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MrCluster87

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Re: Nxt 2.0 Overview
« Reply #20 on: June 04, 2016, 11:50:43 pm »

the first thing that comes to my mind is hydra (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lernaean_Hydra) given the fact that one single heart (forging token) will support many heads (child chains).

then you can easily get into the asian market with well know characters that use chains as a weapon:

1) andromeda: http://saintseiya.wikia.com/wiki/Andromeda_Shun

2) kurapika: http://hunterxhunter.wikia.com/wiki/Kurapika




FNX is the transaction token (On the childchain)
1 Nxt will give you 1 FXT (Staking token, for forging/mining/staking, name is not in stone yet)

Maybe the brainstorming for new names could continue. I propose STAKES for the staking token and CHIPS for the transactional token (poker "coins" are called chips).

Yes please, but please check names against the following:

Benelux Trademarks
https://register.boip.int/bmbonline/intro/show.do
EU Trademarks
https://euipo.europa.eu/eSearch/
International Trademarks
http://www.wipo.int/madrid/en/

Remember, sometimes it isn't a problem when there is overlap, only when they clash in so called "Nice/Madrid classes": http://web2.wipo.int/classifications/nice/nicepub/en/fr/edition-20160101/taxonomy/

For instance Madrid class 36 is financial software. It should not be registered there.
Similarly Class 9 is also a danger zone, as it has to do with computer equipment and may cause clashes.
If the name is in class 4 (oils and lubricants) there is unlikely to be a problem  ;D

The aim of a rebrand is to avoid this problem, so let's make this a hunt for a good one.

My personal view is to look for something that highlights the branched structure, with a main chain and many chains hanging off, like a flail or cat-o-nine-tails.
I liked Tandem, too. It rolls off the tongue.

Let's hunt (but please in this thread to keep this one clean and on topic: https://nxtforum.org/general-discussion/new-name-ideas-of-nxt-%28easier-to-find-on-google-f-e-%29/) :)

CreativeDestruction

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Re: Nxt 2.0 Overview
« Reply #21 on: June 11, 2016, 05:09:52 pm »

the first thing that comes to my mind is hydra (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lernaean_Hydra) given the fact that one single heart (forging token) will support many heads (child chains).

then you can easily get into the asian market with well know characters that use chains as a weapon:

1) andromeda: http://saintseiya.wikia.com/wiki/Andromeda_Shun

2) kurapika: http://hunterxhunter.wikia.com/wiki/Kurapika




FNX is the transaction token (On the childchain)
1 Nxt will give you 1 FXT (Staking token, for forging/mining/staking, name is not in stone yet)

Maybe the brainstorming for new names could continue. I propose STAKES for the staking token and CHIPS for the transactional token (poker "coins" are called chips).

Yes please, but please check names against the following:

Benelux Trademarks
https://register.boip.int/bmbonline/intro/show.do
EU Trademarks
https://euipo.europa.eu/eSearch/
International Trademarks
http://www.wipo.int/madrid/en/

Remember, sometimes it isn't a problem when there is overlap, only when they clash in so called "Nice/Madrid classes": http://web2.wipo.int/classifications/nice/nicepub/en/fr/edition-20160101/taxonomy/

For instance Madrid class 36 is financial software. It should not be registered there.
Similarly Class 9 is also a danger zone, as it has to do with computer equipment and may cause clashes.
If the name is in class 4 (oils and lubricants) there is unlikely to be a problem  ;D

The aim of a rebrand is to avoid this problem, so let's make this a hunt for a good one.

My personal view is to look for something that highlights the branched structure, with a main chain and many chains hanging off, like a flail or cat-o-nine-tails.
I liked Tandem, too. It rolls off the tongue.

Let's hunt (but please in this thread to keep this one clean and on topic: https://nxtforum.org/general-discussion/new-name-ideas-of-nxt-%28easier-to-find-on-google-f-e-%29/) :)

I like it - Hydra Platform


The Hydra Kurapika chain is coming to you:


And whats about the Seto Kaiba three headed blue eyes white dragon - Its look like an hydra

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wolffang

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Re: Nxt 2.0 Overview
« Reply #22 on: June 11, 2016, 07:38:52 pm »

Cool!
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stdset

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Re: Nxt 2.0 Overview
« Reply #23 on: June 30, 2016, 02:30:46 pm »

A question:
what uses, except paying fees will the central token have?
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MrCluster87

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Re: Nxt 2.0 Overview
« Reply #24 on: June 30, 2016, 03:06:00 pm »

forging and securing other child chains.

stdset

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Re: Nxt 2.0 Overview
« Reply #25 on: June 30, 2016, 06:47:44 pm »

forging and securing other child chains.
If it's uses will be so limited, the market will probably value it very low. But security of a PoS cryptocurrency is cost of buying enough stake to outstake the honest network. I.e. cheap central token means low security.
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blackyblack1

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Re: Nxt 2.0 Overview
« Reply #26 on: July 01, 2016, 05:53:24 am »

I've got a question to Jean-Luc.
As far as I know Ardor will come shipped with FNX childchain. And I believe it will come with the source code opened.
I suppose FNX settings will be hardcoded but I believe it will be possible to modify Ardor source code to add another chilchain without breaking the consensus.
In this case someone will be able to create alternative Ardor client fully compatible with Ardor network but with tweaked chilchain settings. Eg 100% distribution to NXT holders instead of 50%, transaction fees close to zero, faster block times. This tweaked chilchain may destroy FNX chain...
What do you think about this possibility?
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stdset

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Re: Nxt 2.0 Overview
« Reply #27 on: July 01, 2016, 08:27:57 am »

Since nobody addressed concerns that I expressed in the previous post, let me make a suggestion.
Sidechains/childchains is an interesting concept. I don't know if there are any cryptos that implemented it already, even if there are some, they aren't many. It would be great to implement them in NXT. But since we are a PoS crypto, we must try to concentrate as much value in forging token as possible. There is a mechanism that allows to have sidechains and put most of value into the central token, it is two way peg. That's what Rootstock team currently develops http://www.rootstock.io/blog/sidechains-drivechains-and-rsk-2-way-peg-design
Bitcoin guys are very very smart, but they are also very slow. If NXT implements it before them that would aslo create a lot of positive publicity.
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blackyblack1

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Re: Nxt 2.0 Overview
« Reply #28 on: July 01, 2016, 08:35:10 am »

Since nobody addressed concerns that I expressed in the previous post, let me make a suggestion.
Sidechains/childchains is an interesting concept. I don't know if there are any cryptos that implemented it already, even if there are some, they aren't many. It would be great to implement them in NXT. But since we are a PoS crypto, we must try to concentrate as much value in forging token as possible. There is a mechanism that allows to have sidechains and put most of value into the central token, it is two way peg. That's what Rootstock team currently develops http://www.rootstock.io/blog/sidechains-drivechains-and-rsk-2-way-peg-design
Bitcoin guys are very very smart, but they are also very slow. If NXT implements it before them that would aslo create a lot of positive publicity.
It was discussed way too much here: https://nxtforum.org/core-development-discussion/nxt-2-0-design/
Your concerns were expressed as well.
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Jean-Luc

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Re: Nxt 2.0 Overview
« Reply #29 on: July 01, 2016, 11:48:39 am »

I suppose FNX settings will be hardcoded but I believe it will be possible to modify Ardor source code to add another chilchain without breaking the consensus.
In this case someone will be able to create alternative Ardor client fully compatible with Ardor network but with tweaked chilchain settings. Eg 100% distribution to NXT holders instead of 50%, transaction fees close to zero, faster block times. This tweaked chilchain may destroy FNX chain...
What do you think about this possibility?
It will break the consensus, as all nodes validate transactions on all chains. Once somebody tries to spend more than his account balance on the original client, using a modified client where he has 100% instead of 50%, this transaction would be rejected by those running the unmodified client.
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blackyblack1

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Re: Nxt 2.0 Overview
« Reply #30 on: July 01, 2016, 12:39:22 pm »

I suppose FNX settings will be hardcoded but I believe it will be possible to modify Ardor source code to add another chilchain without breaking the consensus.
In this case someone will be able to create alternative Ardor client fully compatible with Ardor network but with tweaked chilchain settings. Eg 100% distribution to NXT holders instead of 50%, transaction fees close to zero, faster block times. This tweaked chilchain may destroy FNX chain...
What do you think about this possibility?
It will break the consensus, as all nodes validate transactions on all chains. Once somebody tries to spend more than his account balance on the original client, using a modified client where he has 100% instead of 50%, this transaction would be rejected by those running the unmodified client.
I'm talking about running a sidechain parallel to FNX. I think the code can be modified to use it as a default sidechain instead of FNX.
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blackyblack1

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Re: Nxt 2.0 Overview
« Reply #31 on: July 01, 2016, 12:45:05 pm »

Here is a full case description:
1. 01.01.2017 you're shipping Ardor 1.0 together with default FNX sidechain.
2. 01.02.2017 I am shipping ArdorDark client with a default FNXDark sidechain.
3. ArdorDark client is fully compatible with Ardor forging nodes.
4. Making ArdorDark should not be very hard since you are making the code extensible to support multiple sidechains.
5. I start promoting ArdorDark with this motto: FNXDark is better than FNX since it has all features of FNX but 100% distribution to NXT holders.
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Jean-Luc

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Re: Nxt 2.0 Overview
« Reply #32 on: July 01, 2016, 03:08:51 pm »

Then you will get invalid chain id error, because there will be no code to create a new child chain dynamically. We start with one, or at most a few, hardcoded child chains.
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stdset

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Re: Nxt 2.0 Overview
« Reply #33 on: July 01, 2016, 03:28:41 pm »

It was discussed way too much here: https://nxtforum.org/core-development-discussion/nxt-2-0-design/
Your concerns were expressed as well.
I see that you had exactly the same concerns as me. It would be much appreciated if you save me (and probably some other people) time reading all 51 pages (I've already read 5) and provide an answer here.
« Last Edit: July 01, 2016, 03:39:15 pm by stdset »
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blackyblack1

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Re: Nxt 2.0 Overview
« Reply #34 on: July 01, 2016, 06:43:36 pm »

Then you will get invalid chain id error, because there will be no code to create a new child chain dynamically. We start with one, or at most a few, hardcoded child chains.
I see. So my idea will be like a hardfork for the network.
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blackyblack1

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Re: Nxt 2.0 Overview
« Reply #35 on: July 01, 2016, 06:47:00 pm »

It was discussed way too much here: https://nxtforum.org/core-development-discussion/nxt-2-0-design/
Your concerns were expressed as well.
I see that you had exactly the same concerns as me. It would be much appreciated if you save me (and probably some other people) time reading all 51 pages (I've already read 5) and provide an answer here.
Answer is: it may or may not happen - noone knows. Core devs just want to dive in and see what happens. We will have some time to trade Ardor as asset back and forth. So we will see if our prediction is a real issue or not before the actual network starts working.
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stdset

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Re: Nxt 2.0 Overview
« Reply #36 on: July 01, 2016, 07:34:29 pm »

It was discussed way too much here: https://nxtforum.org/core-development-discussion/nxt-2-0-design/
Your concerns were expressed as well.
I see that you had exactly the same concerns as me. It would be much appreciated if you save me (and probably some other people) time reading all 51 pages (I've already read 5) and provide an answer here.
Answer is: it may or may not happen - noone knows. Core devs just want to dive in and see what happens. We will have some time to trade Ardor as asset back and forth. So we will see if our prediction is a real issue or not before the actual network starts working.
Thanks.
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galeki

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Re: Nxt 2.0 Overview
« Reply #37 on: July 01, 2016, 11:11:57 pm »

It was discussed way too much here: https://nxtforum.org/core-development-discussion/nxt-2-0-design/
Your concerns were expressed as well.
I see that you had exactly the same concerns as me. It would be much appreciated if you save me (and probably some other people) time reading all 51 pages (I've already read 5) and provide an answer here.
Answer is: it may or may not happen - noone knows. Core devs just want to dive in and see what happens. We will have some time to trade Ardor as asset back and forth. So we will see if our prediction is a real issue or not before the actual network starts working.

So should we notice users in advance what may or may not happen? or users may treat us as like the DAO when something does happen.  ::)
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Tosch110

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Re: Nxt 2.0 Overview
« Reply #38 on: July 02, 2016, 01:29:43 am »

It was discussed way too much here: https://nxtforum.org/core-development-discussion/nxt-2-0-design/
Your concerns were expressed as well.
I see that you had exactly the same concerns as me. It would be much appreciated if you save me (and probably some other people) time reading all 51 pages (I've already read 5) and provide an answer here.
Answer is: it may or may not happen - noone knows. Core devs just want to dive in and see what happens. We will have some time to trade Ardor as asset back and forth. So we will see if our prediction is a real issue or not before the actual network starts working.

So should we notice users in advance what may or may not happen? or users may treat us as like the DAO when something does happen.  ::)

I guess this is not really comparable with the DAO. Because Ethereum uses a "turing complete programming language" for Ethereum "Smart Contracts". For me what happened to the DAO is like people writing not secure code in any programming language. And unsecure code happens alot. Usually it does not have such a big monetary influence.
The only thing weird for me is that the guy who inveneted this language helped creating the DAO code  :-\

But Nxt is different, you will get an API where you cannot do much things wrong as with your own code.

Najska

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Re: Nxt 2.0 Overview
« Reply #39 on: July 05, 2016, 01:45:51 pm »

Then you will get invalid chain id error, because there will be no code to create a new child chain dynamically. We start with one, or at most a few, hardcoded child chains.

@Jean-Luc,

Does that mean everyone won't be able to create a child chain as easy and straightforward as they create a custom token?

Thanks!
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