Nxt Forum

Nxt Discussion => -Old and Inactive Projects- => Nxt Projects => KNS => Topic started by: printshop on January 11, 2015, 07:23:29 pm

Title: SafeHash
Post by: printshop on January 11, 2015, 07:23:29 pm
-=+ SafeHash +=-

Welcome to SafeHash, a 100% owned and operated subsidiary of KNS.

With SafeHash, you cannot lose your initial investment. It's guaranteed.

Our mission statement is, "To Guarantee the Preservation of Investment Capital while providing a Competitive Return".


Here is our plan.

1. Operations.
Goal: In the event of a collapse in the mining sector (for whatever reason) all investors will be able to get out at or above the IPO price of 1 NXT per share.
Action: SafeHash will retain one NXT per share in NXT and/or highly liquid, safe investments (like USDBITFNX, Coinomat, or ltc2nxt3) for every 1 NXT sold and invested in mining assets.
Conclusion: There will always be sufficient NXT to support a complete buyback at 1 NXT/share.


2. Profit from Operations.
Goal: Increase profits for shareholders and backers while continuing to mitigate risk.
Action: 50% of profits from operations will be retained for reinvestment, and 50% will be paid as dividend.
Conclusion: The value of SafeHash will slowly increase.


3. Mitigate risk by dealing with the issue before it becomes a problem.
Action: Do not sell more shares of SafeHash than we have backing to support.
Conclusion: Risk is mitigated by not selling more shares than we have capital to back.


4. Exit Strategy. Because all good things must eventually come to an end.
Once all shares have been sold, we will no longer be able to cap the price at 1 NXT and provide a guarantee on the initial purchase price of shares. Therefore, once all existing shares are sold we will shut down the fund as follows:
    a) We will cease paying dividends.
    b) 100% of fund income will go towards repurchasing the shares at market price but less than 2 NXT per share.
    c) All shares repurchased in this way will be burned by sending them to the Genesis block.
    d) We reserve the right to walk away from managing/running/operating the fund should be be able to maintain a bid of 2 NXT per outstanding share.
Conclusion: Everybody wins.
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: printshop on January 13, 2015, 08:26:54 pm
FAQ

1. What is the official Asset ID?
--> Our Asset ID is 14777906162204143382. Our old asset ID is 12699150877111554426. If you have shares of the old SafeHash, you may exchange them (See #2).

2. What can I do with my old shares of SafeHash?
--> You can exchange them by sending them to NXT-X5EF-HTB2-RLYU-HW8E7. You will be sent back the appropriate number of new shares.

3. What happens if I don't exchange my shares?
--> Nothing, you can exchange them at any time. But, the old shares will not receive dividends after June 30th, 2015.

4. I do not understand how is connected mining and SafeHash asset? I have read the IPO information 3 times and still I do not see the source of the profits. (From: blackyblack1)
--> We invest the NXT from share sales into mining assets like cex.io or Cointellect. When those assets pay a dividend we distribute 50% to you and 50% to back new shares and sell them into the market. If nobody buys those shares, we can reinvest it as a way to increase demand for the asset or just take it as our management fee.

5.  Can we trade existing assets into SafeHash for shares of SafeHash? (from: blackyblack1)
--> Maybe. What asset do you have? Make an offer and if it's reasonable we are likely to accept it.
This can help you "sell" a non-liquid asset and get liquid shares of SafeHash in return.

6. Can't you just buy mining assets yourself and have 100% profits? Since profits are split 50%, the risks should be split too. But it looks like all risks are on the SafeHash issuer. (from: blackyblack1)
--> The fund is self-backing. It grows and produces income for us independent of additional investment on our part. Yes, we took a huge initial risk when we started the fund, but as the fund has continued to grow, that risk has been gradually removed. Each week we have the option of either issuing more shares for sale, or just taking our share of the income as a fee. Since many people have invested into this, our income has become greater than if we just invested our own money on our own.

7. What address can confirm the "SafeHash Financial Statement"? (from: futurist)
--> The SafeHash account address is NXT-X5EF-HTB2-RLYU-HW8E7.
--> The majority of our assets are contained in the Safehash account. We do have large investments on websites like BTCJam which do not show up. However, if these assets become a large part of our portfolio we will consider spinning them off into separate assets. This will help you account the value of SafeHash and also provide an interesting investment opportunity.

8. Any questions?
--> Please ask questions! We will put the best questions and answers here into the FAQ. If your question makes it into the FAQ, you will receive ten free shares of SafeHash for your contribution to society.
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: printshop on January 15, 2015, 12:04:07 pm
Dividend Payment Record.

I'm keeping track of all dividends paid with the new Dividend payment system until the client is fixed. Yes, you definately got your dividends if you were holding shares during the block height in question!

The dividend payments will appear in the account ledger, when it is ready. This is a new feature, not a bugfix, and will take some more time. A lot of code has been written, but needs some improvement, and the effect on performance and db size is not yet known. Finishing the voting system and phasing is a priority now, I will look into what remains to be done for account ledger after that.

1.
Transaction ID: 4368643467067068194
Date: 28/01/2015 02:51:59
Type:   Dividend Payment
Asset Name: SafeHash
Amount Per Share: 0.007 NXT
Height: 343600
Fee: 1 NXT

2.
Transaction ID: 8436792485351073606
Date: 31/01/2015 02:21:10
Type:   Dividend Payment
Asset Name: SafeHash
Amount Per Share: 0.007 NXT
Height: 346000
Fee: 1 NXT
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: printshop on January 25, 2015, 10:59:59 am
Hello. I've just finished reinvesting some of SafeHash's free NXT into a few choice issues on the NXT AE.

All things into consideration I think we will change the payout ratio slightly. There's no single source of income anymore, so calculating it has become more complex. But most of the things we invest in are paying between 1% and 2% per week. Therefore, it looks like 1% a week will be our payout for the next few months.

The ironic joke is, this is still in ponzi territory. It's doubly so because most people will consider the rate too low to bother investing in, compared to other ponzi based investments (DESPITE the fact that LTCgear just blew up in their faces).

0.0% -- Money Market Funds (*0.01%)
0.1% -- 3 month T-bill
0.9% -- 40 year commodities
1.3% -- 3 year bank CD
2.0% -- 40 year housing
2.2% -- 10 year treasury
3.1% -- Ginnie Mae Pools
3.8% -- REIT investments (last 10 years)
3.9% -- 40 year CPI (inflation)
4.0% -- Investment Grade Corporate Bonds
4.2% -- Overseas Stocks (40 year average)
4.9% -- 40 year gold
5.0% -- 30 year mortgage
6.0% -- Personal Line of Credit at bank
11.9% -- 40 year US stocks
12.9% -- 40 year REITs

What we know, is that there isn't any business model which supports 1% per week (or even much more than 1%/month) for any sustained length of time. I suspect the deep economic reasons for this are related to figures such as birth rate, gold mining rates and so forth. But whatever the reason the proof is all around us in the form of failed business ventures and broken bank accounts.

Maybe this time around we'll cut the payout ratio and expand the fund a bit more. This will help us diversify and protect against any hiccups (like a coinomat or cex.io blowup). But we have learned our lesson and I only hope the community has learned a little more about what I'm m trying to do with SafeHash here and why. Let's make a resolution in 2015. Let's not invest in ponzis anymore, but manage our money wisely! Let's shoot for the insured, 1% a month -- not the blowup-quality 10% per week which we know can't last.

Let's stop gambling, and start investing for our future.

Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: printshop on January 27, 2015, 07:30:21 am
Ok, I've downloaded Supernet 1.4.9.1 and will be making a test payment shortly (once the blockchain has finished downloading). It will be for 0.007 and it will be for this last weekend (the 24th). I am confident that I can maintain payments of 0.007 per week going forward. Actually I can probably pay more, but I am going to start small and see how much we can push it up while still being able to expand at a reasonable pace. This is 43.7% per year. That is lower than the 67.8% I mentioned in the previous post. I'd like to keep things on the safe side for now.
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: printshop on January 27, 2015, 05:58:27 pm
Transaction ID: 4368643467067068194
Date: 28/01/2015 02:51:59
Type:   Dividend Payment
Asset Name: SafeHash
Amount Per Share: 0.007 NXT
Height: 343600
Fee: 1 NXT


Very interesting. The payment would have sent money to the distribution account. So I transferred the extraneous SafeHash shares back to the issuer account. But I just realized that I could overpay (and it wouldn't matter) because the extra money would just be sent back to the distribution account.

Anyways, this payment was for the weekend of the 24th of January. Payments are slated for early Saturday morning EST going forward.

SafeHash lives!
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: printshop on January 27, 2015, 06:18:34 pm
Uh oh, something is wrong.

The Dividend+ module currently in the client does not report dividends. I'm going to be keeping an extremely close eye on our investments but until there is some way to verify a payment, I am bound to miss payments sent via this module.

If any asset issuers see this, please report your dividend payments VERY carefully. It is going to be waaaay to easy to miss payments with 10, 20 assets flying around here.
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: JanSako on January 27, 2015, 07:07:23 pm
I seem to have received ~5 NXT from somewhere, but no idea if it was from you. There is no incoming transaction...

What would have been the amount for 743 Safehash? Account in my sig.

THX!
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: printshop on January 27, 2015, 07:40:42 pm
I seem to have received ~5 NXT from somewhere, but no idea if it was from you. There is no incoming transaction...

What would have been the amount for 743 Safehash? Account in my sig.

THX!

743*0.007 = 5.201.

Yes the "invisible dividends" thing is going to become a huge problem. We really need notification of some kind. I can't understand why the clients don't pick this up if it is in the blockchain.

Anyways, I've also made four payments from DailyTrade (for the 24th to 27th) and have updated the DailyTrade thread with a payment schedule.

I'm going to have to be extra careful when making payments using this Dividend+ feature. I have no record of who has and has not been paid ..... I even checked the server logs. Nothing  ???
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: JanSako on January 27, 2015, 08:41:45 pm
Guess that was it then, thank you for the div!
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: garp on January 28, 2015, 12:45:07 pm
Transaction ID: 4368643467067068194
Date: 28/01/2015 02:51:59
Type:   Dividend Payment
Asset Name: SafeHash
Amount Per Share: 0.007 NXT
Height: 343600
Fee: 1 NXT


Very interesting. The payment would have sent money to the distribution account. So I transferred the extraneous SafeHash shares back to the issuer account. But I just realized that I could overpay (and it wouldn't matter) because the extra money would just be sent back to the distribution account.

Anyways, this payment was for the weekend of the 24th of January. Payments are slated for early Saturday morning EST going forward.

SafeHash lives!

Did you pay dividends on 27/01? I don't see them.
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: printshop on January 28, 2015, 01:47:05 pm
Transaction ID: 4368643467067068194
Date: 28/01/2015 02:51:59
Type:   Dividend Payment
Asset Name: SafeHash
Amount Per Share: 0.007 NXT
Height: 343600
Fee: 1 NXT


Very interesting. The payment would have sent money to the distribution account. So I transferred the extraneous SafeHash shares back to the issuer account. But I just realized that I could overpay (and it wouldn't matter) because the extra money would just be sent back to the distribution account.

Anyways, this payment was for the weekend of the 24th of January. Payments are slated for early Saturday morning EST going forward.

SafeHash lives!

Did you pay dividends on 27/01? I don't see them.

You definitely got them, but they were invisible and there is no record of the payment.

I know this is problematic and you might wonder if I'm pulling your leg. It's a problem with the client. You can read about it on the NRS v1.4.11 (https://nxtforum.org/index.php?topic=7944.msg156359#msg156359) thread. I am hoping they will fix this soon. Until it's fixed I guess I will have to announce the exact block which holds the payments. Ugh. But the real problem is keeping track of things. If we get a payment and I'm not aware of it I won't add it to the payment schedule.

Well, when it gets fixed I'll just do a quick back-check to make sure everything is okay. Until then, keep your eyes open... :)
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: printshop on January 30, 2015, 05:28:50 pm
Transaction ID: 8436792485351073606
Date: 31/01/2015 02:21:10
Type:   Dividend Payment
Asset Name: SafeHash
Amount Per Share: 0.007 NXT
Height: 346000
Fee: 1 NXT


I don't like these invisible dividends but the problem is even worse than that. Dividends can only be paid from the issuer account. This causes all sorts of problems when trying to use a distribution account. I've decided it's not worth it and will completely separate SafeHash from KNS by reissuing SafeHash from the distribution account NXT-X5EF-HTB2-RLYU-HW8E7.

Your old SafeHash shares will still be valid and insured until June 30th, 2015. After that time they will no longer receive dividends. If peopple still haven't exchanged their shares by that time, I will send out some NXT messages trying to contact those shareholders.

You will always be able to exchange shares of the old SafeHash for shares of the new SafeHash.

As a bonus to encourage people to exchange their shares and maybe buy new shares, we will pay a special extra dividend of 0.01 on February 7th -- in addition to our regular weekly dividend of 0.007. Please exchange your shares before February 7th in order to be eligible for this special dividend offer!
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: printshop on January 30, 2015, 05:44:09 pm
Our new asset ID is 14777906162204143382.

I am about to burn all of the old unsold shares of SafeHash by sending them to the genesis block.

Once again, you may exchange your old shares for new shares by sending them to the SafeHash account. I will see the transfer and send you back the correct number of new shares. Thanks and good luck! There are exciting things in store for SafeHash in 2015, I have not yet played every card in my hand. I am sure we will enjoy a great success.

The future is bright :)
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: garp on January 30, 2015, 05:49:59 pm
I seem to have received ~5 NXT from somewhere, but no idea if it was from you. There is no incoming transaction...

What would have been the amount for 743 Safehash? Account in my sig.

THX!

If you don't have a transaction, how do you know you received 5 nxt?
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: garp on January 30, 2015, 05:58:08 pm
Transaction ID: 4368643467067068194
Date: 28/01/2015 02:51:59
Type:   Dividend Payment
Asset Name: SafeHash
Amount Per Share: 0.007 NXT
Height: 343600
Fee: 1 NXT


Very interesting. The payment would have sent money to the distribution account. So I transferred the extraneous SafeHash shares back to the issuer account. But I just realized that I could overpay (and it wouldn't matter) because the extra money would just be sent back to the distribution account.

Anyways, this payment was for the weekend of the 24th of January. Payments are slated for early Saturday morning EST going forward.

SafeHash lives!

Did you pay dividends on 27/01? I don't see them.

You definitely got them, but they were invisible and there is no record of the payment.

I know this is problematic and you might wonder if I'm pulling your leg. It's a problem with the client. You can read about it on the NRS v1.4.11 (https://nxtforum.org/index.php?topic=7944.msg156359#msg156359) thread. I am hoping they will fix this soon. Until it's fixed I guess I will have to announce the exact block which holds the payments. Ugh. But the real problem is keeping track of things. If we get a payment and I'm not aware of it I won't add it to the payment schedule.

Well, when it gets fixed I'll just do a quick back-check to make sure everything is okay. Until then, keep your eyes open... :)

I got them? I don't get it. How do I know? How can we verify without a transaction?
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: JanSako on January 30, 2015, 06:20:50 pm
I seem to have received ~5 NXT from somewhere, but no idea if it was from you. There is no incoming transaction...

What would have been the amount for 743 Safehash? Account in my sig.

THX!

If you don't have a transaction, how do you know you received 5 nxt?

Because I know my balance... :-)
I just happened to check the night before and then after the div announcement.
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: printshop on January 30, 2015, 06:42:00 pm
Did you pay dividends on 27/01? I don't see them.

You definitely got them, but they were invisible and there is no record of the payment.

I got them? I don't get it. How do I know? How can we verify without a transaction?

Jean-Luc has stated that he will update the client to show dividend payments at a future date.

The dividend payments will appear in the account ledger, when it is ready. This is a new feature, not a bugfix, and will take some more time. A lot of code has been written, but needs some improvement, and the effect on performance and db size is not yet known. Finishing the voting system and phasing is a priority now, I will look into what remains to be done for account ledger after that.

Until then I will make a record of all payments in post #3 (https://nxtforum.org/index.php?topic=7448.msg151647#msg151647). Hopefully Jean-Luc will fix it soon, and we will be able to see all past and future payments in the client.
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: martinyin on January 31, 2015, 03:29:31 pm
an estimated ROI?
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: printshop on January 31, 2015, 03:53:27 pm
an estimated ROI?

I use excel, I type in "=POWER(1+(0.007/1),52)" (i.e. 1 + weekly interest rate). It's 43.7%. That's with full reinvestment. If you just invest say 1000 NXT and don't reinvest you would see 52 payments of 7 NXT, or about 36% after fees.

I would caution that we pay "50% of what we make", and this could go down. The great thing is, if you invest say 1000, you can always sell out close to 1 NXT (0.99 or above). This isn't like other assets where you buy shares and then find you can't sell them. I make it my first priority to repurchase shares of SafeHash when people want to sell.
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: martinyin on January 31, 2015, 04:16:30 pm
thanks, im in :)
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: printshop on January 31, 2015, 08:31:33 pm
thanks, im in :)

You are welcome! Ask me anything.

Also please note, that the asset ID for DailyTrade has changed. It is not  18198254847979167603, but 4067957116552280224. It appears you or someone is bidding for shares of the old asset; please buy the new asset instead.
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: martinyin on February 01, 2015, 12:49:17 am
thanks, im in :)

You are welcome! Ask me anything.

Also please note, that the asset ID for DailyTrade has changed. It is not  18198254847979167603, but 4067957116552280224. It appears you or someone is bidding for shares of the old asset; please buy the new asset instead.

why did the buy order placed by the issuer at 0.99 disappear?
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: printshop on February 01, 2015, 02:11:14 am
thanks, im in :)

You are welcome! Ask me anything.

Also please note, that the asset ID for DailyTrade has changed. It is not  18198254847979167603, but 4067957116552280224. It appears you or someone is bidding for shares of the old asset; please buy the new asset instead.

why did the buy order placed by the issuer at 0.99 disappear?

Someone sold their shares of Daily.

01/02/2015 06:20:59   Sell   1'000   0.995   995
01/02/2015 06:20:59   Sell   1'000   0.99   990

I just replaced the bid order. SafeHash is an extremely liquid asset, DailyTrade somewhat less so, but I will always make an effort to keep a bid up at 0.99 or better for both assets.
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: garp on February 02, 2015, 05:16:44 pm
Any explanation about the transactions of today?
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: printshop on February 02, 2015, 08:52:44 pm
Any explanation about the transactions of today?

It looks like some people bought and sold some shares -- not sure which transactions you mean. We're actively trading a number of assets like Coinomat and USDbitfinx, and some others. Which do you mean?
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: garp on February 03, 2015, 05:35:29 pm
Any explanation about the transactions of today?

It looks like some people bought and sold some shares -- not sure which transactions you mean. We're actively trading a number of assets like Coinomat and USDbitfinx, and some others. Which do you mean?

#    Timestamp   IO                    Account                                Amount   Type   Fee    Transaction
102.    01.02.2015 08:53:11      NXT-VGWL-74SL-8EDC-6J3W3    1.00   Payment   1   15359389627286636551
103.    01.02.2015 08:52:57      NXT-9HP3-8QJW-NY3Y-9QLLZ    1.00   Payment   1   17387484240241591969
104.    01.02.2015 08:52:41      NXT-TU9M-RZM6-5WUY-9LANW    1.00   Payment   1   8346372986124569357
105.    01.02.2015 08:52:25      NXT-EUH2-Y9LT-J54V-EPB56            1.00   Payment   1   3295423779352379358
106.    01.02.2015 08:52:03      NXT-DCUZ-GC45-SBKW-5FNY7    1.00   Payment   1   6631199196181748730
107.    01.02.2015 08:52:12      NXT-MAX4-6ZDE-3QVX-CDMY9    1.00   Payment   1   15870849069368446603
108.    01.02.2015 08:51:48      NXT-D47S-W3YE-VT3G-5KV96    1.00   Payment   1   11924633906776327894
109.    01.02.2015 08:51:33      NXT-F87Z-VNC2-A28A-2ZHYW    1.00   Payment   1   17713892772407651075
110.    01.02.2015 08:51:24      NXT-A3CC-YG8Z-HNFP-23QMS    1.00   Payment   1   1037071872717918125
111.    01.02.2015 08:51:14      NXT-P44H-3ZA6-TQBD-FESF3    1.00   Payment   1   6006480713821828763
112.    01.02.2015 08:50:43      NXT-LJDM-AHWF-Q59M-FZTBK    1.00   Payment   1   4997670831906018558
113.    01.02.2015 08:50:29      NXT-S75C-K4F3-8QDM-9T6V8    1.00   Payment   1   11737192234863663142
114.    01.02.2015 08:49:59      NXT-E3YA-EQ84-9PHC-7E7UC    1.00   Payment   1   8435290281770240436
115.    01.02.2015 08:49:46      NXT-8CBP-XQAH-J47K-GNQPB    1.00   Payment   1   17897181045195287416
116.    01.02.2015 08:49:31      NXT-WTS8-HP56-9HRA-H6HVD    1.00   Payment   1   5524142711981193236
117.    01.02.2015 08:49:19      NXT-V35S-6QQE-B6XH-6LPUR    1.00   Payment   1   17042126642580438817
118.    01.02.2015 08:48:54      NXT-8T88-RJHB-QE2X-H4TXW    1.00   Payment   1   5683418525448889324
119.    01.02.2015 08:48:44      NXT-JGKG-5VF4-CCZS-HTSY3    1.00   Payment   1   5985797166189507722
120.    01.02.2015 08:48:33      NXT-D62V-SLDU-S9S8-H495J    1.00   Payment   1   1985012910973249544
121.    01.02.2015 08:48:23      NXT-XLR8-66PW-253Z-3T5M8    1.00   Payment   1   13299240019821878762
122.    01.02.2015 08:47:49      NXT-JGNJ-5RZ7-C6KY-AC2XL            1.00   Payment   1   15998430551633332411
123.    01.02.2015 08:47:34      NXT-NH53-QEG6-NG4U-6D9DZ    1.00   Payment   1   4039184656290162059
124.    01.02.2015 08:47:21      NXT-7PJE-3NSH-C7W5-GU4FT    1.00   Payment   1   1476453121302648001
125.    01.02.2015 08:46:36      NXT-3KVZ-NF4B-36V2-7B9YA    1.00   Payment   1   5860506737758623608
126.    01.02.2015 08:46:08      NXT-CSMZ-VJV5-YVVP-5FZQU    1.00   Payment   1   5797807424217960965
127.    01.02.2015 08:46:24      NXT-8D65-AVB7-X8SM-2JTX4    1.00   Payment   1   9916547066699099920
128.    01.02.2015 08:45:55      NXT-4ATT-SD4C-VGD4-BYRBY    1.00   Payment   1   10205692356566291922
129.    01.02.2015 08:43:34      NXT-4HFF-7TTU-YTVL-AVMWV    1.00   Payment   1   3644681214783323105
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: printshop on February 03, 2015, 05:50:46 pm
Any explanation about the transactions of today?

It looks like some people bought and sold some shares -- not sure which transactions you mean. We're actively trading a number of assets like Coinomat and USDbitfinx, and some others. Which do you mean?

#    Timestamp   IO                    Account                                Amount   Type   Fee    Transaction
102.    01.02.2015 08:53:11      NXT-VGWL-74SL-8EDC-6J3W3    1.00   Payment   1   15359389627286636551

Oh that. It's SafeHash business. You will notice that all of those addresses hold or held shares of SafeHash (that transaction was part of a series of messages sent to shareholders).
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: printshop on February 07, 2015, 08:19:17 am
Date: 07/02/2015 17:11:46
Type:   Dividend Payment
Asset Name: SafeHash
Amount Per Share: 0.00707 NXT
Height: 352365

Transaction ID: 13580078149601024414:
A total of 2047.98104 NXT was distributed among 16 accounts which own a total of 289'672 shares.
A total of 2896.72 NXT was distributed among 16 accounts which own a total of 289'672 shares. (Bonus Dividend)

Transaction ID: 6581950574367165577
A total of 126.84287 NXT was distributed among 19 accounts which own a total of 17'941 shares.


Based on favorable investment results, dividends this week have been cautiously increased by 1% to 0.00707 NXT per share.

The bonus dividend of 0.01 per share (for transferring your shares) has been included in the dividend payment for all new SafeHash shares. If you still have old shares of SafeHash, speak with me over the weekend to exchange your shares and get in on this special one-time offer. If we can get you transferred over to the new SafeHash I'll send along your bonus dividend manually. Thank you for your support, team!

“In the movie 'Wall Street' I play Gordon Gekko, a greedy corporate executive who cheated to profit while innocent investors lost their savings. The movie was fiction, but the problem is real.”
― Michael Douglas
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: printshop on February 08, 2015, 06:57:08 pm
Quote
Hi there!

I just wanted to ask about your safehash asset.

How do you both insure all investment and at the same time use investment for business?

If it is backed 1:1 then I don't understand how you can actually use the investments.

Sorry if this is already answered in some way, I feel like I'm missing something.

This is a great question. I suspect many investors have refrained from investing because they doubt we can do what we say we do.

First let's go back to before LTCgear.com crashed. What we did when we started was insure against a collapse in the mining sector. KNS donated (IIRC) 50,000 NXT towards backing the first 50,000 shares. To make a long story short we invested 1 NXT into usdbitfnx for every 1 NXT we invested into BearMining. The goal of the fund was not to hold everything in 100% NXT just to protect against a mining collapse. Which we did. Admirably.

After LTCgear collapsed, we sold our usdbitfnx and came up with I think about 90,000 NXT in total to support the buyback of whomever wanted to sell. Once that was done, I decided to carry on the fund's activities. I loved the model I had come up with and it seemed to not just be successful but to actually protect investors like I designed it to do. So I had KNS buy about 100,000 shares. The money we raised from that was invested the proceeds into various strong, dividend paying assets like MMNXT or Coinomat.

As it stands now it may not look like the fund is 100% backed but should anything collapse, KNS will be the last in line to make any claims. To simplify, the original investors (before KNS recapitalized the fund) still have their 1 NXT like they always did. But now they have an income from the extra 100,000 KNS invested into the fund. Should the fund collapse for any reason, the original investors will get paid their original 1 NXT before KNS can recover any money or assets from the fund.

That should all be apparent from the contracts in the OP but I don't mind going through it and answering questions.

Let me know if I can be of any other assistance!

p.s. I should add this is all very general, the numbers are approximate. I have a series of spreadsheets I use to keep track of things more exactly.
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: printshop on February 08, 2015, 09:56:23 pm
Cashflow per share.

One of our goals is to maximize "cashflow per share". Right now we have 333,188 outstanding shares and a cashflow of about 0.012 NXT per share. If we were to sell the remaining 119,000 shares on ask I would invest another 20,000 or so and shoot for a cashflow of about 0.01 per share. Then our reinvestment amount would slowly increase this cashflow. I would ideally like to see a cashflow of 0.02 per share. That will happen faster if we don't sell any new shares or better, if we can buy some back. The way that works is we almost never sell our investment assets. We just repurchase shares out of the insurance fund. That's okay, because with less shares out we need less cash on hand to insure them.

So you can consider SafeHash as a market barometer, to find out what return investors are looking for. If we pay too much we will sell more shares and our cashflow per share will decrease. I think we're about at market equilibrium right now. I am looking to reinvest until we can lower our payout ratio from where it is now (about 75%) to more like 50%. I don't know how long this will take, probably around 3 months? Maybe 4, if we don't sell any new shares.
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: printshop on February 11, 2015, 03:37:14 am
With great respect for the previous question, to help shed some light on where we are, I have pulled a few off-site investments we have and put them on the bid side. I will leave these bids active for the remainder of February before returning them to their place. This will lower our profit slightly but not so much as to cause us to lower the dividend.

1. Bid of 50,000 shares at 0.99
2. Bid of 50,000 shares at 0.995
3. Bid of 25,000 shares at 0.9999

This is sufficient to take out even our largest shareholders in one go, at a profit to them based on the length of time they've been holding.

We have additionally this much invested in BTCjam, I may slowly start pulling some of that out because I have been very disappointed in their customer service. Point being, the money is there. The fund is 100% insured. Want us to put up another 100,000 NXT bid? Just ask. Altho by that point we hope it's because someone wants to sell. We LOVE you if you sell back to us. Let us know! For large orders if you PM me I can get you 1 NXT per share! You lose nothing. Sell your shares! Go ahead! We love you! It's okay!

In other news, we've sold out the majority of our shares. We will enter a cooling down period now where we let the fund run at this level for a couple of weeks, see how assets perform, etc. I think that we might as well call it for the end of February. We'll pull the bids and reinvest based on our research in early March.
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: printshop on February 14, 2015, 04:26:28 pm
Date: 15/02/2015 1:26
Type:   Dividend Payment
Asset Name: SafeHash
Amount Per Share: 0.00707 NXT
Height: 358272

Transaction ID: 14240293352757809077
A total of 3308.66102 NXT was distributed among 19 accounts which own a total of 467'986 shares.


I'm a little busy this morning so I will pay old assets' dividends at a later date.

“If you do not change direction, then you may end up where you are heading.”
― Lao Tzu
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: printshop on February 23, 2015, 07:29:45 am
Surprisingly (or not) iHash, ColdHash, and a number of other assumedly okay investments have simply stopped paying dividends.

This is going to hurt SafeHash very much, and based on a 50% payout ratio we have fallen from 45% APY to about 4%. I'm going to skip dividend payments this week (which will damage DailyTrade's ability to pay as well) while I move the NXT we were staking into other investment platforms.

Your NXT is still there. But due to the results of the staking test I won't maintain large bids anymore. If you want to sell, you're more than welcome to. I expect a large number of people will want to sell. You can sell by putting your shares up for sale at 0.99. If you want you can try 0.995 or 0.999 and I'll buy them out. My rule is that I don't buy-out until we can make at least 1 NXT doing so (I won't buy shares which cost us money to buy, it would damage the fund).

I expect a return to 1% dividends next week. The platforms I have invested in are cryptocoin based, but completely disjointed from NXT and from this community. Will provide updates on the week.
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: printshop on February 25, 2015, 01:01:25 pm
Date: 25/02/2015 21:50:29
Type:   Dividend Payment
Asset Name: SafeHash
Amount Per Share: 0.0007 NXT
Height: 366804
Transaction ID: 9093619449735973364


After great deliberation I have decided to pay dividends this week after all. Better late than never. I just feel it is important to keep things moving and keep a positive attitude. I will pay 0.0007 per share, for a payout ratio of 53.6%. Again, I expect much larger dividends next week as the 200,000 NXT I was using for the forging test has been returned to the liquid currency investments I had previously made.

A total of 331.2848 NXT was distributed among 22 accounts which own a total of 473'264 shares.

“I command you all to fight!"
― King Arthur (First Knight) (http://www.wingclips.com/movie-clips/first-knight/never-surrender)

Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: printshop on March 02, 2015, 05:34:46 am
Date: 02/03/2015 14:29:27
Type:   Dividend Payment
Asset Name: SafeHash
Amount Per Share: 0.002413499 NXT
Height: 370516
Transaction ID: 9093619449735973364

A total of 1132.80049338 NXT was be distributed among 21 accounts which own a total of 469'362 shares.[/b]

It's been an absolutely brutal week, but we're still here. We're much more stable now than ever.

I am thinking of merging SafeHash and DailyTrade. The investment goals are essentially the same, and with the new dividend feature in the client an asset paying daily dividends (vs. weekly) has no justification for it's existence. I'll also be frank, paying daily dividends is a pain, since I am frequently away on business (out of town) and I don't trust local net cafes or wifi to do NXT stuff on. Really, daily dividends are a bit of a gimmick which failed. Then again, why not keep it up? When AutoDiv finally fails (and it will) I'll have the only daily dividend paying asset in the community. The main downside is that the general drought of new SafeHash shares will continue, with no new SafeHash able to be released until at least the end of March (and probably April).

“Don't cry because it's over. Smile because it happened.”
― Dr. Seuss
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: printshop on March 08, 2015, 09:44:41 am
Date: 08/03/2015 18:42:34
Type:   Dividend Payment
Asset Name: SafeHash
Amount Per Share: 0.00150445 NXT
Height: 375218
Transaction ID: 3512839672617254733

A total of 697.8993105 NXT will be distributed among 21 accounts which own a total of 463'890 shares.[/b]

Exchange rates that are positive to NXT hurt our dividend. We have risen 10% this week so our dividend is low (to compensate I have set a payout ratio of 73%). This is balanced out by an increase in the value of your holdings. Dividend is expected to rise next week due to reinvestments.

I've involved SafeHash with a real estate deal I am working on . If it fails, dividends will remain at this level for at least six months. If it works out, there will be a significant boost. Well, excuse me, I guess I had better get working on that right now!

“The way to get started is to quit talking and begin doing.”
Walt Disney
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: printshop on March 17, 2015, 01:10:39 pm
Date: 17/03/2015 02:28:12
Type:   Dividend Payment
Asset Name: SafeHash
Amount Per Share: 0.002 NXT
Height: 381000
Transaction ID: 15338681710355116357


I hate making dividend payment announcements, but I love saving over 100 NXT a week having to do so.
Okay, so, the NxtGlaive money is finally starting to come in. The problem is there's nowhere to spend it. There isn't a single worthwhile investment on the NXT AE (from the standpoint of dividend paying stocks). There are serious problems reverberating around right now, not just with the closure of LTCgear but also with the shutdown of ASICminer/disappearance of friedcat/it was a ponzi all along, and possibly the implication of Havelock, TAT and many others as well. I would not trust any investment in the community right now with the possible exceptions of just-dice and a small handful of others. That is the reason I sold out all our MMNXT for example, because I detected dangerous financial tremors that have the potential to sink it. I am currently moving us more and more into direct holdings and direct ownership investments such as loans, real estate, just-dice, and so on. I am keeping things liquid enough that we will be able to pull out and get into something like CLAMS or whatever, should an opportunity arise.

I would like to go all in on something like BTCjam investing, but I have learned my lesson many times over not to put all the eggs in one basket. It's the only thing that has kept us alive so far.

“You have to dream before your dreams can come true.”
—A. P. J. Abdul Kalam
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: printshop on March 22, 2015, 11:52:00 am
Date: 22/03/2015 02:28:12
Transaction ID: 16406978533751974694

Type:   Dividend Payment
Asset Name: SafeHash
Amount Per Share: 0.005 NXT
Height: 385959[/b]

A total of 2265.21 NXT was distributed among 19 accounts which own a total of 453'042 shares.

My job is in a state of flux. Like a caterpillar I am in a coccoon, not nearly able to spend time here as much as I want. That's fine, the funds flow is relatively straightforward now. Even KNS is basically profitable. I must say however I am disappointed with the liquidity on SafeHash. I wish someone would buy OR sell. It is a little annoying to see it stuck there. Well, whatever works :)

“Everybody grows but me.”
— Queen Victoria
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: dolux on March 26, 2015, 08:04:59 pm
Hi printshop, I bought 80 SafeHash assets on 2/24/2015 and there has been 5 dividend payouts since then.

"Date: 25/02/2015 21:50:29
Type:   Dividend Payment
Asset Name: SafeHash
Amount Per Share: 0.0007 NXT
Height: 366804
Transaction ID: 9093619449735973364"

"Date: 02/03/2015 14:29:27
Type:   Dividend Payment
Asset Name: SafeHash
Amount Per Share: 0.002413499 NXT
Height: 370516
Transaction ID: 9093619449735973364"

"Date: 08/03/2015 18:42:34
Type:   Dividend Payment
Asset Name: SafeHash
Amount Per Share: 0.00150445 NXT
Height: 375218
Transaction ID: 3512839672617254733"

"Date: 17/03/2015 02:28:12
Type:   Dividend Payment
Asset Name: SafeHash
Amount Per Share: 0.002 NXT
Height: 381000
Transaction ID: 15338681710355116357"

"Date: 22/03/2015 02:28:12
Transaction ID: 16406978533751974694
Type:   Dividend Payment
Asset Name: SafeHash
Amount Per Share: 0.005 NXT
Height: 385959"

I have not received a single dividend payout during this time as far as I can tell.
I am not trying to accuse anyone of any wrong doing but I am inquiring as to any explanation as to why I have not received any dividends.
I expect there is a good and valid reason but I am just not aware of it, could you please explain?

Thanks.   



Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: printshop on March 27, 2015, 03:19:20 pm
Hi printshop, I bought 80 SafeHash assets on 2/24/2015 and there has been 5 dividend payouts since then.
...
I have not received a single dividend payout during this time as far as I can tell.
I am not trying to accuse anyone of any wrong doing but I am inquiring as to any explanation as to why I have not received any dividends.
I expect there is a good and valid reason but I am just not aware of it, could you please explain?

I assure you that you have received the dividend payments, but since we use the dividend payment feature of the NXT blockchain, these transactions do not appear in the client.

The client devs are aware of this problem and plan to correct it in the future. To verify you have been paid, simply browse the transaction ID which I give when stating I made a payment. If it states that a dividend payment was made as of a certain block #, and you owned shares on that block #, you are guaranteed to have received your dividends. If you watch you would see your balance go up. But because there is no other indication you have been paid it is easy to miss.

Other assets pay dividends manually, so that you have a record of the transfer. However this is prohibitively expensive. It costs hundreds of NXT per payment. We save a lot of money by paying via the blockchain.

So while I admit it is a little inconvenient, it is the best way to preserve value. I can't imagine a fund throwing hundreds of NXT away each month being thought of as managed responsibly.
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: dolux on March 27, 2015, 06:19:46 pm
Hi printshop, I bought 80 SafeHash assets on 2/24/2015 and there has been 5 dividend payouts since then.
...
I have not received a single dividend payout during this time as far as I can tell.
I am not trying to accuse anyone of any wrong doing but I am inquiring as to any explanation as to why I have not received any dividends.
I expect there is a good and valid reason but I am just not aware of it, could you please explain?

I assure you that you have received the dividend payments, but since we use the dividend payment feature of the NXT blockchain, these transactions do not appear in the client.

The client devs are aware of this problem and plan to correct it in the future. To verify you have been paid, simply browse the transaction ID which I give when stating I made a payment. If it states that a dividend payment was made as of a certain block #, and you owned shares on that block #, you are guaranteed to have received your dividends. If you watch you would see your balance go up. But because there is no other indication you have been paid it is easy to miss.

Other assets pay dividends manually, so that you have a record of the transfer. However this is prohibitively expensive. It costs hundreds of NXT per payment. We save a lot of money by paying via the blockchain.

So while I admit it is a little inconvenient, it is the best way to preserve value. I can't imagine a fund throwing hundreds of NXT away each month being thought of as managed responsibly.

Hi printshop, I am sorry but I am not able to find any transactions of dividends, I have tried what you have said but to be honest I cannot even be sure that I am doing the search correctly. I am sorry again but you will have to explain what I should be doing in baby step instructions or show me some other way how I can see that these transactions have been made. I am not able to tell by watching my balance as the time has already past and they coincide with other transactions on the same day so I would have just taken the changes as being from them. I realize that this is not an easy situation because I would not like to be paying out 1 nxt for every transaction either but equally I would like to know that I have been paid and at this time I am not easily able to confirm that I have been paid. Sorry about the inconvenience but it is the same this side also.

Thanks.   
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: printshop on March 31, 2015, 03:48:12 am
Hi printshop, I am sorry but I am not able to find any transactions of dividends, I have tried what you have said but to be honest I cannot even be sure that I am doing the search correctly. I am sorry again but you will have to explain what I should be doing in baby step instructions or show me some other way how I can see that these transactions have been made. I am not able to tell by watching my balance as the time has already past and they coincide with other transactions on the same day so I would have just taken the changes as being from them. I realize that this is not an easy situation because I would not like to be paying out 1 nxt for every transaction either but equally I would like to know that I have been paid and at this time I am not easily able to confirm that I have been paid. Sorry about the inconvenience but it is the same this side also.

Thanks.

I'll do what I can to help but remember it's not my job to teach you how to use the client and associated software :) Basically what you do is take the transaction number from one of the payment announcements, such as 16406978533751974694, and enter it into the "Search by ID..." box in the upper left of the client.

You will get a modal popup which states among other things:

a) that it is a Dividend Payment transaction
b) the amount per share
c) the height (ex-date) it was paid for
d) The sender (clickable link to verify it was me who sent it).

This is enough for you to determine whether or not you were paid, since the fact your client can find and process the transaction ID shows it can recognize the payment amount and time and determine your proper balance.

For anything more specific you would need to ask on the client help forum :) Thx~
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: printshop on March 31, 2015, 05:26:34 am
Date: 31/03/2015 14:21:55
Transaction ID: 7743193990110885251
Type:   Dividend Payment
Asset Name: SafeHash
Amount Per Share: 0.00529 NXT
Height: 392500

A total of 2400.69722 NXT was distributed among 18 accounts which own a total of 453'818 shares.


I'm hard at work on my kongzi site now. I guess it's time to hit it very hard before the opening of the school. In short I don't want to be bothered and I am very lazy about payments :p I tell myself "Gee it's Tuesday and I didn't make payments yet, I'm slipping... " but the truth is that this attitude has not arisen in isolation, but because the community here has fallen down quite a bit from the excitement that surrounded it a few months ago.

Since Christmas I have noticed an exodus of funds and interest from NXT. The right projects aren't getting financial support and this is causing people to disappear from the community. Frankly I blame the anti-competitive practices which have been employed in the past. If I want to be serious about running a company it is obvious that NXT will not be able to support our aims at all (just from the standpoint of exposure let alone financially). We may have a look at branching out into bitcoin or other cryptocoins this summer after the school is built.
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: dolux on March 31, 2015, 08:02:13 pm
Hi printshop,

"INFO
 Type:   Dividend Payment
Asset Name:   SafeHash
Amount Per Share:   0.00529 NXT
Height:   392500
Sender:   NXT-X5EF-HTB2-RLYU-HW8E7"

I click on (Transaction Details) and I get this below:

"Full Hash:   83b57fa7e859756b55c1f1fd44b2dcf08f2ddc61c6d9176067348d937c1f8ac6
Confirmations:   177
Signature Hash:   ec454b171a76397cbadf58e6d0f2a72e2cc9039ae82949b16a4bbbc77844d976
Amount NQT:   0 NXT
transaction_index:   0
ec_block_height:   392500
Block:   14867067135906545874
Type:   2
Fee NQT:   1 NXT
Version:   1
Sender:   17487719788180311437
Timestamp:   42484915
ec_block_id:   14225116975160844323
Subtype:   6
Sender Public Key:   0f28bad1aa94cb67d673074c7f6b6e1d5e56e49c6f94b6c49d07f0235e2e4352
Deadline:   1440
Block Timestamp:   42485119
Sender RS:   NXT-X5EF-HTB2-RLYU-HW8E7
signature:   0e9d0a3038fa4bf53b3fe482c8919aa879e6e5934a336e70660727f4f8896e002de6ee00abecaf94cf46db1279c2f2ce244ff29c3df56eff82a50439ffd22fba
Height:   392510£

The only thing this information tells me is that you made a transaction under Asset Name:   SafeHash.

As far as I can tell I have not recived dividends as well as you not being able to give me any confirmation that I can verify of any transaction of dividends to my account. I cannot see any increase in my account balance since this last notice of dividend payout. I only have your word for it, which I am sorry is not enough, as I do not know you in any way, you could be a paradigm flux for all I know, LOL ( I do consider that it is your job to show verifiable confirmation that people have been sent and recived dividends) so I have dumped my assets and if at any time I get some confirmation that I have been paid dividends then I will gladly reconsider buying assets again, as well as come back to this thread to update it with any new information.

What you write about below is caused by issues like the one I have just posted.

[b I guess it's time to hit it very hard before the opening of the school. In short I don't want to be bothered and I am very lazy about payments :p I tell myself "Gee it's Tuesday and I didn't make payments yet, I'm slipping... " but the truth is that this attitude has not arisen in isolation, but because the community here has fallen down quite a bit from the excitement that surrounded it a few months ago.

Since Christmas I have noticed an exodus of funds and interest from NXT. The right projects aren't getting financial support and this is causing people to disappear from the community. Frankly I blame the anti-competitive practices which have been employed in the past. If I want to be serious about running a company it is obvious that NXT will not be able to support our aims at all (just from the standpoint of exposure let alone financially). We may have a look at branching out into bitcoin or other cryptocoins this summer after the school is built.


"Over the bleached bones and jumbled residues of numerous civilizations are written the pathetic words ‘Too Late’.” Martin Luther King Jr.

Thanks.
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: blackyblack1 on March 31, 2015, 08:08:51 pm
I do consider that it is your job to show verifiable confirmation that people have been sent and recived dividends
https://nxtblocks.info/#section/txid/7743193990110885251
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: dolux on March 31, 2015, 08:33:45 pm
I do consider that it is your job to show verifiable confirmation that people have been sent and recived dividends
https://nxtblocks.info/#section/txid/7743193990110885251

That shows me dividends where sent but it is not showing me who they where sent to so there is no verification that they where received and unless I have to wait for 1440 confirmations for this transaction to show up in my wallet then I did not receive any dividends and if they do show up I will gladly come back to verify that they have. 

And this is why people have issues with NXT.
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: blackyblack1 on March 31, 2015, 08:44:09 pm
I do consider that it is your job to show verifiable confirmation that people have been sent and recived dividends
https://nxtblocks.info/#section/txid/7743193990110885251

That shows me dividends where sent but it is not showing me who they where sent to so there is no verification that they where received and unless I have to wait for 1440 confirmations for this transaction to show up in my wallet then I did not receive any dividends and if they do show up I will gladly come back to verify that they have. 

And this is why people have issues with NXT.
There is no recipient in such kind of transactions and I do not know what do you expect to see after 1440 confirmations. This transaction will never appear in your wallet but it is enforced by the blockchain that you have received your money if you hold any SafeHash asset at the given block height.
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: dolux on March 31, 2015, 09:42:47 pm
I do consider that it is your job to show verifiable confirmation that people have been sent and recived dividends
https://nxtblocks.info/#section/txid/7743193990110885251

That shows me dividends where sent but it is not showing me who they where sent to so there is no verification that they where received and unless I have to wait for 1440 confirmations for this transaction to show up in my wallet then I did not receive any dividends and if they do show up I will gladly come back to verify that they have. 

And this is why people have issues with NXT.
There is no recipient in such kind of transactions and I do not know what do you expect to see after 1440 confirmations. This transaction will never appear in your wallet but it is enforced by the blockchain that you have received your money if you hold any SafeHash asset at the given block height.

Another reason why people have got problems with NXT.
Money will not show up in my wallet but it will be on the block chain, so is this ghost money?
Anyway it is not money it's NXT and how do I know that I have it if it does not show up in my wallet?
If it does not show up in my wallet how do I actually have it?
How do I actually spend it if I don't know it is there?
What is the point?

Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: jl777 on March 31, 2015, 09:56:50 pm
I do consider that it is your job to show verifiable confirmation that people have been sent and recived dividends
https://nxtblocks.info/#section/txid/7743193990110885251

That shows me dividends where sent but it is not showing me who they where sent to so there is no verification that they where received and unless I have to wait for 1440 confirmations for this transaction to show up in my wallet then I did not receive any dividends and if they do show up I will gladly come back to verify that they have. 

And this is why people have issues with NXT.
There is no recipient in such kind of transactions and I do not know what do you expect to see after 1440 confirmations. This transaction will never appear in your wallet but it is enforced by the blockchain that you have received your money if you hold any SafeHash asset at the given block height.

Another reason why people have got problems with NXT.
Money will not show up in my wallet but it will be on the block chain, so is this ghost money?
Anyway it is not money it's NXT and how do I know that I have it if it does not show up in my wallet?
If it does not show up in my wallet how do I actually have it?
How do I actually spend it if I don't know it is there?
What is the point?
your account was credited, there just isnt a separate transaction record for it (yet)
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: dolux on March 31, 2015, 09:59:59 pm
I do consider that it is your job to show verifiable confirmation that people have been sent and recived dividends
https://nxtblocks.info/#section/txid/7743193990110885251

That shows me dividends where sent but it is not showing me who they where sent to so there is no verification that they where received and unless I have to wait for 1440 confirmations for this transaction to show up in my wallet then I did not receive any dividends and if they do show up I will gladly come back to verify that they have. 

And this is why people have issues with NXT.
There is no recipient in such kind of transactions and I do not know what do you expect to see after 1440 confirmations. This transaction will never appear in your wallet but it is enforced by the blockchain that you have received your money if you hold any SafeHash asset at the given block height.

Another reason why people have got problems with NXT.
Money will not show up in my wallet but it will be on the block chain, so is this ghost money?
Anyway it is not money it's NXT and how do I know that I have it if it does not show up in my wallet?
If it does not show up in my wallet how do I actually have it?
How do I actually spend it if I don't know it is there?
What is the point?
your account was credited, there just isnt a separate transaction record for it (yet)

If my account has been credited then why do I not see it in my wallet?
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: dolux on March 31, 2015, 10:01:37 pm
To rephrase that, why do I not see the NXT dividend in my wallet?
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: jl777 on March 31, 2015, 10:28:10 pm
To rephrase that, why do I not see the NXT dividend in my wallet?
you did not get the transaction directly, so the wallet would have to directly check for all dividend transactions done by everyone and see if you had any assets that would have gotten a dividend

the alternative is for a lot of dividends to not be sent out as it is less than the 1 NXT txfee
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: printshop on April 01, 2015, 01:40:10 am
I click on (Transaction Details) and I get this below:

"ec_block_height:   392500...
Type:   2...
Subtype:   6...

The only thing this information tells me is that you made a transaction under Asset Name:   SafeHash.

No, that's incorrect; you know it was type 2 subtype 6, and you know the height was 392500. Also, this is not information from the client; I told you to look it up in the official client which correctly shows subtype 6 as a Dividend Payment and shows the payment amount.

As far as I can tell I have not recived dividends as well as you not being able to give me any confirmation that I can verify of any transaction of dividends to my account. I cannot see any increase in my account balance since this last notice of dividend payout. I only have your word for it, which I am sorry is not enough, as I do not know you in any way, you could be a paradigm flux for all I know, LOL ( I do consider that it is your job to show verifiable confirmation that people have been sent and recived dividends) so I have dumped my assets and if at any time I get some confirmation that I have been paid dividends then I will gladly reconsider buying assets again, as well as come back to this thread to update it with any new information.

I could give you all the information in the world, but if you don't listen to it then you will still not understand :) Go look up the transaction in the official client and you will see. As for it being "my job" you are right -- I did give you the transaction ID number which shows you have been paid. So my end of the bargain has been fufilled.

SafeHash exists to let you sell out at a fair value any time you want. The fact you can sell your shares for essentially what you paid for it at any time and feel comfortable and easy about doing that is a very special thing which I am proud of. This is the best deal this community has. I'm happy you enjoyed your time in SafeHash, and if you ever figure out how to check those transaction IDs you would be more than welcome back :)
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: dolux on April 01, 2015, 01:45:41 am
To rephrase that, why do I not see the NXT dividend in my wallet?
you did not get the transaction directly, so the wallet would have to directly check for all dividend transactions done by everyone and see if you had any assets that would have gotten a dividend

the alternative is for a lot of dividends to not be sent out as it is less than the 1 NXT txfee

Thanks for the explanation, now I know why I have not seen payment in my wallet, because it is probably less than the 1 NXT txfee and that means I have not been paid just like I said in the first place, ha, thanks again for the clarity.
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: dolux on April 01, 2015, 01:56:16 am
I click on (Transaction Details) and I get this below:

"ec_block_height:   392500...
Type:   2...
Subtype:   6...

The only thing this information tells me is that you made a transaction under Asset Name:   SafeHash.

No, that's incorrect; you know it was type 2 subtype 6, and you know the height was 392500. Also, this is not information from the client; I told you to look it up in the official client which correctly shows subtype 6 as a Dividend Payment and shows the payment amount.

As far as I can tell I have not recived dividends as well as you not being able to give me any confirmation that I can verify of any transaction of dividends to my account. I cannot see any increase in my account balance since this last notice of dividend payout. I only have your word for it, which I am sorry is not enough, as I do not know you in any way, you could be a paradigm flux for all I know, LOL ( I do consider that it is your job to show verifiable confirmation that people have been sent and recived dividends) so I have dumped my assets and if at any time I get some confirmation that I have been paid dividends then I will gladly reconsider buying assets again, as well as come back to this thread to update it with any new information.

I could give you all the information in the world, but if you don't listen to it then you will still not understand :) Go look up the transaction in the official client and you will see. As for it being "my job" you are right -- I did give you the transaction ID number which shows you have been paid. So my end of the bargain has been fufilled.

SafeHash exists to let you sell out at a fair value any time you want. The fact you can sell your shares for essentially what you paid for it at any time and feel comfortable and easy about doing that is a very special thing which I am proud of. This is the best deal this community has. I'm happy you enjoyed your time in SafeHash, and if you ever figure out how to check those transaction IDs you would be more than welcome back :)

I won't bother, happy days. ;D ;D ;D
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: jl777 on April 01, 2015, 02:27:53 am
To rephrase that, why do I not see the NXT dividend in my wallet?
you did not get the transaction directly, so the wallet would have to directly check for all dividend transactions done by everyone and see if you had any assets that would have gotten a dividend

the alternative is for a lot of dividends to not be sent out as it is less than the 1 NXT txfee

Thanks for the explanation, now I know why I have not seen payment in my wallet, because it is probably less than the 1 NXT txfee and that means I have not been paid just like I said in the first place, ha, thanks again for the clarity.
you probably have been paid. That is what I am saying, the dividend mechanism costs 1 NXT and makes 1 transaction in the asset issuer's account. It could go to 1 or thousands of accounts, even for as small amount as 0.00000001 NXT

there just isnt a blockchain record of all the dividend payments, but it can be calculated based on the height, asset and amount
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: dolux on April 01, 2015, 02:52:48 am
To rephrase that, why do I not see the NXT dividend in my wallet?
you did not get the transaction directly, so the wallet would have to directly check for all dividend transactions done by everyone and see if you had any assets that would have gotten a dividend

the alternative is for a lot of dividends to not be sent out as it is less than the 1 NXT txfee

Thanks for the explanation, now I know why I have not seen payment in my wallet, because it is probably less than the 1 NXT txfee and that means I have not been paid just like I said in the first place, ha, thanks again for the clarity.
you probably have been paid. That is what I am saying, the dividend mechanism costs 1 NXT and makes 1 transaction in the asset issuer's account. It could go to 1 or thousands of accounts, even for as small amount as 0.00000001 NXT

there just isnt a blockchain record of all the dividend payments, but it can be calculated based on the height, asset and amount

I am not getting you, if I am paid 0.00000001 NXT for example then surely it should show up in my coin balance added to what was already there shouldn't it?

Now if it is somewhere else then it is not in my wallet, even if it is on the block chain belonging to me and I cannot see it is there then I am sorry but to me that means I might as well not have it because I can't use it if I don't know it's there plus when will I get to actually know it is there.

Thanks.
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: jl777 on April 01, 2015, 03:09:40 am
To rephrase that, why do I not see the NXT dividend in my wallet?
you did not get the transaction directly, so the wallet would have to directly check for all dividend transactions done by everyone and see if you had any assets that would have gotten a dividend

the alternative is for a lot of dividends to not be sent out as it is less than the 1 NXT txfee

Thanks for the explanation, now I know why I have not seen payment in my wallet, because it is probably less than the 1 NXT txfee and that means I have not been paid just like I said in the first place, ha, thanks again for the clarity.
you probably have been paid. That is what I am saying, the dividend mechanism costs 1 NXT and makes 1 transaction in the asset issuer's account. It could go to 1 or thousands of accounts, even for as small amount as 0.00000001 NXT

there just isnt a blockchain record of all the dividend payments, but it can be calculated based on the height, asset and amount

I am not getting you, if I am paid 0.00000001 NXT for example then surely it should show up in my coin balance added to what was already there shouldn't it?

Now if it is somewhere else then it is not in my wallet, even if it is on the block chain belonging to me and I cannot see it is there then I am sorry but to me that means I might as well not have it because I can't use it if I don't know it's there plus when will I get to actually know it is there.

Thanks.
it should be reflected in your balance. do you keep track of your wallet balance to the satoshi? if you do, you should see it higher than expected from the transactions you see in your list of transactions.

in other words if your wallet balance went up by 0.00000012 NXT would you have noticed it?
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: dolux on April 01, 2015, 04:26:00 am
To rephrase that, why do I not see the NXT dividend in my wallet?
you did not get the transaction directly, so the wallet would have to directly check for all dividend transactions done by everyone and see if you had any assets that would have gotten a dividend

the alternative is for a lot of dividends to not be sent out as it is less than the 1 NXT txfee

Thanks for the explanation, now I know why I have not seen payment in my wallet, because it is probably less than the 1 NXT txfee and that means I have not been paid just like I said in the first place, ha, thanks again for the clarity.
you probably have been paid. That is what I am saying, the dividend mechanism costs 1 NXT and makes 1 transaction in the asset issuer's account. It could go to 1 or thousands of accounts, even for as small amount as 0.00000001 NXT

there just isnt a blockchain record of all the dividend payments, but it can be calculated based on the height, asset and amount

I am not getting you, if I am paid 0.00000001 NXT for example then surely it should show up in my coin balance added to what was already there shouldn't it?

Now if it is somewhere else then it is not in my wallet, even if it is on the block chain belonging to me and I cannot see it is there then I am sorry but to me that means I might as well not have it because I can't use it if I don't know it's there plus when will I get to actually know it is there.

Thanks.
it should be reflected in your balance. do you keep track of your wallet balance to the satoshi? if you do, you should see it higher than expected from the transactions you see in your list of transactions.

in other words if your wallet balance went up by 0.00000012 NXT would you have noticed it?

Yes for the past few days I had been keeping a record of my balance to the last sat but it's all by the by now as I deleted them after may last post to print shop as I felt he just wasn't trying to be helpful.

Happy days to you and thanks.
   

Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: printshop on April 01, 2015, 05:18:28 am
Yes for the past few days I had been keeping a record of my balance to the last sat but it's all by the by now as I deleted them after may last post to print shop as I felt he just wasn't trying to be helpful.

Happy days to you and thanks.

I'm sorry about that. But I told you to use the client to investigate the transaction ID and you did not do so. Instead you used some other service which does not parse "Type 2 Subtype 6" as a dividend payment *(nor lists the transaction amount). So there isn't really much else I can do for you. You have to use the official client or use a service which is aware of Type 2 Subtype 6. Only you can do that :)
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: dolux on April 01, 2015, 12:10:27 pm
Yes for the past few days I had been keeping a record of my balance to the last sat but it's all by the by now as I deleted them after may last post to print shop as I felt he just wasn't trying to be helpful.

Happy days to you and thanks.

I'm sorry about that. But I told you to use the client to investigate the transaction ID and you did not do so. Instead you used some other service which does not parse "Type 2 Subtype 6" as a dividend payment *(nor lists the transaction amount). So there isn't really much else I can do for you. You have to use the official client or use a service which is aware of Type 2 Subtype 6. Only you can do that :)

The above statement by you is tosh and hears why.

Printshop, you are using the experimental Dividend+ payment feature instead of the SuperNet version which shows a complete record for every transaction.

there just isnt a blockchain record of all the dividend payments, but it can be calculated based on the height, asset and amount


This I uderstand to mean that the amount which has been paid to the individual can be calculated based on the height, asset and amount that has been sent out initially by the asset holder.

The problem was, that was not the issue that I had.

The issue was that I had been watching my account coin balance and did not see any increase after it was anounced that payment had been made.

Type 2 Subtype 6 is irrelavant, what is relavant is you are using an experimental version of dividend paying and there just isnt a blockchain record of all the dividend payments. This means you cannot verify that I was paid anything and I cannot show that I wasn't in any independent way.

Dividend Payment Record.

I'm keeping track of all dividends paid with the new Dividend payment system until the client is fixed. Yes, you definately got your dividends if you were holding shares during the block height in question!

The dividend payments will appear in the account ledger, when it is ready. This is a new feature, not a bugfix, and will take some more time. A lot of code has been written, but needs some improvement, and the effect on performance and db size is not yet known. Finishing the voting system and phasing is a priority now, I will look into what remains to be done for account ledger after that.

Thank you for another update. Couldn't have done it without you ^^

Of urgency is the Dividend+ payment feature. Invisible dividend payments are extremely problematic, is there any info on when clients will be able to pick up and report dividend payments? We need a record of who has been paid and how much. Thx.


Hopefully Jean-Luc will fix it soon, and we will be able to see all past and future payments in the client.



So I don't think you have been or are being helpful still with your Type 2 Subtype 6, thingy "Invisible dividend payments are extremely problematic" and you know this because it is a quote from you so Type 2 Subtype 6 to you too, lol.
 
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: printshop on April 01, 2015, 05:03:26 pm
Printshop, you are using the experimental Dividend+ payment feature instead of the SuperNet version which shows a complete record for every transaction.
...
So I don't think you have been or are being helpful still with your Type 2 Subtype 6, thingy "Invisible dividend payments are extremely problematic" and you know this because it is a quote from you so Type 2 Subtype 6 to you too, lol.

The reason why is problematic is because people will state there is no record of payment while at the same time refusing to look up a transaction number in their client. You said yourself "you are using the experimental Dividend+ payment feature..." which is a statement that dividends have in fact been paid. You are also fully aware of the transaction ID being recognized and correctly parsed by your client. So what it sounds like is you are claiming is that you didn't see your balance increase. Well I don't know why you didn't see your balance increase. I know we have half a million shares outstanding over 17 or 18 accounts and you are the only one who didn't see it. Perhaps this has to do more with the fact that you only had 80 shares and your payment might have been less than 1 NXT. Maybe you had something like 262.19 NXT and the payment amounted to 0.6 NXT and you just missed it. I don't know. I do know that no one else had a problem so I really don't know what you expect me to do. I'd be more than willing to do some kind of experiment, like put one share in an empty account, etc. but first I think you really need to play ball and go look up that transaction number like you were told to do.

You're the guy who sold 80 shares right? You could always put all your transactions into excel and see what the balance is supposed to be... probably simpler to just send one share to an empty account tho.

Tell you what. I'll go send 100 shares of SafeHash to a blank account (NXT-XJB4-8UA8-9RET-CB7YX) and then I'll pay a token dividend, and we can see if the account garners a balance. I'll post the results in a few minutes from now once there have been some confirmations on the asset transfer.
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: printshop on April 01, 2015, 05:27:10 pm
Tell you what. I'll go send 100 shares of SafeHash to a blank account (NXT-XJB4-8UA8-9RET-CB7YX) and then I'll pay a token dividend, and we can see if the account garners a balance. I'll post the results in a few minutes from now once there have been some confirmations on the asset transfer.

I sent 100 shares of SafeHash to account NXT-XJB4-8UA8-9RET-CB7YX in transaction 3597297769053013902. This was at block height 393698.

I then paid dividends of 0.01 per share (1%). Say thanks, guys. (Ehh, we had some extra capital lying around, why not.. it's for a good cause.. it's shareholder's money anyway)

This dividend payment can be verified by looking up transaction 3721236376180577044 in your client.

It was paid as at block height 393700, so theoretically account NXT-XJB4-8UA8-9RET-CB7YX should now have 100 shares of SafeHash and 1 NXT.

Proof: as of block 393701 account NXT-XJB4-8UA8-9RET-CB7YX contains 100 shares of SafeHash and 1 NXT.

The only logical conclusion is that dolux made a mistake and just didn't see his balance increase. Dolux, you really should look up the transaction number in the client as instructed in order to verify your payment.
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: blackyblack1 on April 01, 2015, 06:08:10 pm
It was paid as at block height 393700, so theoretically account NXT-XJB4-8UA8-9RET-CB7YX should now have 100 shares of SafeHash and 1 NXT.
But what if dividends payment feature works only for even block height numbers?
Nevermind just joking.
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: JanSako on April 01, 2015, 09:58:56 pm
Thanks for the 'extra' payout!  ;D

I was wondering where those NXT came from. Hella confusing but a better problem to have then missing some NXT!
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: 13Darko on April 02, 2015, 07:49:04 pm
Same here. The asset issuer (CVFS) made several transactions, one of which is:

"Type:   Dividend Payment
Asset Name:   CVFS
Amount Per Share:   0.35 NXFull Hash:   e9ace3245b188b965994c34311d5856b8c0256be6708c72337909366e19a9cad
Signature Hash:   8d1f756d1511f68e7070c730a409642855a4b70668f454dbfabcd847bd7c2cb0
Amount NQT:   0 NXT
ec_block_height:   392817
Type:   2
Fee NQT:   1 NXT
Version:   1
Sender:   You
Timestamp:   42520754
ec_block_id:   14047433694245950651
Height:   unknown
Subtype:   6
Sender Public Key:   33fed31ec0f72b7d88ab33c42af6c19613f310ad16071d8cc28ae2896f230e41
Deadline:   1440
Sender RS:   You
signature:   3ef2698bc500ab7583d92683335f5d710129a2a8384e2bcaa0bc15e0a4f61100b12f1431e9529bf11015819d5c1aa4eb8af9e5bc918f9493fea2c8bb95ad132d
Confirmations:   /
Block:   unconfirmedT
Height:   392821
Sender:   You

Shows up on exchange as 10847790907191962857   /   31/03/2015 16:19:14   Dividend Payment      0   1   Asset Exchange   106"

And there is no record of the funds income in my wallet or in the blockchain explorer.  ???
And as long as I don't remember my balance before the dividends, I cannot confirm I received them.

Though seems like it should be 2x350 NXT
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: whatnxt on April 03, 2015, 01:35:06 am
Same here. The asset issuer (CVFS) made several transactions, one of which is:

"Type:   Dividend Payment
Asset Name:   CVFS
Amount Per Share:   0.35 NXFull Hash:   e9ace3245b188b965994c34311d5856b8c0256be6708c72337909366e19a9cad
Signature Hash:   8d1f756d1511f68e7070c730a409642855a4b70668f454dbfabcd847bd7c2cb0
Amount NQT:   0 NXT
ec_block_height:   392817
Type:   2
Fee NQT:   1 NXT
Version:   1
Sender:   You
Timestamp:   42520754
ec_block_id:   14047433694245950651
Height:   unknown
Subtype:   6
Sender Public Key:   33fed31ec0f72b7d88ab33c42af6c19613f310ad16071d8cc28ae2896f230e41
Deadline:   1440
Sender RS:   You
signature:   3ef2698bc500ab7583d92683335f5d710129a2a8384e2bcaa0bc15e0a4f61100b12f1431e9529bf11015819d5c1aa4eb8af9e5bc918f9493fea2c8bb95ad132d
Confirmations:   /
Block:   unconfirmedT
Height:   392821
Sender:   You

Shows up on exchange as 10847790907191962857   /   31/03/2015 16:19:14   Dividend Payment      0   1   Asset Exchange   106"

And there is no record of the funds income in my wallet or in the blockchain explorer.  ???
And as long as I don't remember my balance before the dividends, I cannot confirm I received them.

Though seems like it should be 2x350 NXT

You could make an new account just for the CVFS asset. Then you can track the balance.
Not very efficient but its a simple way to get clarity given the poor information.

The last resort is to sell CVFS and buy something that is using the old system.
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: printshop on April 07, 2015, 03:46:18 pm
Date: 08/04/2015 00:45:13
Transaction ID: 6287315194120219982
Type:   Dividend Payment
Asset Name: SafeHash
Amount Per Share: 0.0055 NXT
Height: 398372


A total of 2528.284 NXT wasl be distributed among 19 accounts which own a total of 459'688 shares.

Busy coding.....
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: printshop on April 12, 2015, 02:18:18 pm
Date: 12/04/2015 23:17:11
Transaction ID: 8090278002497176554
Type:   Dividend Payment
Asset Name: SafeHash
Amount Per Share: 0.006 NXT
Height: 402160


Another day, another dollar. Nothing spectacular happening yet.
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: lmmjvsd on April 25, 2015, 07:59:49 am
I own 1756 shares safehash , but I never touched any dividends ...
thank you to remedy to this.
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: printshop on April 25, 2015, 03:36:59 pm
I own 1756 shares safehash , but I never touched any dividends ...
thank you to remedy to this.

The issue has been discussed previously in this thread. You've received dividends, but they are not shown as transactions by the client. The client devs will be fixing the problem in due course. Until then, the block numbers I announce when I pay dividends can serve as a reliable record which anyone can check. If you own shares at the block height dividends were paid, you are guaranteed to have received your dividends.

Note: We are hiring someone to pay dividends. I'm extremely busy with my software projects right now and I'm looking to pay someone a reasonable fee for the act of paying our dividends.
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: printshop on April 29, 2015, 03:43:32 pm
Paid 0.009 per share today, transaction 1706815409180074185.

The remainder of our money has been placed into share buybacks. You're free to sell your shares if you don't like how the company is being managed.

I need to hire someone to pay dividends because I am too busy coding. Please PM me.
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: printshop on May 11, 2015, 03:41:55 am
Paid 0.005 per share today, transaction 9099536482785217783.

We've reinvested a little and are continuing to raise profits as time goes by.

0.005 per week compound interest is 29.6%/year.
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: printshop on July 05, 2015, 04:28:32 pm
Paid 0.005 per share today, transaction 9099536482785217783.

We've reinvested a little and are continuing to raise profits as time goes by.

0.005 per week compound interest is 29.6%/year.

Paid 0.0025/week for the last eight weeks. This amounts to almost all the money in the account right now.

Seeing as how the client now reports previously "invisible" dividend payments it makes sense to resume weekly payouts.

I'll also state here officially that anyone who holds DailyTrade can exchange it 1 for 1 for safehash. This represents a positive gain on your DailyTrade holdings because only SafeHash is insured. Just send your DailyTrade to the SafeHash account and I'll send back the appropriate number of shares.
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: ngdias on August 18, 2015, 08:04:14 pm
Note: We are hiring someone to pay dividends. I'm extremely busy with my software projects right now and I'm looking to pay someone a reasonable fee for the act of paying our dividends.

The fact that dividends are not payed out automatically, in a trustless manner, and that you actually have to pay (and trust) someone to do it, places any investor in a complete faith stance, because there are no legal or cryptographic guarantees that promote honesty. Isn't this a fundamental flaw that prevents real growth and makes this whole NXT Asset Exchange a curious experiment instead of a serious proposal for investment?

I see an enormous need for trust without any guarantees for this Asset Exchange and I can't imagine how a system like this can grow in the long term - which requires not having frequent scandals and scams.
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: printshop on August 19, 2015, 11:50:05 am
Note: We are hiring someone to pay dividends. I'm extremely busy with my software projects right now and I'm looking to pay someone a reasonable fee for the act of paying our dividends.

The fact that dividends are not payed out automatically, in a trustless manner, and that you actually have to pay (and trust) someone to do it, places any investor in a complete faith stance, because there are no legal or cryptographic guarantees that promote honesty. Isn't this a fundamental flaw that prevents real growth and makes this whole NXT Asset Exchange a curious experiment instead of a serious proposal for investment?

I see an enormous need for trust without any guarantees for this Asset Exchange and I can't imagine how a system like this can grow in the long term - which requires not having frequent scandals and scams.

We're the oldest investment fund in the community, everything else which was around when we started has collapsed.

We make the money we make. We're worth what we're worth -- not paying dividends doesn't mean we are worth less, it means we are worth more. The only issue is that we really like to pay dividends.

The way things have worked out over the past six months it makes sense to pay dividends monthly or even quarterly. Like in the real world.

This will change by the end of the year, I know it's been an incredibly long road, but for those of you who have invested with us, we are still here unlike many other funds, we have a plan and it's working again unlike (literally) 90% of the other funds out there.

If you want to talk trust issues, simply put we're one of about four or five issues you can trust. Everyone else is mired in outright fraud. Of course this is not a popular view but you cannot ignore the fact that we survived and many of the naysayers had to leave the community because they crashed and burned. That's just how it is.

In another 3-6 months a schpeil like this won't even be necessary because we will be rolling in it.
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: ngdias on August 21, 2015, 12:35:12 am
schpeil = speech? :)

Don't get me wrong, there are honest people out there. But this is the Internet, and one never knows when
a) a thus far trust-able person says fuckit, sells everything and disappears. Maybe he needed money to pay for his kid life or death operation, who knows?
b) the guy's computer is hacked
c) becomes sick, dies and never shows up again to manage things and there is no resolution system to pass the shop to someone else
d) everything looks fine and solid, but the guy is 5% dishonest. you know what I mean?...
e) the asset owner, who by now controls only 30% of the assets, has full control over every decision of the fund.
f) other situations I can't imagine right now

You may be successful and have a track record that inspires trust, but my point is, the asset system should have inbuilt mechanisms that make sure trust is not necessary or reduced to a minimum.
Put it this way: do you think someone with a yearly income of 30.000 whatever fiat would deposit half of their yearly savings in your fund? Until the answer is yes, the underlying safety/honesty/trust features of the Asset Exchange are not good enough.
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: ngdias on August 21, 2015, 12:36:05 am
Oh and by the way, I also got the 5 free shares. Thanks!
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: printshop on August 21, 2015, 07:46:59 am
schpeil = speech? :)

Don't get me wrong, there are honest people out there. But this is the Internet, and one never knows when
a) a thus far trust-able person says fuckit, sells everything and disappears. Maybe he needed money to pay for his kid life or death operation, who knows?
b) the guy's computer is hacked
c) becomes sick, dies and never shows up again to manage things and there is no resolution system to pass the shop to someone else
d) everything looks fine and solid, but the guy is 5% dishonest. you know what I mean?...
e) the asset owner, who by now controls only 30% of the assets, has full control over every decision of the fund.
f) other situations I can't imagine right now

You may be successful and have a track record that inspires trust, but my point is, the asset system should have inbuilt mechanisms that make sure trust is not necessary or reduced to a minimum.
Put it this way: do you think someone with a yearly income of 30.000 whatever fiat would deposit half of their yearly savings in your fund? Until the answer is yes, the underlying safety/honesty/trust features of the Asset Exchange are not good enough.

I hear you, but all of this can happen in the real world as well. This is the main reason I like to pay dividends, because no matter what else happens, paying dividends shows that your company is making money.

As for the owner owning 30%+, as long as it's legit and announced I don't see a problem. I own a lot of SafeHash and it's on the record, and that money has gone out into the holdings of SafeHash. If you are willing to put the money into a company I don't see how you shouldn't be rewarded with voting control. Which leads me to my next point.

No matter how much it hurts, never ever invest in an issue on NXT AE which does not promise ownership and control.

This one simple rule will stop you from losing money. Of course common sense applies -- anyone who invests in mars-mining robots (for example) or an investment fund that invests in investment funds, or say a company which has a track record of fraud and/or outright failure... well, whatever you invest in, don't invest in those.

Don't be fooled by "proprietary black box" talk either. Proprietary black boxes have a way of taking a set figure out of the market then establishing a very long record of mediocrity or small losses. That's how the market works. Play the IPO if you feel like gambling, or else you really only have one choice, invest into the survivors.
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: ngdias on August 21, 2015, 01:20:51 pm
I could reply to you, printshop, but I'm not sure you'd be interested in continuing this discussion AND we're hijacking the topic. I think I'll leave it as it is.
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: printshop on August 22, 2015, 04:59:02 am
I could reply to you, printshop, but I'm not sure you'd be interested in continuing this discussion AND we're hijacking the topic. I think I'll leave it as it is.

Nahh it's totally fine. Not much else going on here.

I've always said it would take 6 months to a year just to establish a basic reputation. We're coming into the tail end of that now; every call we've ever made has come out true except one (which we didn't really push on yet), and having passed through the fire of public spectacle over that is very important. In the future when we issue an investment alert and people start whining about how mean we are and how we have no right to x y z, we will have some very convincing data to back us up.

If it's taken 12 months just to get into people's heads that we aren't going to disappear overnight and that the decisions I've made have served shareholders better than what they would have done on their own, then that's great! Step by step. People need time to see how things worked out. By the end of this year I am sure a lot of our internal plans are going to come around and we will start chugging along again. These things take time to do right. As Warren Buffet said, the first rule is not to lose money.
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: garp on November 15, 2015, 02:57:02 pm

Seeing as how the client now reports previously "invisible" dividend payments it makes sense to resume weekly payouts.


Sorry to ask questions again about these dividend issues.
Can you clarify please?
Do we need  a specific version of the client to show dividends?
And is that version also showing dividends paid in the past?
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: printshop on November 16, 2015, 08:12:31 am

Seeing as how the client now reports previously "invisible" dividend payments it makes sense to resume weekly payouts.


Sorry to ask questions again about these dividend issues.
Can you clarify please?
Do we need  a specific version of the client to show dividends?
And is that version also showing dividends paid in the past?

I'm not really sure. I check in every week or so and either reinvest or pay some dividends out. If you have the latest version of the client it should show all dividends paid (other than those paid manually, which will show up as direct transfers). However all dividends are now being paid using the dividend payout feature so they will show up there.

The game plan has not changed, the school is nearing completion, and we expect to take occupancy before the end of the year. At that point KNS should start generating significant income (and we are going to get that as major shareholders).
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: shmoula on November 16, 2015, 05:45:55 pm
Dividends paid with core function should be visible in Account ledger since NRS 1.6.2, but last paid dividends date is 31/08/2015 so this transaction is not visible, because Account ledger works after some block after that date.


Seeing as how the client now reports previously "invisible" dividend payments it makes sense to resume weekly payouts.


Sorry to ask questions again about these dividend issues.
Can you clarify please?
Do we need  a specific version of the client to show dividends?
And is that version also showing dividends paid in the past?

I'm not really sure. I check in every week or so and either reinvest or pay some dividends out. If you have the latest version of the client it should show all dividends paid (other than those paid manually, which will show up as direct transfers). However all dividends are now being paid using the dividend payout feature so they will show up there.

The game plan has not changed, the school is nearing completion, and we expect to take occupancy before the end of the year. At that point KNS should start generating significant income (and we are going to get that as major shareholders).
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: printshop on December 01, 2015, 03:45:13 am
We just paid a dividend of 0.01 per share and bought back something like 20,000 shares.

More great news to come! Please share your questions and concerns...
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: printshop on February 05, 2016, 03:55:53 pm
In lieu of dividends in January and February we have issued buy orders at or above 0.99 for all outstanding shares.

This means the mistakes of the past (investing in the chain-default crap based on LTCgear) have finally been rectified.

2016 will be an interesting year for SafeHash!
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: shmoula on February 07, 2016, 06:42:05 pm
Is this the buyout announcement? I'm confused a little bit :)
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: printshop on February 08, 2016, 02:54:38 pm
Is this the buyout announcement? I'm confused a little bit :)

Someone has been on the ask for quite some time on SafeHash and BearMining. They've just been bought out of SafeHash, which I did instead of paying proper dividends. The basic idea is that most of SafeHash is privately held and those shareholders wanted the other party bought out before coming up with a payout ratio for 2016.

A payout of 0.022 per month (2.2%/month) will represent ~30% APY at a payout ratio of, we estimate, 80%...

I may take this down to 55% or so (say 0.004/wk) and go on a buying spree. I'd like to grow the fund a bit more this year and there looks like maybe one or two good opportunities in crypto space right now.

I was toying with having KNS just buy out the entirety of SafeHash but SafeHash is really a different animal than KNS. KNS represents something else I'd like to keep compartmentalized for now (the esl/print-shop side of what I am doing). SafeHash is just an investment fund.
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: JanSako on March 08, 2016, 04:19:10 pm
Hi Printshop,

Any news? haven't seen the divs for Feb go through, or any moves from you on the market...
What was the decision about the amount of dividends for this year?

Thanks!
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: printshop on March 10, 2016, 03:06:36 pm
Hi Printshop,

Any news? haven't seen the divs for Feb go through, or any moves from you on the market...
What was the decision about the amount of dividends for this year?

Thanks!

See the message above yours ("They've just been bought out of SafeHash, which I did instead of paying proper dividends.")

Anyways despite saying earlier that I would keep SafeHash and KNS separate, the fact is that "KPS" and KNS as a result are really starting to explode. I realized today that it's worth about a million dollars.

The really big problem with the company however is that it invests into NXT, which is garbage. Unfortunately -- and no one is sadder than myself to have to say it, but it was a mistake investing into NXT companies (period). We are literally the only worthwhile investment in the community. Oh, I know, there is stuff like Coinomat. But to insinuate it reached it's full value last year and has been on the decline ever since is tantamount to saying that NXT is over.

The basic aspect here is that it may be time to buy out the whole company after all. If so, I won't be doing investors any favors this time. People will get what they put in plus dividends. I'll be honest I am making $2k a week on this and frankly NXT is a bit of a joke. Even if we had the investment of some of james' overhyped crap it still wouldn't make sense to deal in NXT. That really does make me sad. NXT really was technologically more advanced than BTC. But in the end greed and corruption destroyed it.

Well, divs for March should go thru on both companies, I'm making the transfer to Quadriga next week.
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: JanSako on March 10, 2016, 07:51:00 pm
There really is no need to deal with NXT for you any more. Lots of assets moved on to a BTC payout (SuperBTC I guess).

I am sure you noticed NXT-47L4-3ZFH-VP8P-2EA84 was pretty much the only one besides your subsidiaries that made any purchases or Safehash since oh.. last September or so. That is me. Not a whole lot, admittedly, just what I can afford to lose.

Look, I know we have to be realistic here, and in the end you can do whatever you want to do, of course. And you have worked your behind off for the last 1,5 years you were working on the school.

I am calling you out on the 'shareholders first' attitude you have been showing until now. I just hope it did not mean 'the most important shareholders only', meaning yourself.


Now the hard part...

This: "People will get what they put in plus dividends." is what you meant with these statements of yours:

"we aren't going to disappear overnight and that the decisions I've made have served shareholders better than what they would have done on their own"

"we have a plan and it's working"

"In another 3-6 months a schpeil like this won't even be necessary because we will be rolling in it."

If you are making $2000/week 'from this', guess you are kinda rolling in it...

I know pretty much everyone else sold out already, may be just you and me here :-).  How do you reconcile your 'shareholders own the company' principle with the 'buyout offer' you just made? Not really sure if it was a buyout offer, I only saw you state that KNS is worth $1 million.

$1 000 000/about 61 000 shares not on the asset issuer account = $16.40 or so per share, or 1906 NXT/share (buybuybuy! ...or not...)

How much are you planning to offer for a share? Are you planning to turn both Safehash and KNS into private/closed company? (that seems like a given)

Thank you!

JS

Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: whatnxt on March 11, 2016, 01:07:50 pm
There really is no need to deal with NXT for you any more. Lots of assets moved on to a BTC payout (SuperBTC I guess).

SuperBTC is the issue or the point depending on where you stand. NXT has become the transaction fee for moving other assets about and so, to be successful, its value has to be less than the value for moving the asset using any other technique. So dirt cheap...

Similarly NXT has no need for centralized exchanges any more. Its value is in its utility and you can always buy it in exchange for an asset you have brought into the ecosystem.


So why not move to SuperBTC payments watch the centralized exchanges die and be happy that NXT is cheap as chips.

It does means that:
- the only NXT you want hanging around is for transactions not for trading.
- a business should have its own block chain with assets that are compatible with supernet. I think that's where Coinomat is heading.
which is the logical way to go anyway, after all a Business has value but its value does not have to be measured using NXT as an intermediary. You should be able to trade a Businesses asset for any asset you like.
 
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: printshop on March 29, 2016, 01:44:16 am
There really is no need to deal with NXT for you any more. Lots of assets moved on to a BTC payout (SuperBTC I guess).

I am sure you noticed NXT-47L4-3ZFH-VP8P-2EA84 was pretty much the only one besides your subsidiaries that made any purchases or Safehash since oh.. last September or so. That is me. Not a whole lot, admittedly, just what I can afford to lose.

Look, I know we have to be realistic here, and in the end you can do whatever you want to do, of course. And you have worked your behind off for the last 1,5 years you were working on the school.

Interesting, I was thinking of moving into BTC. But no I wasn't aware of that. Anyways thanks for the validation lol, it's appreciated, I am grateful.

I am calling you out on the 'shareholders first' attitude you have been showing until now. I just hope it did not mean 'the most important shareholders only', meaning yourself.


Now the hard part...

This: "People will get what they put in plus dividends." is what you meant with these statements of yours:

"we aren't going to disappear overnight and that the decisions I've made have served shareholders better than what they would have done on their own"

"we have a plan and it's working"

"In another 3-6 months a schpeil like this won't even be necessary because we will be rolling in it."

If you are making $2000/week 'from this', guess you are kinda rolling in it...

I know pretty much everyone else sold out already, may be just you and me here :-).  How do you reconcile your 'shareholders own the company' principle with the 'buyout offer' you just made? Not really sure if it was a buyout offer, I only saw you state that KNS is worth $1 million.

$1 000 000/about 61 000 shares not on the asset issuer account = $16.40 or so per share, or 1906 NXT/share (buybuybuy! ...or not...)

How much are you planning to offer for a share? Are you planning to turn both Safehash and KNS into private/closed company? (that seems like a given)

Thank you!

Regarding KNS-- KNS is a failed IPO. The assets are a $500,000 property. The income is $2k/week. After I pay myself there is a lot left over, some of which goes towards paying dividends and making acquisitions in NXT and other. So why isn't KNS paying 100s of NXT in dividends per week? Simple. There are 60,996 outstanding shares of KNS out of 10 million on IPO. So that's a half of one percent. I don't have to tell you that's worth about fifty bucks a month in dividends. That's the reality of KNS. It is an unstoppable force which will never go away however -- mysteriously -- no one wants to buy it. That's actually fine. KNS exists in the real world with 99.95 of it's assets. If NXT wants a kick in the pants then let's move that up to 1%. Let's see some toy investment. The weekly purchases as we move serious money into NXT each week would probably be enough to kick us back up to 0.00005. Not a joke.

SafeHash. SafeHash is worth 1 NXT. It always has been and always will. SafeHash operates on a different principle than KNS. SafeHash HAS to make money from it's investments or it can't pay out and merely re-purchase itself out of it's profits. This is why I bought so heavily into KNS with SafeHash -- because I knew that it would essentially guarantee the fund. My hidden trick with safehash was to increase the cashflow so that if we had any kind of failure in an asset (like SATOSHI) we could just eat the loss. And that over time we will have eventually made enough cash to just float the entire asset on the buy side. My idea was that such large buy orders would increase confidence in the asset. The worst possible thing occurred. Every other asset failed and was dumped. Including SafeHash. But because of my guarantee people didn't "dump it" they just put up ask orders for 0.9 to 1 NXT (lol).

Okay so you see the pathetic market action we had, right? It took us soooo long to buy out everyone who was dumping shares. But we did it out of profits. Right now we are so hyperleveraged it's funny. Imagine if someone just went and bought 300,000 shares of SafeHash. Well we already have the cashflow to support divs on that. So right now we are about to explode in terms of acquisitions. It's the old safehash dream coming true. Either people buy in and we get millions of NXT, or the fund doubles down on itself and we get millions of NXT. It sounds kooky, but a year and a half on it's working. I wonder how long it will take everyone else to figure out.

I'm sorry for flipping my lid last month and talking about shutting it down. The truth is though that the underlying business has changed. There is no such thing as profitable mining now (compared to services). Services which take a % are the new thing in crypto. You could see it coming as new "pro" exchanges like Quadriga came online and the old shitty exchanges died out. Then more and more services came, like coinbase, and so forth, even as the shitty services like bitbet died a hard death.

But I ramble. SafeHash is worth 1, always has been, always will. A "buyout" means I put up 1 NXT per outstanding share and walk away. It's not like anyone is losing money. Well, I would make an annoucnement. I'd probably send NXT mail to every shareholder to make sure they knew what was going on. I'm not out to fool anyone or rip anyone off. But you can be assured that it's literally impossible to lose money in SafeHash now. The question is whether I want to keep SafeHash going as-is and just let itself buy itself out (the original plan) or just shut it down. But shutting it down does not mean taking anyone's money. It's "youse guys" money not mine. Don't worry about that :p

Beyond all this, the main issue is $ and time. Not much money over a long time period. So I don't come here anymore. Just enough to announce that $50 a month in divs. I'd love for that to change, maybe one day it will, but really I can't be expected to work 10-20 hrs a week for years with no real payout. NXT has gotten a lot smaller and I don't see it growing anymore. If the community was growing that would be a different story. I would be here to push it and help it grow. But I'm sad to say it's stagnating. NXT used to be like #4 or so now it isnt even in the top 10 in crypto. IIRC it isn't even in the top 20. Now, if I wanted to, I could probably kick it up a few notches. But why. For what. No one's here.
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: printshop on March 29, 2016, 01:51:06 am
Transaction 2318793242898610475 Info
Type: Dividend Payment
Asset: 14777906162204143382
Asset Name: SafeHash
Amount Per Share:  0.01 NXT
Height: 715540
Sender: You


Paid for March 2016.
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: printshop on March 29, 2016, 01:54:54 am
April divs will be paid next weekend.
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: devlux on April 04, 2016, 12:17:34 am
April divs will be paid next weekend.

Probably too late for dividends, but I bought some, just an FYI.  Keep up the hard work.
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: printshop on April 07, 2016, 07:56:19 pm
April divs will be paid next weekend.

Probably too late for dividends, but I bought some, just an FYI.  Keep up the hard work.

Case in point. It slipped my mind as there was no reminder. I should have stuck a post-it note to my screen :/

I'll take a look at it in the morning...
Title: Re: SafeHash
Post by: printshop on April 22, 2016, 05:09:50 am
Transaction 5631899701380994066 Info
Type: Dividend Payment
Asset: 14777906162204143382
Asset Name: SafeHash
Amount Per Share:  0.01 NXT
Height: 750194
Sender: You


Paid for April 2016.
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