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"Know-how" for sale: SAFE instant betting a-la SatoshiDice
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Author Topic: "Know-how" for sale: SAFE instant betting a-la SatoshiDice  (Read 8710 times)

Come-from-Beyond

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"Know-how" for sale: SAFE instant betting a-la SatoshiDice
« on: August 23, 2014, 06:00:05 pm »

Veterans should remember SatoshiDice. That service became incredibly popular (and profitable) and earned millions of dollars to its owner. Later SatoshiDice lost popularity coz switched from unconfirmed to confirmed transactions (coz unconfirmed ones r not safe and allow to game the system).

Naive replication of SatoshiDice on top of Nxt is vulnerable to the same attacks, and even more vulnerable coz next forger can make a bet and if he loses he can include into the block another transaction that will cancel the bet (by sending all the coins to another account).

I seem to find a scheme that makes it completely safe to accept unconfirmed bets in Nxt. If someone ran old-style SatoshiDice he would get a good opportunity to earn money and Nxt forgers would get much more fees. Also we would see more people using Nxt.

I'm thinking of selling the scheme of how to become a millionaire via auction. I'm not 100% sure that the scheme is bullet-proof, a peer review is required, but I can't do it for an obvious reason. So, I propose to do the auction and after that if the scheme doesn't provide safety I'll return the money.

The rules of the auction:

1. The bids must start from 100'000 NXT
2. Increment must be not less than 5'000 NXT
3. The auction ends on the 1st of September 2014 at 23:00 UTC

PS: If u win the auction u should find someone to write the code, I'll provide free consulting service. A website is not required, blockchain and Nxt network is enough for this scheme to work. The collected money will be used for development of client part of the decentralized forum software I'm working on, so by taking part in the auction u help the cryptoanarchy movement.
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box1413

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Re: "Know-how" for sale: SAFE instant betting a-la SatoshiDice
« Reply #1 on: August 23, 2014, 06:08:17 pm »

it would be interesting if someone revived a just-dice clone but using nxt as the platform. for those that don't know just-dice was the first bitcoin betting website where the bank roll was owned by regular users of the site. any winnings from the site would be distributed to the investors. i'd imagine this can be linked with the AE some how. since just-dice was based in canada, it got shut down due to the fact the owner was easily tracked. He received a C&D letter from the government and had to shut it down.
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jl777

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Re: "Know-how" for sale: SAFE instant betting a-la SatoshiDice
« Reply #2 on: August 23, 2014, 06:23:41 pm »

I bid 100,000 NXT
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Come-from-Beyond

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Re: "Know-how" for sale: SAFE instant betting a-la SatoshiDice
« Reply #3 on: August 23, 2014, 06:56:00 pm »

it would be interesting if someone revived a just-dice clone but using nxt as the platform. for those that don't know just-dice was the first bitcoin betting website where the bank roll was owned by regular users of the site. any winnings from the site would be distributed to the investors. i'd imagine this can be linked with the AE some how. since just-dice was based in canada, it got shut down due to the fact the owner was easily tracked. He received a C&D letter from the government and had to shut it down.

Aye, this is a good idea, but it's too late. U should have posted this before I announced the auction. :)
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Come-from-Beyond

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Re: "Know-how" for sale: SAFE instant betting a-la SatoshiDice
« Reply #4 on: August 23, 2014, 07:07:34 pm »

I bid 100,000 NXT

Which asset will pay the dividends of the gambling service if u win the auction?
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bitcoinpaul

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Re: "Know-how" for sale: SAFE instant betting a-la SatoshiDice
« Reply #5 on: August 23, 2014, 07:08:34 pm »

I bid 100,000 NXT

Which asset will pay the dividends of the gambling service if u win the auction?

 ;D
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jl777

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Re: "Know-how" for sale: SAFE instant betting a-la SatoshiDice
« Reply #6 on: August 23, 2014, 07:23:12 pm »

I bid 100,000 NXT

Which asset will pay the dividends of the gambling service if u win the auction?

I like to keep functionality matching the basic asset category, so this is something that is in domain of Privatebet
I know it is not peer to peer, but Privatebet is where I will put any gambling type of thing, so if ever I add poker, or casino stuff, it will go into Privatebet
wont have time for it until next year, but other than bringing real world tradings to NXT, I dont have much on my schedule for next year yet

James
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Come-from-Beyond

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Re: "Know-how" for sale: SAFE instant betting a-la SatoshiDice
« Reply #7 on: August 23, 2014, 07:40:31 pm »

I know it is not peer to peer, but Privatebet is where I will put any gambling type of thing, so if ever I add poker, or casino stuff, it will go into Privatebet
wont have time for it until next year, but other than bringing real world tradings to NXT, I dont have much on my schedule for next year yet

This phrase is too complicated for me. Just answer - should I buy Privatebet shares right after the auction ends or wait till the next year?
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jl777

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Re: "Know-how" for sale: SAFE instant betting a-la SatoshiDice
« Reply #8 on: August 23, 2014, 08:03:54 pm »

I know it is not peer to peer, but Privatebet is where I will put any gambling type of thing, so if ever I add poker, or casino stuff, it will go into Privatebet
wont have time for it until next year, but other than bringing real world tradings to NXT, I dont have much on my schedule for next year yet

This phrase is too complicated for me. Just answer - should I buy Privatebet shares right after the auction ends or wait till the next year?
market timing is complicated game. there is still a lot of inventory available, but as soon as it is gone then it will trade freely on AE. Not sure when this will happen, and typically my issues start trading above the initial price. I like it for people to buy the assets to be making money so I set the price below my estimate of free market price.

Maybe right after auction ends, maybe next year, maybe before auction ends. Who knows?

so I guess it would make sense to monitor availability of the Privatebet assets if I win the auction and grab some before they are sold out

James

P.S. will the implementation require core change or can I do this in NXTservices?
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jl777

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Re: "Know-how" for sale: SAFE instant betting a-la SatoshiDice
« Reply #9 on: August 23, 2014, 08:05:32 pm »

Can I add some Privatebet assets to the bid?
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Come-from-Beyond

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Re: "Know-how" for sale: SAFE instant betting a-la SatoshiDice
« Reply #10 on: August 23, 2014, 08:09:09 pm »

P.S. will the implementation require core change or can I do this in NXTservices?

No changes in Nxt core required, already existing Nxt API is enough. I dunno what NXTservices provide.
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Come-from-Beyond

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Re: "Know-how" for sale: SAFE instant betting a-la SatoshiDice
« Reply #11 on: August 23, 2014, 08:12:02 pm »

Can I add some Privatebet assets to the bid?

I can't change terms of the auction. Also, I'll need to convert the amount into paper dollars to pay for the work.
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jl777

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Re: "Know-how" for sale: SAFE instant betting a-la SatoshiDice
« Reply #12 on: August 23, 2014, 08:27:06 pm »

P.S. will the implementation require core change or can I do this in NXTservices?

No changes in Nxt core required, already existing Nxt API is enough. I dunno what NXTservices provide.
perfect. NXTservices is just a bunch of C code I threw together
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hash

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Re: "Know-how" for sale: SAFE instant betting a-la SatoshiDice
« Reply #13 on: August 24, 2014, 01:13:56 pm »

Bidding 105,000 NXT

msin

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Re: "Know-how" for sale: SAFE instant betting a-la SatoshiDice
« Reply #14 on: August 25, 2014, 03:32:55 am »

Later SatoshiDice lost popularity coz switched from unconfirmed to confirmed transactions (coz unconfirmed ones r not safe and allow to game the system).

Are you saying that it lost popularity because people could no longer game the system?
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Come-from-Beyond

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Re: "Know-how" for sale: SAFE instant betting a-la SatoshiDice
« Reply #15 on: August 25, 2014, 06:51:37 am »

Are you saying that it lost popularity because people could no longer game the system?

No, it lost popularity coz we have to wait 10 min between bets.

In case of Nxt this would be 2 mins (one confirmation is not reliable at all coz of Cunicula attack).
« Last Edit: August 25, 2014, 06:57:04 am by Come-from-Beyond »
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msin

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Re: "Know-how" for sale: SAFE instant betting a-la SatoshiDice
« Reply #16 on: August 25, 2014, 12:51:30 pm »

Are you saying that it lost popularity because people could no longer game the system?

No, it lost popularity coz we have to wait 10 min between bets.

In case of Nxt this would be 2 mins (one confirmation is not reliable at all coz of Cunicula attack).

To be clear, your solution would allow 2 minute bet times?  Could the solution also be applied to regular transactions?
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Come-from-Beyond

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Re: "Know-how" for sale: SAFE instant betting a-la SatoshiDice
« Reply #17 on: August 25, 2014, 01:02:39 pm »

To be clear, your solution would allow 2 minute bet times?  Could the solution also be applied to regular transactions?

My solution will allow 3-second* bet times. It can't be applied to regular transactions.


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* - subject to ping time
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bitcoinpaul

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Re: "Know-how" for sale: SAFE instant betting a-la SatoshiDice
« Reply #18 on: August 25, 2014, 01:10:46 pm »

To be clear, your solution would allow 2 minute bet times?  Could the solution also be applied to regular transactions?

My solution will allow 3-second* bet times. It can't be applied to regular transactions.


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* - subject to ping time

HODL!

edit: nothing to hodl. BUY!
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msin

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Re: "Know-how" for sale: SAFE instant betting a-la SatoshiDice
« Reply #19 on: August 25, 2014, 03:21:10 pm »

To be clear, your solution would allow 2 minute bet times?  Could the solution also be applied to regular transactions?

My solution will allow 3-second* bet times. It can't be applied to regular transactions.


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* - subject to ping time

Got it, the 2min you were referring to would be a normal Nxt confirmation time.  3 seconds would be very favorable to old school Satoshi Dice players.
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