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New Community Funds Committee (CFC) members Self-Nomination Thread
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gs02xzz

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Re: New Community Funds Committee (CFC) members Self-Nomination Thread
« Reply #20 on: December 17, 2014, 07:16:05 pm »

I am tempted to go along with the proposal that Berzerk made a while back to fund the Org and Foundation, but: it's not up to me.
It's up to you guys to counterpropose now.

It seems that this is a good option now. What we need is the responsible and proactive stewards like NxtOrg and NxtFound to manage and spend those funds for the growth of Nxt and these two groups are the best so far.

All I can suggest is that future stewards set it as the highest priority to make a budget plan to pay the core devs in the long run, to make the spending transparent and predictive (having plans), and to allow the Nxt/forum users to debate on large spending.
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ChuckOne

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Re: New Community Funds Committee (CFC) members Self-Nomination Thread
« Reply #21 on: December 17, 2014, 08:00:59 pm »

So, thread up for 14 days and we have 3 nominations.

Even though I tend to be a very optimistic person, I would like to chalk this one up as a dysmal failure.

So, we are stuck with three committees who are dormant (bar a few active members who I *know* have been working their proverbial asses off to get things done), about 6 million Nxt that is not being made active and no truly democratic way out of this.

OK, it is as it is, as they say.

Most people wánt change, but it seems no-one wants/can/feels compelled to step up and take the responsibility.

I am tempted to go along with the proposal that Berzerk made a while back to fund the Org and Foundation, but: it's not up to me.
It's up to you guys to counterpropose now.

We've put work into this, but apparently the plan doesn't resonate enough to have any support.

So: where do we go from here? I refuse to believe we want those funds nót to go to useful stuff...

I say 8 people are too much.

What is missing so far?
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LocoMB

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Re: New Community Funds Committee (CFC) members Self-Nomination Thread
« Reply #22 on: December 17, 2014, 08:32:33 pm »


I have been doing quite some work on the committee and I would be willing to continue to do so,
but I am not sure if I can make a 100% committment on time beyond a certain minimum per week...
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domsch

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Re: New Community Funds Committee (CFC) members Self-Nomination Thread
« Reply #23 on: December 17, 2014, 10:17:35 pm »

I vote for a split of 50/50 between the Nxt Foundation and Nxt Organization. Both have put in great effort into the development and growth of Nxt and with additional funds they can definitely do more than the committees can do right now.
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EvilDave

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Re: New Community Funds Committee (CFC) members Self-Nomination Thread
« Reply #24 on: December 17, 2014, 11:05:54 pm »

Hmmmm.......I have an idea, it's a fairly quick and dirty solution, but lets see what you lot think:

The Community funds should be in use, to some extent, but never forget that we have devs to pay. That is priority #1, no arguments possible. Even in its current state, with NXT at a very annoying low.....it's still a big chunk of cash that can guarantee dev salaries for another year.  But it would be good to be able to spend a little bit on marketing or other projects.......
I do not want to split the funds between Nxt Foundation and Nxt Org: neither group is representative of the complete NXT community.
(and Nxt Foundation is full of dodgy bastards, tbh  ;D )

So, we currently have 4 volunteers for the CFC:

FuManchu88   Commercial #1
jones             Technical #1
Dom P            Treasurer #1
ChuckOne       Technical #2

So we need 4 more:
Treasurer #2 , Commercial #2, Chairman and a Secretary........

I'm willing to be Chairman Dave, in the sense of organising and shouting a bit, but that's it. You want leadership, look elsewhere.
As far as I remember, neer.g and Pouncer are the Marketing and TechDev treasurers. Maybe one or both will be happy to continue to hold and disburse the community funds? Treasurer #2/3
Cassius would make a good Secretary, and Damelon a good Commercial #2.

I know it is very cheeky of me to propose these guys for the CFC, but we do need to get a working structure together for the Community Funds sooner rather than later.

Objections ? Lets hear them......

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jl777

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Re: New Community Funds Committee (CFC) members Self-Nomination Thread
« Reply #25 on: December 17, 2014, 11:15:50 pm »

Hmmmm.......I have an idea, it's a fairly quick and dirty solution, but lets see what you lot think:

The Community funds should be in use, to some extent, but never forget that we have devs to pay. That is priority #1, no arguments possible. Even in its current state, with NXT at a very annoying low.....it's still a big chunk of cash that can guarantee dev salaries for another year.  But it would be good to be able to spend a little bit on marketing or other projects.......
I do not want to split the funds between Nxt Foundation and Nxt Org: neither group is representative of the complete NXT community.
(and Nxt Foundation is full of dodgy bastards, tbh  ;D )

So, we currently have 4 volunteers for the CFC:

FuManchu88   Commercial #1
jones             Technical #1
Dom P            Treasurer #1
ChuckOne       Technical #2

So we need 4 more:
Treasurer #2 , Commercial #2, Chairman and a Secretary........

I'm willing to be Chairman Dave, in the sense of organising and shouting a bit, but that's it. You want leadership, look elsewhere.
As far as I remember, neer.g and Pouncer are the Marketing and TechDev treasurers. Maybe one or both will be happy to continue to hold and disburse the community funds? Treasurer #2/3
Cassius would make a good Secretary, and Damelon a good Commercial #2.

I know it is very cheeky of me to propose these guys for the CFC, but we do need to get a working structure together for the Community Funds sooner rather than later.

Objections ? Lets hear them......
why not just use the funds for the NXT core devs?
That will create lasting value that benefits all of NXT

James
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EvilDave

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Re: New Community Funds Committee (CFC) members Self-Nomination Thread
« Reply #26 on: December 17, 2014, 11:27:00 pm »

I'd like to see at least 50% of the CF safely locked away to cover dev salaries for the next few months, with a smaller amount to be used on marketing and general expenses.
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Re: New Community Funds Committee (CFC) members Self-Nomination Thread
« Reply #27 on: December 17, 2014, 11:32:49 pm »

So, we currently have 4 volunteers for the CFC:

FuManchu88   Commercial #1
jones             Technical #1
Dom P            Treasurer #1
ChuckOne       Technical #2

So we need 4 more:
Treasurer #2 , Commercial #2, Chairman and a Secretary........
I think you missed the offer I made on behalf of CFA Consulting, for Treasurer.
Not that I want to be so, but it's an open offer for votes is several people are up to the task.

why not just use the funds for the NXT core devs?
That will create lasting value that benefits all of NXT

All the funds?
I have to say that development is about 20-30% of a product.
Marketing, communication, organization, etc. make up for the rest.

There have been so many great products that went to waste in history because they were just not sold...
Let's not do that with Nxt and save a bit for that part too.
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Pouncer

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Re: New Community Funds Committee (CFC) members Self-Nomination Thread
« Reply #28 on: December 17, 2014, 11:42:20 pm »

If there is not enough treasurers, I'll be happy to continue.
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valarmg

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Re: New Community Funds Committee (CFC) members Self-Nomination Thread
« Reply #29 on: December 17, 2014, 11:43:45 pm »


So, we currently have 4 volunteers for the CFC:

FuManchu88   Commercial #1
jones             Technical #1
Dom P            Treasurer #1
ChuckOne       Technical #2

So we need 4 more:
Treasurer #2 , Commercial #2, Chairman and a Secretary........

I'm willing to be Chairman Dave, in the sense of organising and shouting a bit, but that's it. You want leadership, look elsewhere.
As far as I remember, neer.g and Pouncer are the Marketing and TechDev treasurers. Maybe one or both will be happy to continue to hold and disburse the community funds? Treasurer #2/3
Cassius would make a good Secretary, and Damelon a good Commercial #2.

I know it is very cheeky of me to propose these guys for the CFC, but we do need to get a working structure together for the Community Funds sooner rather than later.



Perhaps a one or two of the NxtOrg guys will volunteer as well. And maybe jl777 would reconsider the withdrawal of his nomination. They are all good candiates but it would certainly better to have some voting. Could also consider reducing the number of members as Chuck suggested.
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jl777

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Re: New Community Funds Committee (CFC) members Self-Nomination Thread
« Reply #30 on: December 17, 2014, 11:49:24 pm »

So, we currently have 4 volunteers for the CFC:

FuManchu88   Commercial #1
jones             Technical #1
Dom P            Treasurer #1
ChuckOne       Technical #2

So we need 4 more:
Treasurer #2 , Commercial #2, Chairman and a Secretary........
I think you missed the offer I made on behalf of CFA Consulting, for Treasurer.
Not that I want to be so, but it's an open offer for votes is several people are up to the task.

why not just use the funds for the NXT core devs?
That will create lasting value that benefits all of NXT

All the funds?
I have to say that development is about 20-30% of a product.
Marketing, communication, organization, etc. make up for the rest.

There have been so many great products that went to waste in history because they were just not sold...
Let's not do that with Nxt and save a bit for that part too.
But isnt NXT a platform?
NXT itself is not a product, or did I miss the change from open source platform to being a product?

So, assuming that it is a platform, then funds for it should be spent to develop the platform. The projects built on this platform would then have a more product oriented approach and different projects can allocate 1% to 100% on tech as they see fit.

So, if NXT is a platform like the internet is a platform, then what good is having the IP protocol running marketing campaigns? The products built on NXT should be running the campaigns.

Since I was disqualified from this committee due to my involvement in the various NXT oriented projects making it impossible for me to not have some relation to anything funded in NXT. Now these new organizations are fine, I have nothing against them, but there are some in these organizations that are using newbie handles. So how are others to know what other projects they are associated with? Especially if there are projects which also have newbie handles associated with them.

If it is a problem that I might influence my decisions based on personal financial interests, then that standard should be applied to all. But this creates some unsolvable issues...

Hence I strongly suggest 100% to NXT core devs and you can make whatever committees to manage what devs get what. Or maybe CfB's idea of sending to genesis wasnt so bad after all. The last thing I wanted when I rescued these funds from being burned was it to become a source of contention.

Some might argue the wisdom of 100% to NXT core devs, but I think we can all agree that this is a pure solution. It wont make everybody happy, but nothing will. And at least we will get more tech for the projects that build on the NXT platform

James
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jl777

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Re: New Community Funds Committee (CFC) members Self-Nomination Thread
« Reply #31 on: December 17, 2014, 11:52:25 pm »


So, we currently have 4 volunteers for the CFC:

FuManchu88   Commercial #1
jones             Technical #1
Dom P            Treasurer #1
ChuckOne       Technical #2

So we need 4 more:
Treasurer #2 , Commercial #2, Chairman and a Secretary........

I'm willing to be Chairman Dave, in the sense of organising and shouting a bit, but that's it. You want leadership, look elsewhere.
As far as I remember, neer.g and Pouncer are the Marketing and TechDev treasurers. Maybe one or both will be happy to continue to hold and disburse the community funds? Treasurer #2/3
Cassius would make a good Secretary, and Damelon a good Commercial #2.

I know it is very cheeky of me to propose these guys for the CFC, but we do need to get a working structure together for the Community Funds sooner rather than later.



Perhaps a one or two of the NxtOrg guys will volunteer as well. And maybe jl777 would reconsider the withdrawal of his nomination. They are all good candiates but it would certainly better to have some voting. Could also consider reducing the number of members as Chuck suggested.
A rule was made that disqualified me, cuz I am sure to bias my decisions for my personal gain, unlike the others that are using newbie accounts and are proposing to just be given millions of community funds to do with as they see fit. And we can be sure they are not like me and will never let their financial interests affect their decisions,not that we can even tell since newbie accounts are being used for many things

James
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valarmg

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Re: New Community Funds Committee (CFC) members Self-Nomination Thread
« Reply #32 on: December 17, 2014, 11:54:25 pm »


A rule was made that disqualified me, cuz I am sure to bias my decisions for my personal gain, unlike the others that are using newbie accounts and are proposing to just be given millions of community funds to do with as they see fit. And we can be sure they are not like me and will never let their financial interests affect their decisions,not that we can even tell since newbie accounts are being used for many things

James

That rule was later retracted on the basis that everyone has some interest in various Nxt projects.
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jl777

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Re: New Community Funds Committee (CFC) members Self-Nomination Thread
« Reply #33 on: December 17, 2014, 11:55:44 pm »

Lets just pay for some seconds at a SuperBowl ad, that will be great marketing for a technical platform
Might as well just buy chocolates and give it to the poor starving children in Africa

The AE changes everything and now with MS, even more ways to raise funds. Worthy projects have no problems in raising funds and said funds can be used to market, etc.

NXT is a platform. platforms dont need retail advertising

James
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jl777

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Re: New Community Funds Committee (CFC) members Self-Nomination Thread
« Reply #34 on: December 17, 2014, 11:56:39 pm »


A rule was made that disqualified me, cuz I am sure to bias my decisions for my personal gain, unlike the others that are using newbie accounts and are proposing to just be given millions of community funds to do with as they see fit. And we can be sure they are not like me and will never let their financial interests affect their decisions,not that we can even tell since newbie accounts are being used for many things

James

That rule was later retracted on the basis that everyone has some interest in various Nxt projects.
I was never notified. been a bit busy recently
Then I reinstate my candidateship and I advocate 100% to NXT core devs and 0% to SuperBowl ads or chocolates

James
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valarmg

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Re: New Community Funds Committee (CFC) members Self-Nomination Thread
« Reply #35 on: December 17, 2014, 11:57:52 pm »

This was where the conflict of interest idea was readdressed (from OP).

Quote
I know I have brought up the voting issue when having a conflict of interest, but I also realise that this may well hamstring the committee before even starting, because we ALL have conflicts of interest. I propose to make this more of a guideline and up to the committee to decide. It's not up to me, anyway ;)
Our community is simply too small at this point to make this a breaking issue, I think.
« Last Edit: December 18, 2014, 12:00:35 am by valarmg »
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valarmg

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Re: New Community Funds Committee (CFC) members Self-Nomination Thread
« Reply #36 on: December 18, 2014, 12:06:23 am »

And Nxt is certainly more than an open source platform. It has a marketcap, it's used as a currency. If Ethereum or BTC or Bitshares or Counterparty spend money on marketing, and Nxt doesn't, Nxt will be at a disadvantage. There's no point spending all the money on the technology and then find out that everyone is using something else.
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jl777

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Re: New Community Funds Committee (CFC) members Self-Nomination Thread
« Reply #37 on: December 18, 2014, 12:11:56 am »

And Nxt is certainly more than an open source platform. It has a marketcap, it's used as a currency. If Ethereum or BTC or Bitshares or Counterparty spend money on marketing, and Nxt doesn't, Nxt will be at a disadvantage. There's no point spending all the money on the technology and then find out that everyone is using something else.
consider me the counterbalance to the marketing extremists that want to spend 10% on tech and 90% on marketing
it is a committee, does that mean we all need to have the exact same views on things?

James
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Re: New Community Funds Committee (CFC) members Self-Nomination Thread
« Reply #38 on: December 18, 2014, 12:16:16 am »

And Nxt is certainly more than an open source platform. It has a marketcap, it's used as a currency. If Ethereum or BTC or Bitshares or Counterparty spend money on marketing, and Nxt doesn't, Nxt will be at a disadvantage. There's no point spending all the money on the technology and then find out that everyone is using something else.
Yep.
Look at Limux for example.
Great tech.

How many desktop running Linux? Next to nothing.
Microsoft has it all.

The only market share where Linux wins is in the web servers segment, because it's so far better on the most common needs.

Tech is great. If not marketed, it's just not used.

James: Heard of OSI? It was supposed to be the future of Networks. Then TCP/IP arrived. Not better, technically. Just sold better.
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Re: New Community Funds Committee (CFC) members Self-Nomination Thread
« Reply #39 on: December 18, 2014, 12:39:43 am »

I'd be happy to either function as either Chair or Marketing/business member.

I stress business in this part, as I share James' distaste of "just placing ads".

What is needed, in my opinion, and I have hopefully proven to be able to do that is to introduce the developed tech to business partners that can make use of it, which leads to adoption.

I am a firm believer that direct marketing to end users will stretch us too thin and is not needed.

To take a well known example: Supernet. Supernet uses Nxt and has a very clear incentive to gain user base on its own. They have made a very succesful venture that gains Nxt as a whole many more users than any direct marketing out of Nxt ever could do.

SecureAE and smartcontract.com, same story. The owners of those businesses know that they need users and they do not turn to Nxt to get them for them.

To borrow the Intel Inside analogy: it's not Intel that goes after the customers, that's up to the people manifacturing the systems. Intel's main thrust is at those manufacturers, and that is because they know that if they give them an awesome component with excellent support, they will thrive because these companies thrive.

So, a large part of the funds in my view should go at this point to sustained development and making sure that development cán be sustained.
In second place comes making sure that the tech that is created can be used as easily as possible. That means in my view having a good team of support devs (first liners) that can work directly with anyone who wants to use Nxt.
Complementary to that is the tech writers who make excellent documentation that leads to a reduced work load for all levels of development.
On top of that, it would be great to have a dedicated troupe of business contacts who can actually talk the talk to their counterparts in businesses.
As a last cornerstone I would add "marketing" in the sense of outreach, by which targeted conferences, interviews, making sure to get the word out is added.

I won't put percentages to these separate points, as circumstances change and one needs to work with the times.

I ám however convinced that both Core ánd support devs are paramount as creators and disseminators of our technology, in combination with documentation.
PR should be mainly aimed at businesses that will benefit from our tech.
Lastly, the whole structure should also need to aim at becoming self-sustaining in the future, either by getting consulting fees or sponsorship or something like that. TBD.
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