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Is it possible to create a parameter to have CPU only MSCoins?
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Author Topic: Is it possible to create a parameter to have CPU only MSCoins?  (Read 2465 times)

Daedelus

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Is it possible to create a parameter to have CPU only MSCoins?
« on: January 31, 2015, 09:44:43 pm »

Question in the title, I know very little about mining.

Having a CPU only coin would enable a lot of small guys into Nxt and stand a chance of making any money.
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blackyblack1

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Re: Is it possible to create a parameter to have CPU only MSCoins?
« Reply #1 on: February 01, 2015, 10:34:58 am »

Question in the title, I know very little about mining.

Having a CPU only coin would enable a lot of small guys into Nxt and stand a chance of making any money.
No.
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Riker

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Re: Is it possible to create a parameter to have CPU only MSCoins?
« Reply #2 on: February 01, 2015, 02:26:23 pm »

Currently the 4 hashing algorithms we introduced into the core are all Gpu friendly altough I must admit I thought it would take much more time until a Gpu miner would become available. Can we introduce additional hashing algorithms ? Yes, on the next hardfork. Can we make them cpu only ? Perhaps, for example last I read prime coin had no gpu miner. Would it help small miners ? Probably not, as soon as mining would become profitable the botnets would kickin and make personnal mining unprofitable.
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Come-from-Beyond

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Re: Is it possible to create a parameter to have CPU only MSCoins?
« Reply #3 on: February 01, 2015, 03:06:06 pm »

Question in the title, I know very little about mining.

Having a CPU only coin would enable a lot of small guys into Nxt and stand a chance of making any money.

I got an idea how to make minting CPU only. Hinted it here - https://nxtforum.org/general-discussion/price-speculation/msg157939/#msg157939
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Daedelus

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Re: Is it possible to create a parameter to have CPU only MSCoins?
« Reply #4 on: February 01, 2015, 04:36:27 pm »

Question in the title, I know very little about mining.

Having a CPU only coin would enable a lot of small guys into Nxt and stand a chance of making any money.

I got an idea how to make minting CPU only. Hinted it here - https://nxtforum.org/general-discussion/price-speculation/msg157939/#msg157939


Quote

This is a new idea that can stop ever-increasing arms race of mining.

I will have to wait a few weeks for someone who gets it to explain it to me :) Something about going around in circles and not being able to tell where you started..
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Riker

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Re: Is it possible to create a parameter to have CPU only MSCoins?
« Reply #5 on: February 01, 2015, 08:19:07 pm »

Question in the title, I know very little about mining.

Having a CPU only coin would enable a lot of small guys into Nxt and stand a chance of making any money.

I got an idea how to make minting CPU only. Hinted it here - https://nxtforum.org/general-discussion/price-speculation/msg157939/#msg157939

If you can elaborate (20 lines of text will do) how you would implement "Nth hash = 1st hash ("completing" the link), but it's possible if we take only, say, 48 bits of 256." and why it provides solution against mining centralization, I can look into implementing it.
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Come-from-Beyond

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Re: Is it possible to create a parameter to have CPU only MSCoins?
« Reply #6 on: February 01, 2015, 08:41:31 pm »

If you can elaborate (20 lines of text will do) how you would implement "Nth hash = 1st hash ("completing" the link), but it's possible if we take only, say, 48 bits of 256." and why it provides solution against mining centralization, I can look into implementing it.

It works as network-bound proof-of-work, ASICs are useless in this case. Need to think more about the details though.
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Riker

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Re: Is it possible to create a parameter to have CPU only MSCoins?
« Reply #7 on: February 01, 2015, 08:51:54 pm »

If you can elaborate (20 lines of text will do) how you would implement "Nth hash = 1st hash ("completing" the link), but it's possible if we take only, say, 48 bits of 256." and why it provides solution against mining centralization, I can look into implementing it.

It works as network-bound proof-of-work, ASICs are useless in this case. Need to think more about the details though.

So the POW is based on downloading useless chunks of data over the network ? Doesn't sound promising ...
Or perhaps based on how much you helped the NXT network by providing peer download and upload data ? This at least helps the network while giving you currency units. But I think this can be easily manipulated by setting up fake nodes that just push the same data around.
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blackyblack1

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Re: Is it possible to create a parameter to have CPU only MSCoins?
« Reply #8 on: February 01, 2015, 08:54:50 pm »

Question in the title, I know very little about mining.

Having a CPU only coin would enable a lot of small guys into Nxt and stand a chance of making any money.

I got an idea how to make minting CPU only. Hinted it here - https://nxtforum.org/general-discussion/price-speculation/msg157939/#msg157939

If you can elaborate (20 lines of text will do) how you would implement "Nth hash = 1st hash ("completing" the link), but it's possible if we take only, say, 48 bits of 256." and why it provides solution against mining centralization, I can look into implementing it.
You can make Nth hast = 1st hash (or 1st hash containing the Nth hash) with a big amount of work. With current hashpower it is almost impossible but if we limit the hash size we can have a normal PoW.
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Riker

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Re: Is it possible to create a parameter to have CPU only MSCoins?
« Reply #9 on: February 02, 2015, 09:23:31 am »

Question in the title, I know very little about mining.

Having a CPU only coin would enable a lot of small guys into Nxt and stand a chance of making any money.

I got an idea how to make minting CPU only. Hinted it here - https://nxtforum.org/general-discussion/price-speculation/msg157939/#msg157939

If you can elaborate (20 lines of text will do) how you would implement "Nth hash = 1st hash ("completing" the link), but it's possible if we take only, say, 48 bits of 256." and why it provides solution against mining centralization, I can look into implementing it.
You can make Nth hast = 1st hash (or 1st hash containing the Nth hash) with a big amount of work. With current hashpower it is almost impossible but if we limit the hash size we can have a normal PoW.

To re-iterate my request, would you elaborate (20 lines of text will do) how you would implement "Nth hash = 1st hash ("completing" the link), but it's possible if we take only, say, 48 bits of 256." and why it provides solution against mining centralization ?
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Daedelus

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Re: Is it possible to create a parameter to have CPU only MSCoins?
« Reply #10 on: February 02, 2015, 10:16:18 am »

Question in the title, I know very little about mining.

Having a CPU only coin would enable a lot of small guys into Nxt and stand a chance of making any money.

I got an idea how to make minting CPU only. Hinted it here - https://nxtforum.org/general-discussion/price-speculation/msg157939/#msg157939

If you can elaborate (20 lines of text will do) how you would implement "Nth hash = 1st hash ("completing" the link), but it's possible if we take only, say, 48 bits of 256." and why it provides solution against mining centralization, I can look into implementing it.
You can make Nth hast = 1st hash (or 1st hash containing the Nth hash) with a big amount of work. With current hashpower it is almost impossible but if we limit the hash size we can have a normal PoW.

To re-iterate my request, would you elaborate (20 lines of text will do) how you would implement "Nth hash = 1st hash ("completing" the link), but it's possible if we take only, say, 48 bits of 256." and why it provides solution against mining centralization ?

That's not how he works  ;) Next stop, Frustration Station  :D :D
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blackyblack1

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Re: Is it possible to create a parameter to have CPU only MSCoins?
« Reply #11 on: February 02, 2015, 10:18:13 am »

Question in the title, I know very little about mining.

Having a CPU only coin would enable a lot of small guys into Nxt and stand a chance of making any money.

I got an idea how to make minting CPU only. Hinted it here - https://nxtforum.org/general-discussion/price-speculation/msg157939/#msg157939

If you can elaborate (20 lines of text will do) how you would implement "Nth hash = 1st hash ("completing" the link), but it's possible if we take only, say, 48 bits of 256." and why it provides solution against mining centralization, I can look into implementing it.
You can make Nth hast = 1st hash (or 1st hash containing the Nth hash) with a big amount of work. With current hashpower it is almost impossible but if we limit the hash size we can have a normal PoW.

To re-iterate my request, would you elaborate (20 lines of text will do) how you would implement "Nth hash = 1st hash ("completing" the link), but it's possible if we take only, say, 48 bits of 256." and why it provides solution against mining centralization ?
I don't know what the solution does it provides but here is how it can be achieved.
We create block 1 and put in it a hash reference to block N in the future. So block #1 contains hash A.
Block #2 contains hash of block 1. So block #2 contains hash B.
Now we want to close the circle and block #3 should have hash A and contain the hash of block #1. So block #3 contains hash C and it's own hash is A.
To make it possible we start to bruteforcing hashes of block #3 until it becomes equal to hash A.

That's it. We have a PoW and circle references.
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