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The Return of the Colored Coins
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Author Topic: The Return of the Colored Coins  (Read 3094 times)

websioux

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The Return of the Colored Coins
« on: April 12, 2016, 09:02:16 am »

Were are the colored coins ? Hidden in asset exchange, monetary system and DGS ?

Doesn't this mean we have apps where we should have functional bricks for outsiders who could create a greater variety of specific apps ? As an app maker, you now must learn all the implementations (and all their details because every detail matter..) and then figure out if it is possible to re-orient one of them such that you can build your own original offer on top of what is available. It takes a very long time to assimilate.

Don't you think it should be time to generalize and factorize ? AE, MS and DGS could be only one implementation of the larger object whose name looks like now forgotten in the Nxt sphere, while it is a very great term: "the colored coin".

The success of Ethereum is (according to me) because the unique selling proposition offer it makes : "program it". I now remember I opted for Nxt because of this same type of offer : Colored Coins
For me, it was something you could do "whatever you want" with... But it turns out that it is only true for core java devs who get the consensus. It could be much more opened.

Since we will not have in-chain contracts, instead, we can have typical exchange mechanisms that can be tuned to the colored coin issuer preferences.
= The colored coin has his exchange mechanism as an attribute but the exchange mechanism has parameters that are decided by the issuer.

I'm not considering the client (the show case) here, only the API. The client is stuck under two opposite priorities, being simple and being a complete API implementation. It is a separate subject.

Does it make sense to someone what I'm talking about ? Does this kind of healthy re-org has been discussed. Isn't 2.0 the best time for it ?

If you want outside creativity, you must not restrain it. You must copy the Lego ingenuity.

Would you appreciate help at this architectural level ? I didn't yet tried to look at modeling most typical type of exchange mechanisms but I start to believe it is not that much.

Bonus : you ends up with childchains of colored coins, a true "fountain of rainbows" which is much sexier than childchains with AE MS and DGS.
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devlux

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Re: The Return of the Colored Coins
« Reply #1 on: April 13, 2016, 02:00:04 am »

Just a quick thought.

About this time last year, I was talking the concept of colored coins with a fellow expat.  He understood what I meant when I said colored coins after going to great lengths to explain it.  But he was quick to bring up the fact that the term has some seriously racist intonations.  While clearly unintentional, that term is still going to cause a sort of visceral reaction in a lot of people who might read about it.

It might be being a bit overly PC, but it's something to take into consideration if you to avoid alienating an entire segment of potential users.
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websioux

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Re: The Return of the Colored Coins
« Reply #2 on: April 13, 2016, 10:28:19 am »

Perhaps it can be written this way "colored coin" to limit this reaction. It is also quite a technical term, not a global marketing one, to be used for the shortening power of the metaphor with those who understand or are willing to understand it : Electromagnetic wave length / coin Id & attributes. Now it is good to know your input but I wanted to discuss the user coloring possibilities as part of the tool box more than the branding of it.



 
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Brangdon

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Re: The Return of the Colored Coins
« Reply #3 on: April 13, 2016, 07:30:24 pm »

"Coloured coins" doesn't mean much to me. I'm vaguely aware of it from Bitcoin circles, but it always seemed like a convoluted way of making Bitcoin do something it wasn't designed to do. I've seen the Asset Exchange explained as coloured coins, and to me that was making a relatively simple thing seem more complicated.
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devlux

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Re: The Return of the Colored Coins
« Reply #4 on: April 13, 2016, 11:15:19 pm »

Perhaps it can be written this way "colored coin" to limit this reaction. It is also quite a technical term, not a global marketing one, to be used for the shortening power of the metaphor with those who understand or are willing to understand it : Electromagnetic wave length / coin Id & attributes. Now it is good to know your input but I wanted to discuss the user coloring possibilities as part of the tool box more than the branding of it.

I like what you did there with the crayola effect.  Very nice!
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Riker

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Re: The Return of the Colored Coins
« Reply #5 on: April 14, 2016, 11:43:38 am »

The AE, MS and DGS has very different implementation internally.
Refactoring them all to implement a standard "Colored Coin" interface would require a complete re-write and I doubt if the result would be more flexible.

One idea I had in the past but we never got to implement was https://bitbucket.org/JeanLucPicard/nxt/issues/100/digital-goods-store-enhancement-store-as
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websioux

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Re: The Return of the Colored Coins
« Reply #6 on: April 20, 2016, 06:22:08 pm »

Riker, yes your idea turned into this direction but it was still related to "improving the app".

Yes refactoring is almost a nightmare, but you could consider doing it in parallel once you would recognize that it must be done.
For some time you end up with two ways to do the same thing. And after some times the old way can be merged in the new.

After I wrote my post I started to study, the variety of trade mechanisms. I only read few pages of a book and already learnt a lot :

- I found that our AE works as a "Limit Order Market".

- some may prefer a "walk the book" mechanism instead of transforming the order into a "limit order" when the order can not be 100% executed at the best price, this could be a transaction option, this could be set by the asset issuer (free, walk only, limit only), this could be different for buy order and sell order.
- Orders could be "Time In Force" TIF, basically limited time offers = the order autocancel after some time, asset issuer could force it or refuse that (free, TIF only, no TIF)
- Orders could be "Immediate or Cancel" IOC, asset issuer could force it or refuse that (free, IOC only, no IOC)

There was also some interesting notion regarding Dealer Markets.
Basically market that have some trading rules between issuers and dealers (kind of permissioned markets) and then dealers markets to resell to "consumers".
For some market this is a natural way : complex/expensive products/assets, and the issuer wants it this way for marketing or legal reasons. Marketing reason is that a max of buyers are in relation with a well informed dealer.

Auctions are also a big part that would deserve to be studied in detail.

The object of the market does not matter, it can be asset, services, good delivery (actually a service...), software unlocking, crypto coins. Whatever the object, any mechanism may be pertinent.
Pertinence depends on market habits, preferences and difficulties (here the market is the humans making choices.).

While reading I came up with a bunch of notion that I wrote down :
- Transfert capabilities
- Resell capabilities
- Refund
- Required confirmations
- Share Id
- Dillution (I'm quite surprised this was not planed as an option with MS, because it looks easy)

These are just my paper notes.
 
When I see this bestiary, I get the feeling that this can become a good reason for some to perfer working on a clone instead of NXT itself because you can adapt the clone for some mechanism that suit targeted business. And it does not need P2P Network knowledge nor core crypto. Only Java and SQL.

Business is all about mechanism (at least for me..) that why from a tiny option I can see a whole universe of businesses that can emerge. Like "lower price bidding for every good and service sold online" that could be a killer for freeMarket and others with only one more option (right to bid but right to sell reserved to issuer).

I can not remove this of my head anymore: a tool should be a tool, not a collection of apps that demonstrate what the tool could do if it was more a general tool.

The tool could be designed to play with 359 deg of the universe, but it is now only 60 deg.. yes 60 deg of the universe is quite a lot of space to play, especially when before NXT we were limited to earth, but we should not be satisfied too long with the groundplay because of youth reasons. And it's not because some thought that these 60 deg where the most promising one to start to explore that the big one will be found in this sector. The strength of a tool product is that hundreds or better thousands.. randomly play with it to explore every possible directions !

We will have more chance to find an earth like exoplanet with open sourcing the technique and the material to search & analyse exoplanet than to focus on the "best" telescopes only.

Anyway I can not give deadline but I think I will continue in this direction.
« Last Edit: April 22, 2016, 06:18:43 pm by websioux »
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