update: Aug. 17 2014: As you can see in our wallet, We have got most NXT back except the last 8m. The hacker disappeared again before we finish the new deal with him. We are still working on it for the left 8m. Will keep you updated.

Good work guys, proud of ya. !
This is really the best possible outcome, even though it's not perfect.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: DoM P on August 17, 2014, 03:38:24 pm
*REMOVED*

Amazing!

You should publish this info in a new thread.

I hope you are in the right way, I will love to see the hacker crying for his life  :)

Good catch! Lets see how this goes! if anything came out of this, you should get some reward for this.
Do you really believe a professional hacker is creating a domain just so you can trace it back to him ?
I mean... REALLY?

 :o
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: nexern on August 17, 2014, 03:52:28 pm
please remove this informations quickly please. while i hope this guy is the hacker, we should also assuming that a pro would use a shield.
registering an alias and this nick, including the com doesn't look good atm. let's collect more informations first.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: cobaltskky on August 17, 2014, 03:54:08 pm
please remove this informations quickly please. while i hope this guy is the hacker, we should also assuming that a pro would use a shield.
registering an alias and this nick, including the com doesn't look good atm. let's collect more informations first.

After some thinking, I agree with Nexern.  I have removed my posts on the topic.  I apologize for getting everyone's hopes up. :(  I certainly feel like an ass now.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: lucky88888 on August 17, 2014, 03:54:50 pm
mods you missed a few posts above.
quoted by QBTC and jacinto.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: VanBreuk on August 17, 2014, 04:02:28 pm
All info should be removed now, if anyone still spots a nested quote with this supposed personal information please report it and we'll edit it out.

Please note that all further information about any supposed personal ID of the hacker posted here in the forums will be removed, specially when there is no solid basis. False accusation could bring serious collateral damage.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: TheCryptoWoman on August 17, 2014, 04:04:54 pm

Here is a screenshot of Whois history from DomainTools for you sleuths:

INFORMATION REMOVED BY FORUM STAFF

My apologies if the information posted offended any one or violated the rules. In my enthusiasm to help, I thought only that since I have DomainTools Pro subscription I could be of help. I'm thankful it only showed he was still anonymous and I'm thankful for the checks and balances of the community working together here!
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: cobaltskky on August 17, 2014, 04:06:00 pm

Here is a screenshot of Whois history from DomainTools for you sleuths:

INFORMATION REMOVED BY FORUM STAFF

My apologies if the information posted offended any one or violated the rules. In my enthusiasm to help, I thought only that since I have DomainTools Pro subscription I could be of help. I'm thankful it only showed he was still anonymous and I'm thankful for the checks and balances of the community working together here!

+1440
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: VanBreuk on August 17, 2014, 04:08:30 pm

Here is a screenshot of Whois history from DomainTools for you sleuths:

INFORMATION REMOVED BY FORUM STAFF

My apologies if the information posted offended any one or violated the rules. In my enthusiasm to help, I thought only that since I have DomainTools Pro subscription I could be of help. I'm thankful it only showed he was still anonymous and I'm thankful for the checks and balances of the community working together here!

Don't worry, you did not start the serious disclosure of personal information. I removed your link to whois data so we do not feed an hypothesis that may be wrong by a long shot.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Brangdon on August 17, 2014, 04:12:06 pm

Now that this whole thing is coming to an end, I like to understand something :

What is the risk of forging, regarding to the account password ?

'cause if I understood well, the hacker got access to bter server, and discovered a few passwords. Then he just had to connect to this own node or even an online wallet service to try those password, and succesfully got access to bter nxt account because of using the same password on 90% of his admin accounts.
That means bter nxt account could have been offline, the result would have been the same.
The forging account has to be online. They said it was running on a machine without 2-Factor-Authentification, and that they added 2FA after the hack. To me that sounds like their wallet was on a machine that was not only connected, but was run by some third party cloud thing. At any rate, it was open to being hacked remotely.

If you need to use a cloud service in order to forge 24/7, then it's safest to create a separate account, with a zero balance, and lease to it from your main account. Then you can forge with your online zero-balance account, while keeping your main account offline as much as possible. If the online node gets hacked, the hackers can only take the few NXT you recently forged.

It's also a good idea to split your main account into a current account and a savings account. Use the current account for day to day business, typing in its pass-phrase whenever necessary. Ideally the saving account will only have its password entered once a month, to renew the forging lease, or maybe more often if you need to top up the current account. Don't put all your eggs in one basket.

Obviously reusing passwords is a bad idea. If you have three accounts, as outlined above, then they necessarily have different passwords.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: bation on August 17, 2014, 04:16:41 pm
*REMOVED*

Amazing!

You should publish this info in a new thread.

I hope you are in the right way, I will love to see the hacker crying for his life  :)

Good catch! Lets see how this goes! if anything came out of this, you should get some reward for this.
Do you really believe a professional hacker is creating a domain just so you can trace it back to him ?
I mean... REALLY?

 :o

You missed this quote...


Quote

Personally I think that he is an amateur who got lucky...

Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Jacinto on August 17, 2014, 04:25:48 pm
*REMOVED*

Amazing!

You should publish this info in a new thread.

I hope you are in the right way, I will love to see the hacker crying for his life  :)

Good catch! Lets see how this goes! if anything came out of this, you should get some reward for this.
Do you really believe a professional hacker is creating a domain just so you can trace it back to him ?
I mean... REALLY?

 :o

You missed this quote...


Quote

Personally I think that he is an amateur who got lucky...


Bation, Altough you cannot post any "personal info" here, pls keep us informed about your research! If you find something new, tell us! (with no personal info  :-X )
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: bation on August 17, 2014, 04:38:31 pm
*REMOVED*

Amazing!

You should publish this info in a new thread.

I hope you are in the right way, I will love to see the hacker crying for his life  :)

Good catch! Lets see how this goes! if anything came out of this, you should get some reward for this.
Do you really believe a professional hacker is creating a domain just so you can trace it back to him ?
I mean... REALLY?

 :o

You missed this quote...


Quote

Personally I think that he is an amateur who got lucky...


Bation, Altough you cannot post any "personal info" here, pls keep us informed about your research! If you find something new, tell us! (with no personal info  :-X )

WOW! :) i've found something new. this is getting really crazy... who should i contact with. we got him guys :)
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: cobaltskky on August 17, 2014, 04:39:45 pm
TheSir could be a cover.  the equivalent of a hacker's "honeypot".  He assumes the identity of somebody else that has tenuous ties to hacker activities, then performs his own activities under that moniker.  It's hard to say.  Either this guy is really good.  Or he's pretty bad. lol

It makes me wonder how TheSir came by his moniker though if the human behind the TheSir isn't the one who registered the domain names, created the YouTube channel, etc.  If we could figure out a connection between TheSir who stole from Bter and TheSir who registered the domain name, we might be able to track down the hacker.

Or it might be a wild coincidence. lol
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: cobaltskky on August 17, 2014, 04:40:11 pm
*REMOVED*

Amazing!

You should publish this info in a new thread.

I hope you are in the right way, I will love to see the hacker crying for his life  :)

Good catch! Lets see how this goes! if anything came out of this, you should get some reward for this.
Do you really believe a professional hacker is creating a domain just so you can trace it back to him ?
I mean... REALLY?

 :o

You missed this quote...


Quote

Personally I think that he is an amateur who got lucky...


Bation, Altough you cannot post any "personal info" here, pls keep us informed about your research! If you find something new, tell us! (with no personal info  :-X )

WOW! :) i've found something new. this is getting really crazy... who should i contact with. we got him guys :)

Hit up Damelon.  PM the info.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Jacinto on August 17, 2014, 04:40:44 pm
*REMOVED*

Amazing!

You should publish this info in a new thread.

I hope you are in the right way, I will love to see the hacker crying for his life  :)

Good catch! Lets see how this goes! if anything came out of this, you should get some reward for this.
Do you really believe a professional hacker is creating a domain just so you can trace it back to him ?
I mean... REALLY?

 :o

You missed this quote...


Quote

Personally I think that he is an amateur who got lucky...


Bation, Altough you cannot post any "personal info" here, pls keep us informed about your research! If you find something new, tell us! (with no personal info  :-X )

WOW! :) i've found something new. this is getting really crazy... who should i contact with. we got him guys :)

CHSSSSSSSSS!!!  :-X :-X :-X :-X :-X :-X :-X :-X :-X :-X

 :D

Hope you are right! I think you should contact, first admins here, and afterwards Bter, which are the real (and only now) affected.

Let's kick his ass  ;D
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: VanBreuk on August 17, 2014, 04:41:17 pm
WOW! :) i've found something new. this is getting really crazy... who should i contact with. we got him guys :)

You can send a multiple recipient PM to people you've been in touch with (or whoever you choose) to discuss, let's just not post names, addresses and other clear ID tags in the forums please.

Thanks :)
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Fatih87SK on August 17, 2014, 04:48:15 pm
*REMOVED*

Amazing!

You should publish this info in a new thread.

I hope you are in the right way, I will love to see the hacker crying for his life  :)

Good catch! Lets see how this goes! if anything came out of this, you should get some reward for this.
Do you really believe a professional hacker is creating a domain just so you can trace it back to him ?
I mean... REALLY?

 :o

You missed this quote...


Quote

Personally I think that he is an amateur who got lucky...


Bation, Altough you cannot post any "personal info" here, pls keep us informed about your research! If you find something new, tell us! (with no personal info  :-X )

WOW! :) i've found something new. this is getting really crazy... who should i contact with. we got him guys :)
Awesome.

Someone help him and let's get it done in an organized way.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Mexxer on August 17, 2014, 04:54:34 pm
I highly doubt he would choose an alias that let's someone track him down. Let's not rush to any conclusions here. It's highly unlikely that we actually got him.

Or he's just that stupid, then ...awesome!
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: KarlKarlsson on August 17, 2014, 04:54:42 pm
Does someone have Bter's new account ID? Can't find it anywhere...
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: bation on August 17, 2014, 05:00:31 pm
TheSir could be a cover.  the equivalent of a hacker's "honeypot".  He assumes the identity of somebody else that has tenuous ties to hacker activities, then performs his own activities under that moniker.  It's hard to say.  Either this guy is really good.  Or he's pretty bad. lol

It makes me wonder how TheSir came by his moniker though if the human behind the TheSir isn't the one who registered the domain names, created the YouTube channel, etc.  If we could figure out a connection between TheSir who stole from Bter and TheSir who registered the domain name, we might be able to track down the hacker.

Or it might be a wild coincidence. lol

Think simple.

According to the new data that I now have, "thesircom" on this website is the same sir that we have found (100%!).
(but is he the hacker? I give 80%)

In my opinion the honey-pot idea itself is a long shot.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: bation on August 17, 2014, 05:01:54 pm
I highly doubt he would choose an alias that let's someone track him down. Let's not rush to any conclusions here. It's highly unlikely that we actually got him.

Or he's just that stupid, then ...awesome!

His chats with bter were childish...
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: blackyblack1 on August 17, 2014, 05:03:50 pm
Quote
but is he the hacker?
thesircom on this forum is definitely a hacker. He sent message to EvilDave on the blockchain.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Picsou on August 17, 2014, 05:05:45 pm

Now that this whole thing is coming to an end, I like to understand something :

What is the risk of forging, regarding to the account password ?

'cause if I understood well, the hacker got access to bter server, and discovered a few passwords. Then he just had to connect to this own node or even an online wallet service to try those password, and succesfully got access to bter nxt account because of using the same password on 90% of his admin accounts.
That means bter nxt account could have been offline, the result would have been the same.
The forging account has to be online. They said it was running on a machine without 2-Factor-Authentification, and that they added 2FA after the hack. To me that sounds like their wallet was on a machine that was not only connected, but was run by some third party cloud thing. At any rate, it was open to being hacked remotely.

If you need to use a cloud service in order to forge 24/7, then it's safest to create a separate account, with a zero balance, and lease to it from your main account. Then you can forge with your online zero-balance account, while keeping your main account offline as much as possible. If the online node gets hacked, the hackers can only take the few NXT you recently forged.

It's also a good idea to split your main account into a current account and a savings account. Use the current account for day to day business, typing in its pass-phrase whenever necessary. Ideally the saving account will only have its password entered once a month, to renew the forging lease, or maybe more often if you need to top up the current account. Don't put all your eggs in one basket.

Obviously reusing passwords is a bad idea. If you have three accounts, as outlined above, then they necessarily have different passwords.

Thanks for your answer. I agree with everything you are saying but what I need to know is :

Is there any risk to get hacked with forging on the server side (a synology nas in my case) ?

According to me, the only way to stole a passphrase was with a keylogger on the client side (or by reading the passphrase in the memory of the browser but this fail has been corrected I think)
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: cobaltskky on August 17, 2014, 05:10:52 pm
I highly doubt he would choose an alias that let's someone track him down. Let's not rush to any conclusions here. It's highly unlikely that we actually got him.

Or he's just that stupid, then ...awesome!

His chats with bter were childish...

I agree.  Sounds like a guy in their early to mid twenties, at most. "lousy btc"  "deal is off"  "can't wait around"  That's a particular kind of vocabulary pattern here in America that points to "young white male in their early twenties that plays video games and spends a lot of time doing stupid shit to piss people off but he finds it funny."
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Brangdon on August 17, 2014, 05:20:43 pm
Is there any risk to get hacked with forging on the server side (a synology nas in my case) ?

According to me, the only way to stole a passphrase was with a keylogger on the client side (or by reading the passphrase in the memory of the browser but this fail has been corrected I think)
Forging itself doesn't increase the risk.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: bation on August 17, 2014, 05:25:14 pm
I highly doubt he would choose an alias that let's someone track him down.

I think that he is someone aware of this forum/community. Otherwise he wouldn't use Nxt capabilities and register an alias quickly in the first place (this is my opinion).

Alias = Ego = Pride = You fall

Anyway ,sophisticated criminals are getting caught for traditional crimes.
The cryptoworld is in it's early stages. He got lucky. I wouldn't expect nothing sophisticated.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: cobaltskky on August 17, 2014, 05:41:59 pm
So, I know my ass is pretty fine, but I'm not narcissistic enough to believe that it convinced him to send back the NXT. lol  Do we know what happened during negotiations that made him change his mind?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: m30188 on August 17, 2014, 05:44:39 pm
So, I know my ass is pretty fine, but I'm not narcissistic enough to believe that it convinced him to send back the NXT. lol  Do we know what happened during negotiations that made him change his mind?
Is there going to be a NXT update today? Should be interesting.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: blackyblack1 on August 17, 2014, 06:06:18 pm
Quote
Do we know what happened during negotiations that made him change his mind
Bter payed him 300 BTC. So he'we got more than 500000$ for his hack. Now we should wait for bation investigation since he 100% sure that thesircom on the forum is that Poland guy. And we 100% know that thesircom is the real hacker.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: vincentvincent on August 17, 2014, 06:09:21 pm
the plot thickens
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: pt on August 17, 2014, 06:28:51 pm
I've been watching this entire thing from the beginning. One of the more interesting things this guy did was
use the word "Plonker". Plonker is a slang term used mostly in the UK correct?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: eimon on August 17, 2014, 06:30:12 pm
I've been watching this entire thing from the beginning. One of the more interesting things this guy did was
use the word "Plonker". Plonker is a slang term used mostly in the UK correct?

EvilDave told him to write that post to prove he was hacker, so not hacker's choice of words.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: bitcoinpaul on August 17, 2014, 06:31:34 pm
I've been watching this entire thing from the beginning. One of the more interesting things this guy did was
use the word "Plonker". Plonker is a slang term used mostly in the UK correct?

Didn't evildave explicitly told him to write this?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: davethetrousers on August 17, 2014, 06:32:11 pm
Polish members should monitor the institution of new BTC ATMs in their neighborhoods...

You know, someone may suddenly have a stack of BTC now somehow, and may want to launder it and cash in help others get into cryptos.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Thames on August 17, 2014, 06:37:17 pm
I've been watching this entire thing from the beginning. One of the more interesting things this guy did was
use the word "Plonker". Plonker is a slang term used mostly in the UK correct?

Didn't evildave explicitly told him to write this?

Yes and yes.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: WolfofCrypto on August 17, 2014, 06:40:47 pm
His not Polish thats for sure

Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: davethetrousers on August 17, 2014, 06:44:17 pm
His not Polish thats for sure

The only thing that's actually sure right now is he's from Earth. That we can assume to a high degree of confidence.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: WolfofCrypto on August 17, 2014, 06:46:37 pm
Theres articles Submitted to Local and National Media and 235,000 Blogs and online news sites in the Following Countries

Afghanistan, Albania, Algeria, Andorra, Angola, Anguilla, Antigua, Argentina, Armenia, Aruba, Australia, Austria, Azerbaijan, Bahamas, Bahrain, Bangladesh, Barbados, Belarus, Belgium, Belize, Benin, Bermuda, Bolivia, Bonaire, Bosnia & Herzegovina, Botswana, Brazil, British Virgin Islands, Brunei, Bulgaria, Burkina Faso, Burundi, Cambodia, Cameroon, Canada, Cape Verde Islands, Caroline Islands, Cayman Islands, Central African Republic, Chad, Chile, China, Colombia, Comoros, Congo (Democratic Republic of), Congo (Republic of), Cook Islands, Costa Rica, Croatia, Cuba, Curacao, Cyprus, Czech Republic, Denmark, Djibouti, Dominica, Dominican Republic, Ecuador, Egypt, El Salvador, Equatorial Guinea, Eritrea, Estonia, Ethiopia, Falkland Islands, Faroe Islands, Fiji, Finland, France, French Polynesia, Gabon, Gambia, Georgia, Germany, Ghana, Gibraltar, Greece, Greenland, Grenada, Guadeloupe, Guatemala, Guinea, Guinea Bissau, Guyana, Haiti, Honduras, Hong Kong, Hungary, Iceland, India, Indonesia, Iran, Iraq, Ireland, Israel, Italy, Ivory Coast, Jamaica, Japan, Jordan, Kazakhstan, Kenya, Kiribati, Kuwait, Kyrgyzstan, Laos, Latvia, Lebanon, Lesotho, Liberia, Libya, Liechtenstein, Lithuania, Luxembourg, Macedonia, Madagascar, Malawi, Malaysia, Mali, Malta, Marshall Islands, Martinique, Mauritania, Mauritius, Mexico, Moldova, Monaco, Montenegro, Montserrat, Morocco, Mozambique, Myanmar, Namibia, Nauru, Nepal, Netherlands, Netherlands Antilles, New Caledonia, New Zealand, Nicaragua, Niger, Nigeria, Norfolk Island, Norway, Oman, Pakistan, Palestinian Authority, Panama, Papua New Guinea, Paraguay, Peru, Philippines, Poland, Portugal, Qatar, Romania, Russia, Rwanda, Sao Tome & Principe, San Marino, Saudi Arabia, Senegal, Serbia, Seychelles, Sierra Leone, Singapore, Slovakia, Slovenia, Solomon Islands, Somalia, South Africa, South Korea, Spain, Sri Lanka, St Barthelemy, St Kitts & Nevis, St Lucia, St Maarten, St Vincent & The Grenadines, Sudan, Surinam, Swaziland, Sweden, Switzerland, Syria, Taiwan, Tajikistan, Tanzania, Thailand, Togo, Tonga, Trinidad & Tobago, Tunisia, Turkey, Turkmenistan, Tuvalu, Uganda, Ukraine, United Arab Emirates, United Kingdom, United States, Uruguay, Uzbekistan, Vanuatu, Vatican City, Venezuela, Vietnam, Western Samoa, Yemen, Zambia, Zimbabwe
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: martismartis on August 17, 2014, 06:48:49 pm
Theres articles Submitted to Local and National Media and 235,000 Blogs and online news sites in the Following Countries

......

Which articles? About what?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: WolfofCrypto on August 17, 2014, 06:54:00 pm
NXT and BTER the hack
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: eimon on August 17, 2014, 06:55:23 pm
If we end up catching the guy, then we've really got a story the media will pick up on.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Mexxer on August 17, 2014, 06:59:17 pm
NXT and BTER the hack

What articles were submitted? Can we read them somewhere?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: semibaron on August 17, 2014, 06:59:22 pm
Sorry for spamming this thread.

Why didn't he send the remaining 8million?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: davethetrousers on August 17, 2014, 07:01:54 pm
Which articles? About what?
NXT and BTER the hack

(https://i.imgflip.com/b8omb.jpg)
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Isildur23 on August 17, 2014, 07:13:24 pm
Sorry for spamming this thread.

Why didn't he send the remaining 8million?

Update: Aug. 17 2014: As you can see in our wallet, We have got most NXT back except the last 8m. The hacker disappeared again before we finish the new deal with him. We are still working on it for the left 8m. Will keep you updated.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Ezravdb on August 17, 2014, 07:28:06 pm
Because he is a greedy hacker?

Pretty excited for what will happen today
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: rstanaford on August 17, 2014, 07:54:29 pm
I am largely satisfied by the recovery of about 85% of the stolen NXT, but I still find the role of Bter throughout this saga suspect at best. 

The haphazard throwing of BTC at the thief, the amateurish negotiation tactics, and the scant updates provided (the less information you offer, the less you have to lie about) -- it was the stuff out of the pages of a badly written comic book.

I maintain that the entire thrust behind the theft, whether Bter colluded or not, was to damage NXT as a currency and a philosophy.  If I recall correctly, the desire was expressed to see if NXT would fork.  That stresses to me all the more that the crime wasn't so much a theft as it was a social experiment conducted on the NXT community, because a fork very nearly occurred, but fortunately didn't.  And that raises my suspicions even more, because the time to give the NXT back was when the fork was most likely to happen, because he would never have been able to move it out of the account.  But only after "not rolling back" was a foregone conclusion that he agreed to give up control of 1.6 million worth of NXT for only $50,000 of BTC, with Bter looking like the hero.

No, I'm not buying it.

These are just my thoughts, guys -- the mental meanderings of a closet madman.  But in spite of this week's travails, NXT is coming away even stronger by virtue of yet one more distinction:  The only cryptocurrency that I can recall which has managed to recover 85% of funds stolen after a breach.

Usually, that number is zero.  Why wouldn't you use NXT now?

Never have I been more proud to be a member of the NXT community.

NXT Acct: NXT-6FC9-DGWA-XHFN-765BS
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: WolfofCrypto on August 17, 2014, 07:58:21 pm
I have said way back in history a legal aspect should be brought into this and checked out by a 3rd party


I am largely satisfied by the recovery of about 85% of the stolen NXT, but I still find the role of Bter throughout this saga suspect at best. 

The haphazard throwing of BTC at the thief, the amateurish negotiation tactics, and the scant updates provided (the less information you offer, the less you have to lie about) -- it was the stuff out of the pages of a badly written comic book.

I maintain that the entire thrust behind the theft, whether Bter colluded or not was to damage NXT as a currency and a philosophy.  If I recall correctly, the desire was expressed to see if NXT would fork.  That stresses to me all the more that the crime wasn't so much a theft as it was a social experiment conducted on the NXT community, because a fork very nearly occurred but, fortunately it didn't.  And that raises my suspicions even more, because the time to give the NXT back was when the fork was most likely to happen, because he we would never have been able to move it out of the account.  But only after "not rolling back" was a foregone conclusion that he agrees to give up control of 1.6 million worth of NXT for only $50,000 of BTC and Bter looking like the hero... no, I'm not buying it.

These are just my thoughts, guys -- the mental meanderings of a closet madman.  But in spite of this week's travails, NXT is coming away even stronger by virtue of yet one more distinction:  The only cryptocurrency that I can recall which has managed to recover 85% of funds stolen after a breach.

Usually, that number is zero.  Why wouldn't you use NXT now?

 Never have I been more proud to be a member of the NXT community.

NXT Acct: NXT-6FC9-DGWA-XHFN-765BS
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Brangdon on August 17, 2014, 08:15:10 pm
I think that he is someone aware of this forum/community. Otherwise he wouldn't use Nxt capabilities and register an alias quickly in the first place (this is my opinion).
Would someone experienced in Nxt have paid the high fees he did?

Registering an alias is one of the things the client prompts you to do to secure your account, so doing it may not mean much. (For what it's worth, I think updating the account name and description is a better use of your first outgoing transaction. Aliases are almost worthless, but seeing an account name helps confirm you have the right account.)
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Brangdon on August 17, 2014, 08:18:48 pm
Why didn't he send the remaining 8million?
He said he believes in Nxt. I suspect he wants to keep them for a year or so. They will eventually be worth more than the bitcoins he received. At some point we'll probably have mixer/privacy services, and then he'll be able to launder and spend them. If we get to 1 NXT = 1$, he'll be a multi-millionaire and able to retire.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: bation on August 17, 2014, 08:38:42 pm
Why didn't he send the remaining 8million?
He said he believes in Nxt. I suspect he wants to keep them for a year or so. They will eventually be worth more than the bitcoins he received. At some point we'll probably have mixer/privacy services, and then he'll be able to launder and spend them. If we get to 1 NXT = 1$, he'll be a multi-millionaire and able to retire.

Do they have mixer/privacy services in jail?

If he is the guy we revealed, then (if I were him), he has a special route for the 8m.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Jacinto on August 17, 2014, 10:27:03 pm
Cobaltskyy, why do you now apologize to the hacker via blockchain? Maybe (or maybe not) you were wrong about his identity, but he is still a scum of individual that deserves a punishment (at least jail).

I don't understand you!  :-\
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Come-from-Beyond on August 17, 2014, 11:02:31 pm
Cobaltskyy, why do you now apologize to the hacker via blockchain? Maybe (or maybe not) you were wrong about his identity, but he is still a scum of individual that deserves a punishment (at least jail).

I don't understand you!  :-\

Noone understands women.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: bation on August 17, 2014, 11:05:15 pm
Cobaltskyy, why do you now apologize to the hacker via blockchain? Maybe (or maybe not) you were wrong about his identity, but he is still a scum of individual that deserves a punishment (at least jail).

I don't understand you!  :-\

Nooneman understands women.

FTFY :)
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: cobaltskky on August 17, 2014, 11:25:58 pm
Cobaltskyy, why do you now apologize to the hacker via blockchain? Maybe (or maybe not) you were wrong about his identity, but he is still a scum of individual that deserves a punishment (at least jail).

I don't understand you!  :-\

Oh, haven't I told y'all yet?  I'm crazy...crazy like a fox. lol
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: xyzzyx on August 18, 2014, 12:33:31 am
(http://i.imgur.com/mDK9kLt.jpg)
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: cobaltskky on August 18, 2014, 12:39:01 am
(http://i.imgur.com/mDK9kLt.jpg)

+1440
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Damelon on August 18, 2014, 12:40:26 am
Good ol' Al!
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: mczarnek on August 18, 2014, 12:40:36 am
No.. I still think that he figured that he wouldn't have any leverage and was waiting on colbaltskyy's pics before sending the last of it..  ;D


Actually I do think the thief should have been paid something.. like 50 to 100 BTC as a reward for finding and pointing out this flaw before someone else did.  If I stumbled across the same hack.. I think the right move would be to empty the wallet, contact BTER and inform them that they had a huge bug, give them details, and ask for a new address to send the Nxt to.  Instead he made away with 330 BTC, so be it, good for him.  But if he intends to hold on to that last bit, after specifically making a deal saying he would do otherwise, shame on him.  A little bit too for saying that he would return the money for 100BTC, then changing his mind after BTC sent.  Can't respect that mindset.  If he returns the rest of it right now, still sucks for BTER but he's actually done the community a service by hacking it before the next guy did, and good for him.

It is curious that he only went after Nxt, as I understand it, he found he had access to plenty of other private keys, why not just set-up wallets for all of them and empty them all into his account.  Why only Nxt?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: cobaltskky on August 18, 2014, 01:02:20 am
It is curious that he only went after Nxt, as I understand it, he found he had access to plenty of other private keys, why not just set-up wallets for all of them and empty them all into his account.  Why only Nxt?

He said he saw the potential in it.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Buratino on August 18, 2014, 01:32:16 am
Did BTER forgive hacker? Will BTER hunt him?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: rstanaford on August 18, 2014, 01:42:52 am
If I stumbled across the same hack.. I think the right move would be to empty the wallet, contact BTER and inform them that they had a huge bug....

A huge bug?  The only "bug" was Bter's poor management of their NXT wallet.  Nothing regarding NXT as a protocol was exploited.

It is curious that he only went after Nxt, as I understand it, he found he had access to plenty of other private keys, why not just set-up wallets for all of them and empty them all into his account.  Why only Nxt?

A most intriguing question that I, myself, have asked and would love to see freeworm's thoughts about.

https://nxtforum.org/index.php?topic=4478.msg84336#msg84336

https://nxtforum.org/index.php?topic=4478.msg84617#msg84617

Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: lucky88888 on August 18, 2014, 03:14:59 am
So, I know my ass is pretty fine, but I'm not narcissistic enough to believe that it convinced him to send back the NXT. lol  Do we know what happened during negotiations that made him change his mind?

I think he probably didn't trust bter to send the last batch since he is sending first this time. maybe we should tell bter to make smaller trades, which might atleast get another 4mil back.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: lucky88888 on August 18, 2014, 03:16:47 am
Theres articles Submitted to Local and National Media and 235,000 Blogs and online news sites in the Following Countries

Afghanistan, Albania, Algeria, Andorra, Angola, Anguilla, Antigua, Argentina, Armenia, Aruba, Australia, Austria, Azerbaijan, Bahamas, Bahrain, Bangladesh, Barbados, Belarus, Belgium, Belize, Benin, Bermuda, Bolivia, Bonaire, Bosnia & Herzegovina, Botswana, Brazil, British Virgin Islands, Brunei, Bulgaria, Burkina Faso, Burundi, Cambodia, Cameroon, Canada, Cape Verde Islands, Caroline Islands, Cayman Islands, Central African Republic, Chad, Chile, China, Colombia, Comoros, Congo (Democratic Republic of), Congo (Republic of), Cook Islands, Costa Rica, Croatia, Cuba, Curacao, Cyprus, Czech Republic, Denmark, Djibouti, Dominica, Dominican Republic, Ecuador, Egypt, El Salvador, Equatorial Guinea, Eritrea, Estonia, Ethiopia, Falkland Islands, Faroe Islands, Fiji, Finland, France, French Polynesia, Gabon, Gambia, Georgia, Germany, Ghana, Gibraltar, Greece, Greenland, Grenada, Guadeloupe, Guatemala, Guinea, Guinea Bissau, Guyana, Haiti, Honduras, Hong Kong, Hungary, Iceland, India, Indonesia, Iran, Iraq, Ireland, Israel, Italy, Ivory Coast, Jamaica, Japan, Jordan, Kazakhstan, Kenya, Kiribati, Kuwait, Kyrgyzstan, Laos, Latvia, Lebanon, Lesotho, Liberia, Libya, Liechtenstein, Lithuania, Luxembourg, Macedonia, Madagascar, Malawi, Malaysia, Mali, Malta, Marshall Islands, Martinique, Mauritania, Mauritius, Mexico, Moldova, Monaco, Montenegro, Montserrat, Morocco, Mozambique, Myanmar, Namibia, Nauru, Nepal, Netherlands, Netherlands Antilles, New Caledonia, New Zealand, Nicaragua, Niger, Nigeria, Norfolk Island, Norway, Oman, Pakistan, Palestinian Authority, Panama, Papua New Guinea, Paraguay, Peru, Philippines, Poland, Portugal, Qatar, Romania, Russia, Rwanda, Sao Tome & Principe, San Marino, Saudi Arabia, Senegal, Serbia, Seychelles, Sierra Leone, Singapore, Slovakia, Slovenia, Solomon Islands, Somalia, South Africa, South Korea, Spain, Sri Lanka, St Barthelemy, St Kitts & Nevis, St Lucia, St Maarten, St Vincent & The Grenadines, Sudan, Surinam, Swaziland, Sweden, Switzerland, Syria, Taiwan, Tajikistan, Tanzania, Thailand, Togo, Tonga, Trinidad & Tobago, Tunisia, Turkey, Turkmenistan, Tuvalu, Uganda, Ukraine, United Arab Emirates, United Kingdom, United States, Uruguay, Uzbekistan, Vanuatu, Vatican City, Venezuela, Vietnam, Western Samoa, Yemen, Zambia, Zimbabwe

THIS IS TOO GOOD!
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: landomata on August 18, 2014, 04:28:58 am
I am largely satisfied by the recovery of about 85% of the stolen NXT, but I still find the role of Bter throughout this saga suspect at best. 

The haphazard throwing of BTC at the thief, the amateurish negotiation tactics, and the scant updates provided (the less information you offer, the less you have to lie about) -- it was the stuff out of the pages of a badly written comic book.

I maintain that the entire thrust behind the theft, whether Bter colluded or not, was to damage NXT as a currency and a philosophy.  If I recall correctly, the desire was expressed to see if NXT would fork.  That stresses to me all the more that the crime wasn't so much a theft as it was a social experiment conducted on the NXT community, because a fork very nearly occurred, but fortunately didn't.  And that raises my suspicions even more, because the time to give the NXT back was when the fork was most likely to happen, because he would never have been able to move it out of the account.  But only after "not rolling back" was a foregone conclusion that he agreed to give up control of 1.6 million worth of NXT for only $50,000 of BTC, with Bter looking like the hero.

No, I'm not buying it.

These are just my thoughts, guys -- the mental meanderings of a closet madman.  But in spite of this week's travails, NXT is coming away even stronger by virtue of yet one more distinction:  The only cryptocurrency that I can recall which has managed to recover 85% of funds stolen after a breach.

Usually, that number is zero.  Why wouldn't you use NXT now?

Never have I been more proud to be a member of the NXT community.

NXT Acct: NXT-6FC9-DGWA-XHFN-765BS

Interesting observation.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: DoM P on August 18, 2014, 04:40:24 am
LOOKS LIKE THE HACKER IS MOVING FUNDS AROUND

https://blockchain.info/address/1AEEasymuZCAXFEcLmgUwQZLA69Kc6GGUW

I personally don't have time right now, but if someone can follow those funds and make sure they don't hit an exchange, that'd be nice...
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: xyzzyx on August 18, 2014, 04:53:31 am
LOOKS LIKE THE HACKER IS MOVING FUNDS AROUND

https://blockchain.info/address/1AEEasymuZCAXFEcLmgUwQZLA69Kc6GGUW

I personally don't have time right now, but if someone can follow those funds and make sure they don't hit an exchange, that'd be nice...

Likely going to mix them.  Hope he uses the same service RJ used.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Jacinto on August 18, 2014, 09:08:41 am
Last night (Central Europe time) I saw "thesircom" user connected for a long time and "watching his messages". Did he answer anything? Can we assume his lack of arrogant posts a sign of his fear? could he be trying to figure an escape point now?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: TimmyD on August 18, 2014, 09:17:24 am
Last night (Central Europe time) I saw "thesircom" user connected for a long time and "watching his messages". Did he answer anything? Can we assume his lack of arrogant posts a sign of his fear? could he be trying to figure an escape point now?
Its the start of many sleepless nights for the theif. he now has to live in fear of a knock at the door or even the door been kicked in.
The consequences of being dishonest. hahaha rather him than me
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Jimmy2011 on August 18, 2014, 09:53:44 am

http://weibo.com/3969398100/BiRQOfpiK

比特儿韩林:从黑客口中得知,他无法直接入侵比特儿服务器,但很幸运的从我在6,7年前留在网络上的信息中分析出了我事发前仍在使用的一个密码,成功窃取了大量NXT。详细细节我会在事后揭示。事已至此,很想为我的疏忽说声抱歉,但已经没有意义。我会为整个事件的损失负责。比特儿还会继续下去。

The hacker told Lin that he couldn't log into BTER server by anyway, but he was lucky that he got the passphrase from his analysis of Lin's history information on the web 6 or 7 years ago. Lin promised that he will take responsibility of this incident and BTER will go on service.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: TwinWinNerD on August 18, 2014, 10:15:47 am
So it was a newb that got lucky?
I am pretty sure he can be tracked down.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Mexxer on August 18, 2014, 10:28:53 am
Haha oh my god ...

I hope someone already tracked him down and he lands in jail!
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: sava0123 on August 18, 2014, 04:17:57 pm
Do anyone in touch with bter? Any news?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Darkmoon on August 18, 2014, 04:59:53 pm
The BTER chief developer is on a 12 hour flight somewhere. But BTER didn't say anything about a chainsaw in his baggage.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: mczarnek on August 18, 2014, 05:17:10 pm
If I stumbled across the same hack.. I think the right move would be to empty the wallet, contact BTER and inform them that they had a huge bug....

A huge bug?  The only "bug" was Bter's poor management of their NXT wallet.  Nothing regarding NXT as a protocol was exploited.

I'd say someone being able to steal 50 million Nxt is a huge bug..  I never stated it was Nxt's bug.  I think it was BTER's bug.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: sava0123 on August 18, 2014, 05:24:12 pm
The BTER chief developer is on a 12 hour flight somewhere. But BTER didn't say anything about a chainsaw in his baggage.

How do you know that?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Thames on August 18, 2014, 05:26:23 pm
The BTER chief developer is on a 12 hour flight somewhere. But BTER didn't say anything about a chainsaw in his baggage.

How do you know that?
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=654463.msg8418610#msg8418610
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: DoM P on August 18, 2014, 07:07:50 pm
The BTER chief developer is on a 12 hour flight somewhere. But BTER didn't say anything about a chainsaw in his baggage.

How do you know that?

Going to Canada...
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: patapato on August 19, 2014, 01:07:07 am
Is it possible to remove my BTER account and all my data?, I don't see the option for it.

If it is true that the hacker got unauthorized access and 90% of passwords from BTER admin, most coins on BTER are compromised now. If that is not true the conclusion is also bad about BTER, worst indeed. I can not trust BTER anymore in any case.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: xyzzyx on August 19, 2014, 04:25:55 am
Is it possible to remove my BTER account and all my data?, I don't see the option for it.

If it is true that the hacker got unauthorized access and 90% of passwords from BTER admin, most coins on BTER are compromised now. If that is not true the conclusion is also bad about BTER, worst indeed. I can not trust BTER anymore in any case.

It might be a good idea to wait for a forensic report from Bter on the theft.  I find it suspect that only NXT was stolen if their system was really wide-open. 

OTOH, you could try https://bter.com/page/contacts to ask to be removed.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: whale on August 19, 2014, 04:43:51 am
I thought the admin of this forum got the hackers IP? I'm sure there would be some crumbs.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: DoM P on August 19, 2014, 05:36:42 am
I thought the admin of this forum got the hackers IP? I'm sure there would be some crumbs.
Ever heard of ToR ?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: blackyblack1 on August 19, 2014, 05:46:29 am
IP on this forum was a relay in Switzerland. And later in Canada. However we have not got any information from bter.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: abctc on August 19, 2014, 05:48:19 am
I thought the admin of this forum got the hackers IP? I'm sure there would be some crumbs.
Ever heard of ToR ?
- read the topic?
guessing the hackers nxtforum account was made using tor then?
No, no Tor apparently. We're looking into this and other details.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Evan on August 19, 2014, 05:52:35 am
I thought the admin of this forum got the hackers IP? I'm sure there would be some crumbs.
Ever heard of ToR ?

The admin said he was not using the tor, though something else may be used to mask his real ip
The clue from the domain name may be true, waiting for further update
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: DoM P on August 19, 2014, 05:57:58 am
I thought the admin of this forum got the hackers IP? I'm sure there would be some crumbs.
Ever heard of ToR ?
- read the topic?

No, not all of it... :( Quite long...
If not Tor, then another proxy. He seems to be moving all over the place
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: zingzong on August 22, 2014, 04:27:53 pm
dunno if this has been noticed but their is a "thesir" selling Bitcoins for zloty in local bitcoins in  Poland !!! WTF???https://localbitcoins.com/ad/41196/buy-bitcoins-with-cash-chojnice-poland
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: zingzong on August 22, 2014, 04:30:28 pm
and a polish social network with a 'thesir' listing his polish friends!!
http://www.hi5.com/friends.html?uid=7104294772
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: zingzong on August 22, 2014, 04:32:40 pm
and a 'thesir' chatting on a hacker forum
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/sc2-tournaments/409248-dreamhack-stockholm-day-1-2013?page=6
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Ezravdb on August 22, 2014, 04:41:25 pm
Wow!!
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: wesley on August 22, 2014, 04:47:23 pm
and a 'thesir' chatting on a hacker forum
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/sc2-tournaments/409248-dreamhack-stockholm-day-1-2013?page=6

that's not a hacker forum, looks like a gaming forum (sc2).
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: wesley on August 22, 2014, 04:47:49 pm
dunno if this has been noticed but their is a "thesir" selling Bitcoins for zloty in local bitcoins in  Poland !!! WTF???https://localbitcoins.com/ad/41196/buy-bitcoins-with-cash-chojnice-poland

Not selling anything, the account seems to exist for 9 months already. No prior trades.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: toenu on August 22, 2014, 04:51:40 pm
TheSir is by far not a unique username. The internet is big, there are likely dozens... Google "thesir" you get ~40000 results.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: zingzong on August 22, 2014, 04:59:33 pm
still bitcoins and thesir , bit of a coincidence???

does the polish angle still have any merit
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: toenu on August 22, 2014, 05:26:23 pm
Bitcoin and Poland can both be coincidences.
If the hacker IP was traceable to the same town like localbitcoins account, then we would have something somewhat substantial.
Until then, this is just blind speculation.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: blackyblack1 on August 22, 2014, 05:35:06 pm
Quote
does the polish angle still have any merit
Yes it is well known. And I have the strong feeling that polish thesir is the hacker. However there is no strong evidence and bter has investigation in Canada (probably the are trying to get some information from proxy owner). Also it is shown that language of the hacker is too good for polish guy.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Come-from-Beyond on August 22, 2014, 05:42:34 pm
Also it is shown that language of the hacker is too good for polish guy.

Hahaha, Poland is a developed country AFAIK.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: blackyblack1 on August 22, 2014, 05:42:44 pm
The reason I think the polish guy is the hacker here. Let's suppose the hacker decides to use polish guy as a shield. So he tries to mimic some random guy from bitcoin community. Now he should know about thesir.com site while it is closed now and whois information is not publicly available. He should've known that this guy used aliases as thesir, TheSir and Sir. He should've known that he not only participates in bitcoin community but also visits hackers sites and has hackers friends.
So this hacker should be extremely experienced. And experienced hacker probably won't show himself on this forum.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: blackyblack1 on August 22, 2014, 05:44:33 pm
Hahaha, Poland is a developed country AFAIK.
Poland can into space? :)
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: bizz on August 22, 2014, 05:48:47 pm
Hahaha, Poland is a developed country AFAIK.
Poland can into space? :)

well... yes:

http://www.esa.int/About_Us/Welcome_to_ESA/ESA_Council_approves_the_accession_of_Poland
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: bation on August 22, 2014, 05:57:03 pm
It could be a different guy. Lets wait another day or two, and see what we have by then.
Maybe not revealing all we know, is the best way to go atm.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: cobaltskky on August 22, 2014, 06:48:09 pm
Anybody else see that there's a bounty contribution fund dealie posted under this account?

NXT-CFAC-4GHX-5W9P-629XV

I bought four. :)  Plan on adding a little more at a time every time I deposit NXT.

I want TheSir to suffer for scorning my advances! lololol
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: zingzong on August 23, 2014, 12:27:03 am
Quote
does the polish angle still have any merit
Yes it is well known. And I have the strong feeling that polish thesir is the hacker. However there is no strong evidence and bter has investigation in Canada (probably the are trying to get some information from proxy owner). Also it is shown that language of the hacker is too good for polish guy.
I agree i would say english is his first language but he could be dual national?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: DoM P on August 23, 2014, 06:15:14 pm
Please, read this: https://nxtforum.org/news-and-announcements/bter-hack-the-hunt-has-begun/
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Therealsir on August 26, 2014, 08:29:56 am
Hello guys sorry to say this but you need go deeper this is my statement as TheSiR from poland
Quote
https://nxtforum.org/introduce-yourself/real-thesir-from-poland/
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: SamIbandii on September 03, 2014, 05:28:15 pm
He guys,
It seems that our hacker spend a large amount of his NXT.
There is just a portion left on his account and his last transaction was on September 1st ( see NXT-8WJ7-8A2H-MBYN-3W9K4).
Did I missed something during my vacation?

Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: nextcafe on September 03, 2014, 05:30:38 pm
He guys,
It seems that our hacker spend a large amount of his NXT.
There is just a portion left on his account and his last transaction was on September 1st ( see NXT-8WJ7-8A2H-MBYN-3W9K4).
Did I missed something during my vacation?

I think he just moved it to another account.
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: SamIbandii on September 04, 2014, 05:53:16 pm
Ok, another account with no name (see NXT-8Z2A-NBQL-EKMX-8HPBG).

Let's keep track of this account.
Let no one lose track of him, shall we?
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: Jacinto on September 04, 2014, 06:05:36 pm
Ok, another account with no name (see NXT-8Z2A-NBQL-EKMX-8HPBG).

Let's keep track of this account.
Let no one lose track of him, shall we?


Old news bro,

please read the last post of Dom P in this thread.

The HUNT has been moved to:

https://nxtforum.org/news-and-announcements/bter-hack-the-hunt-has-begun/ (https://nxtforum.org/news-and-announcements/bter-hack-the-hunt-has-begun/)
Title: Re: 3 solutions proposed by Bter.com (200BTC deal or 310BTC bounty or Fork)
Post by: farl4bit on September 05, 2014, 07:07:58 pm
Ok, another account with no name (see NXT-8Z2A-NBQL-EKMX-8HPBG).

Let's keep track of this account.
Let no one lose track of him, shall we?


Old news bro,

please read the last post of Dom P in this thread.

The HUNT has been moved to:

https://nxtforum.org/news-and-announcements/bter-hack-the-hunt-has-begun/ (https://nxtforum.org/news-and-announcements/bter-hack-the-hunt-has-begun/)

Yes, it's better to close this thread. Move on in the topic above.
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